I didn’t want to start a bad guy thread---I really didn’t. After all, I did receive 15 of 16 of these animals.
While I don’t think this guy is a menace to society---he didn’t keep his end of a deal with me. He has completely ignored outstanding issues. When he did reply it was with no solution for me. I spent good money. Any money is good money, these days especially.
It’s kind of embarrassing to drop this kind of cash with a stranger---get burned---and then share it with everyone! I only do this for YOU.
My friends who helped me organize this package buy—in order to re-sell many---won’t let me live this down until I post what’s happened!
THERE ARE A HECK OF A LOT OF WORDS THAT FOLLOW – IN SUMMARY –
DON’T DEAL WITH BRAD ARMITAGE OF NORTH CAROLINA UNLESS IT’S IN PERSON – IF YOU MUST DEAL WITH HIM–DO IT IN PERSON.
This feedback is regarding former good guy---gone bad—on me at least.
Brad Armitage of Raleigh North Carolina—owner of Pet Paradise---Picasso Reptiles---and some bar/restaurant. He’s no longer in the reptile biz--- I should have expected this. He has made it clear that he offers no solution to our problem. He had some positive feedback here and on BP.net. That’s all I could find.
On 1/18/08 I answered an ad on KS for a package of ball pythons. The Kingsnake listing is posted in post #2 below. The seller is Brad Armitage of North Carolina.
The package included 2.7 Fire bps, 1.0 black eyed lucy bp, (2) het pied females, and dh albino pieds in the package. There are 2 email exchanges, (at the very bottom of this post “ORIGINAL EMAIL EXCHANGE”), that show Brad Armitage and I negotiated the package for Brad Armitage to keep (1) 2008 male Fire and (1) 800g female Fire bp. All the other listed animals were to be shipped to me.
It was a more money than I’ve ever spent on animals—but--- it’s not like I was doing something completely crazy, like putting it into my company’s retirement account or something!
When I received the animals on 1/28/09, I noticed that I didn’t receive paperwork for the hets as he told me he would and I also was missing one Fire female in the package. I called Brad Armitage when I was picking up the animals at Delta at the airport to let him know that I thought I was missing a Fire female. He said that couldn’t be so. I said I would double check—he said he would too.
When I got home and confirmed that I was in fact missing a Fire female, I called Brad Armitage again. This time he said, “Look man, I gave those things away at that price……” and “I don’t have the money, I owed it to my sister and I gave it to her….” And “I don’t have any other snakes…”. After we calmed down we agreed that he could have maybe made a mistake in his listing. He said he would check and would do the right thing. I believed Brad Armitage, because he seemed like a trustworthy chap. Even though he told me the female het pieds were “around 2000g” but they actually were 1200g and 1500g. Their size doesn’t worry me---their genetics do.
When we spoke on the phone, Brad told me that his bar/restaurant was busy because of the Super Bowl. Since I wanted to watch the Steelers win again, I agreed that we would talk after the weekend.
After the 2 phone calls, I went back to email contact with Brad Armitage. I wanted a response in writing—so I emailed him asking for one.
On Feb 2, I sent Brad a quick note to see if he had time to work it out. I received no reply.
Quote:
fromViteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
tobrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
dateMon, Feb 2, 2009 at 4:31 PM
subjectFollowing up
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details Feb 2 (8 days ago) Reply
Brad-
Please give me a call when the dust settles from your weekend.
412-#######
Thanks-
Mark
|
On Feb 4, I sent Brad another email.
Quote:
fromViteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
tobrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
dateWed, Feb 4, 2009 at 11:37 AM
subjectPackage Deal
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details Feb 4 (7 days ago) Reply
Brad-
Believe me---the only person more unhappy than you that I am still contacting you-------is me.
I sent you $6,000 of my family's money for a package that included a snake that I did not receive.
Your explanation of "it is what it is" doesn't sit well with me---not only for the missing snake---but for the fact that someone who would accidentally misrepresent a deal---and then dismiss it afterwards------is someone who could have sent me fake hets. The fact that you didn't provide paperwork for the hets---after you said you would also worries me.
I was pretty sure that you and I had a good understanding of our situation. I also felt that you were someone who was safe to deal with---in the days of the Internet---and for this amount of money----it was a big risk. You and I both revised the deal several times----and made a final agreement in writing (and verbally) that included a $500 snake that I did not receive.
I know that you are now out of the business and this deal probably doesn't matter to you any more. I really didn't expect to be ignored about a missing $500 snake. I called you immediately from the airport when I noticed the missing snake---and then again once I got home. I fulfilled my obligations as a buyer just fine---the Paypal payments were accepted.
All I can do about it is to ask you what you might have done if you were me in a similar situation? Would you be happy and feel good about the animals you got just because the seller felt that he "gave them away"?
The money is out of your account. I guess there's really nothing I can do about it.
I'd just like a reply in writing to know that you are not going to deal with this problem.
Mark
|
He replied on Feb 4.
Quote:
frombrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
toViteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
dateWed, Feb 4, 2009 at 5:46 PM
subjectRe: Package Deal
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details Feb 4 (6 days ago) Reply
Mark,
I do not check my email every 30 minutes, so i did not know about your previous email, only your phone call. I never said it is what it is as that is a retarded statement in the first place!! I will check my kingsnake ad when i get time and rectify any mistake if i have made one. I sold myou those animals at a value of 150 each for the baby fire girls. If i wrote the ad wrong i will make that up to you.
Brad
|
I replied on Feb 4.
Quote:
fromMark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
tobrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
dateWed, Feb 4, 2009 at 5:59 PM
subjectRe: Package Deal
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details Feb 4 (6 days ago) Reply
$6k is a huge priority to me.
You told me that you were sorry and that there wasn't anything you could do. You said the money was with your sister and that I had all of the snakes except the 2. I asked you to think about it and get back with me. You said super bowl weekend was busy for you and agreed to think about it. I sent the email on Monday and then again today. I wasn't expecting you to check your emails every 30 minutes--- I just thought you'd get back to me on your own.
I had planned on selling all the fire babies. Cost means nothing to me after my money is spent.
Check your ad when you have time. Hopefully you'll have time today. You can also just check the header of all of our emails from kingsnake. The very first email was generated from your listing and it has the title of your ad - 7 fire females.
I didn't do anything for you to be angry with me. I paid. I called you. I asked for what we agreed upon.
$6k is a lot of money to me.
Mark
|
I emailed again on 2/6 wanting closure. If you've ever dealt with a scumbag--you know it's best to hurry it along if you can.
Quote:
fromViteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
tobrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
dateFri, Feb 6, 2009 at 2:37 PM
subjectRe: Package Deal
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details Feb 6 (4 days ago) Reply
Brad-
What's the hold up?
Mark
|
By this time I had grown tired of not having a solution. I was also very worried about the character of someone who would ignore me like this….and I bought his hets. I also noticed that his Paypal addy was a new one—not a business account like I would expect a trustworthy long-standing online pet shop to have.
I filed Paypal claims on Saturday 2/7/09.
The first claim was for “items not as described” in the amount of $4900. The claim was immediately bounced by Paypal because they don’t get involved with disputes concerning “items not as described or missing units…”.
The second claim, for $1100 was replied to on 2/9/09 by Brad Armitage. He entered a tracking number to close the dispute. He had not replied to me at all in almost 5 days---but he did reply to Paypal on 2/9/09.
On 2/10/09---after not hearing from Brad Armitage since 2/4/09—and having seen his reply to Paypal the day before, I sent an email to Brad Armitage:
Quote:
fromViteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
tobrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
dateTue, Feb 10, 2009 at 5:47 PM
subjectI'm shocked
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details 5:47 PM (15 hours ago) Reply
Brad-
I can't believe this has happened to me.
You didn't keep your word---apparently that doesn't matter to you.
I've never had a situation like this in my life. I don't know if you accidentally misrepresented -- or sold the snake -- or whatever. I've just never been completely ignored about a serious sale issue in my life.
|
He replied:
Quote:
frombrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
toViteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
dateTue, Feb 10, 2009 at 6:47 PM
subjectRe: I'm shocked
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details 6:47 PM (14 hours ago) Reply
I sent you animals that you inspected and signed for. Do you expect me to believe that I shorted you a $150 animal and sent you animals well in excess of $6000. Why would I do that? You have escalated this to paypal and they have held back $1100. on my account. I will wait to hear from paypal as to resolution in this matter!
|
I found it interesting that he said Paypal was holding the $1100. He told me that he gave it to his sister.
My reply:
Quote:
fromMark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
tobrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
dateTue, Feb 10, 2009 at 7:06 PM
subjectRe: I'm shocked
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details 7:06 PM (14 hours ago) Reply
Brad-
I called you immediately from the airport when I noticed the missing snake. I called you once again when I got home to tell you that you accidentally shorted me an animal.
From there my concern went to the hets and double hets. You didn't provide any paperwork as you said you would. And then treating me poorly over "one $150 snake" made me worry from there. I have a close friend who was shopping with you on some possible hets just before these were born and I got worried about everything-- because I've received nothing as far as a solution.
I've escalated beyond paypal-- they won't handle claims of misrepresentation-- we saw that. I have no reason to make the missing snake up as fiction. Was I not to sign for the package because one snake was missing? I bet getting my $6k back after that wouldn't have been too easy.
You said you'd remedy the missing snake. You also said you'd give me paperwork. I haven't received either. I'm just trying to end this more amicably. I was pretty sure you and I were cool all the way through this. I told you that I needed all those snakes. And I certainly wasn't going to accept avoidance as the answer.
You said we'd work it out. So let's work it out. I can end any disputes at any time. The paypal one should go by itself.
|
His final reply:
Quote:
frombrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
toMark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
dateTue, Feb 10, 2009 at 7:35 PM
subjectRe: I'm shocked
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details 7:35 PM (14 hours ago) Reply
I said I would remedy the missing snake if there actually was a missing snake. By my account, all animals that I had were shipped to you. I was not treating you poorly, I just happen to be extremely busy with work. This is my last communication with you as I am waiting for my funds to be released from paypal.
|
And here we are today. How do you deal with a person like this? He felt that I got such a great deal with the other animals that he could ignore me.
Brad Armitage doesn’t want to speak with me any longer.
Brad Armitage is waiting for the Paypal claim to close because he has entered a valid shipping number.
It’s almost as if he knew he could blow right past Paypal………
I really don’t know what the solution is---I’m hoping VISA will come up with one for me. I don’t trust Brad Armitage of North Carolina---I don’t trust any paperwork he would furnish now.
I will tell you that I am completely sick of the reptile seller mindset of “You got a good deal so I don’t owe you what I agreed to give you”. I see it all the time—and it makes me sick.
If you are going to have sellers’ remorse—don’t accept the offers in the first place.
ORIGINAL EMAIL EXCHANGE FOR PURCHASE—read from bottom to top
I will list Kingsnake ad in post #2.
CONGRATULATIONS ON READING THIS FAR! IT’S ONLY ANOTHER HOUR OR SO FROM HERE!!
I use Gmail and the only way I was able to copy any of the Re: lines of the emails was to cut and paste. The original Re: line is generated from the Kingsnake listing. He lists 7 fire females in the title. He negotiated one out---I should have received 6.
-----------------------------------
Re: Message about
: Black-Eyed Lucy Male, 7 Fire girls,5 DH albino/pied girls and more
----------------------------------
fromViteli <maviteli@gmail.com>
tobrad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com>
dateThu, Jan 29, 2009 at 12:20 PM
subjectRe: Message about
: Black-Eyed Lucy Male, 7 Fire girls,5 DH albino/pied girls and more
mailed-bygmail.com
hide details Jan 29 (13 days ago) Reply
Brad-
Again--I don't mean to imply AT ALL---that you intended for there to be one less fire female.
I know as a businessman yourself that you will appreciate the fact that each and every animal on there was accounted for with a plan for my money. I am accepting hets without paperwork as well because I feel you are trustworthy.
Please don't forget about me with this.
Mark
- Hide quoted text -
On Wed, Jan 28, 2009 at 10:05 PM, Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Brad-
Hey man-- Everyone is settling in great.
I am screwing the number of female fires in my head. When I talked with you just before it made sense---but now it doesn't again--can we work this out? 7 fire females = 1 adult female fire, 1 800g female fire (you keep) + 5 female fires.
I received 4 female fires + 1 adult female fire.
Sorry to be a pain in the ass--I don't know how else to say it!
Let me know if we can work something out.
Mark
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 9:45 AM, Mark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Thank you very much.
Mark
On Jan 20, 2009, at 8:49 AM, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
Mark,
I will provide you docs for the dh animals.
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 3:11 PM, Mark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Brad-
First payment has been sent!
Would you be able to give me something in writing with the hets to guarantee the genetics of the snakes?I am just trying to make sure that Im able to sell them in case of emergency.
I will get the 2nd payment sent shortly.
Thanks.
Mark
On Jan 19, 2009, at 3:58 PM, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
paypal is fine as fees are about the same. I will ship delta so I can insure them.
Brad
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
I had just gone to Paypal to send the money---and then I realized that you may have the ability to take credit cards directly. I would be glad to call you with the card numbers if that will save some fees.
Also--I think Delta may be our best option if possible. I live at 15632 and would probably need to go to the Greater Pittsburgh International Airport or Latrobe Airport is closer---but a lot smaller.
Let me know about the credit card payment and I will send the $4900 right now--and the $1100 within a couple hours.
Mark
On 1/19/09, Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Brad-
I will take it. I will send the $4900 right now and will send the remaining $1100 within a couple hours.
I appreciate you working with me on this.
Mark
On 1/19/09, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
all of the 08 dh albino\pieds came from 1 clutch. I am getting out for the most part, but have some animals with a friend and will continue on with those in a much smaller capacity. I have a bunch of people that are interested in me breaking up the group and sewlling individually, but that takes more time on my part and time is what i am short on. What i can do is keep one baby male fire and the 800 gram fire girl and give you the rest for 6k. If you can do that you have a deal. lmk if you can do that. You will still be getting an incredible group of animals with tons of potential and I won't have to ship to 5 or 6 different people next week.
If you want to do it my paypal address is
bradarmitage1@gmail.com
thanks,
brad
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:43 AM, Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Brad-
I am running this deal very close to my financial edge. I don't mean to cry poverty--but I had plans for all of the animals in the package. Some for future sale and some for keeping for myself. Again--not to burden you with financial crying----but the credit card company called this morning and tried to undo the raise they gave me yesterday! LOL! I haven't ever experienced anything like that -- but with this financial climate I guess they are getting aggressive. I still have the $4900 and $1100 available to me instantly. They didn't reduce my limit after I spoke with them.
Next, you have an impeccable reputation--there's no disputing that fact. I have found numerous posts of your good dealings and happy customers. However, we are still dealing heavily in hets. I think you mentioned that you are getting out of the business. I am just a little stressed about the possibilities for something to not prove out. I hope you can see this as an understandable concern. Did the 08 double het females all come from one clutch?
If you would consider the package for $6K, I would appreciate it.
Thanks for your continued time-
Mark
On 1/19/09, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
Sounds good.
On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 5:59 AM, Mark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Brad- thanks for understanding!
Let me kick it around-- you are the man for coming up with reasonable alternatives.
My wife is gonna kick my butt...
I will get back with you within the next few hours.
Thanks again.
Mark
On Jan 19, 2009, at 8:48 AM, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
Mark,
You can have them if I keep either the larger fire female and one fire male or a fire male the 800 gram fire female and a small fire female. LMK if still interested
Thanks,
Brad.
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:51 PM, Mark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Brad-
Thanks for bearing with me.
I wasn't able to get as much as I requested from my cc company and can only offer $6k in two instant payments--one for $4900 and one for $1100.
Thanks for your time and consideration.
Mark
On Jan 18, 2009, at 8:03 PM, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
they hatched out in august and september and are from a pied boy to an albino girl. They are related to the male.
Brad
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Mark Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
When were the 08 female dh born? What did you use to produce them?
Would they be related to the male dh?
On Jan 18, 2009, at 5:03 PM, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
the hets are around 2000 grams, the male is a dh albino/pied, i can ship delta and get them to you in 10 hrs or less and can also ship fed ex. live arrival is guaranteed. lmk.
Thanks,
brad
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 2:54 PM, Viteli <maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
Brad-
Thanks for your quick reply.
If the group is still available I have some more questions.
How much do the female het pieds weigh? (roughly if possible)
Regarding the male in the double het project----is he a double het?
How would you ship? Do you guarantee live arrival on all?
I called my cc company and am supposed to hear about my requested increase soon. LOL @ me for increasing my credit for snakes!!
Thanks for your time-
Mark
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 9:42 AM, brad armitage <bradarmitage1@gmail.com> wrote:
Mark,
The het pied girls were produced by me, they all were. i am in raleigh, nc. they all are on live rats, but the smaller ones will all take f/t rats as well. they become a bit more finiky as they get older. as babies they never miss a meal. that seems to start after 700 grams. I do take paypal. lmk.
Thanks,
brad
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:52 AM, <Maviteli@gmail.com> wrote:
*************
NOTE: This message was sent to you via the Kingsnake.com Classifieds. If you feel this message is fraudulent or abusive please forward it to
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*************
Hello- nice stuff ! I am in the process of rallying my credit cards to see if I can do this. First off, what are these eating? Will any eat f/t? Also, where are you located? I am in PA. How large are the het pied girls and who produced those? Do you take paypal? Thanks for your time- Mark Viteli
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Brad Armitage of NC - deadbeat
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