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USA State Specific Issues Issues that are specific to a particular state, or subregion within a state, should be appended to the existing relevant thread. NEW threads cannot be created in this forum.

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Old 12-14-2003, 09:53 AM   #41
Rob @ RK Reptiles

I agree it is a waste of resources on such a petty infraction. I know in my area they go around to pet stores and try to pull the same thing but not too often. It is bound to happen at the small shows from time to time. At this past Orlando show (new show) there was a guy there trying to sell some animals and very well might have been UC F&W trying to pull the same sting. It is just safer to be careful and not purchase anything from anyone without checking. There is one store here locally (won't mention the name) that won't purchase the animal if you bring it in without a license but will purchase the container it is in and receive the animal (S) for free. I don't know it this is legal or not but to me it is not worth the risk of loosing my license and business over a small purchase.
Old 12-14-2003, 10:38 AM   #42
It is possible that these sting actions are not motivated by as much meanness on the part of the authorities, although it is a mean thing to do, but by fiscal desperation.
The U.S. economy has been in a deep recession for a few years and this has almost all states deep in the red and unable to afford the services that the citizens want the government to provide.
I think part of the reason for the stings come from pressure put on the line forces by the higher-ups to "scare up" more revenue, either by fines or "encouraging" more people to buy permits.
I want to also offer some encouragement to those who were stung. As a history buff, it is my reading that sting operations against average herpers do not hold up in court if the stung herpers are willing to challenge the charges, especially by hiring an attorney and fighting it.
The agents are often counting on you just paying the ticket or fine or accepting the confiscation of your animals, and are often shocked when a herper mounts a defense in court, or especially sues the agents for rights violations.
Old 12-14-2003, 11:06 AM   #43
I would say that is would be illegal to purchase anything in that matter Unless you had it in writing that the contents of the cage was free, You might could get away with that but In my opinion it would be a coin toss at best. I am glad I don't do very many shows in florida if that is the way things are down there. Becasue I would have purchased the Scarlet kings no questions asked. People sell things all the time at most of the other shows. That seems to me as a Clear Case of Entraptment. How can they come to your table and try to sell you a snake without having a class III permit if you have to have a class III permit to sell? They(wildlife officer) should then be fined for attempting to sell without a class III permit. Or am I just misunderstanding what is going on here. If they had busted me for that crime I would have to fight that one. I would think that the STATE and FEDERAL people would have better things to do that bust someone for purchasing a snake in the state of FLORIDA....But that is just my Opinion. See ya
Old 12-14-2003, 11:32 AM   #44
When I managed a store.. the owner and I were 99.9% sure we had an undercover employee. A guy came out of nowhere one day.. name dropping every main reptile breeder in the state... only calling herps in their proper names (but not knowing a thing about husbandry or even which lizards were herbivores or carnivores...) He kept constantly trying to get information on where our herps came from, who we bought from in the past.. even asking to help with the books. We knew there was something funny about the guy... started calling the names he kept referring to... found out they either had no idea who he was... or had just met him the day before. The next day, he never showed up again... never seen again in our area.

I am pretty confident..now after the All Ohio show incident.. that the undercover guy was part of that sting. We never got busted for anything.. so... not sure how much they kept looking into my store.

Talk about a waste of time and money!
Old 12-14-2003, 11:44 AM   #45
Yes David,

You wrote the word I was trying so hard to get.
ENTRAPMENT would be the foremost defense in my opinion as a history buff. Thank You!
Old 12-14-2003, 11:56 AM   #46
In regards to the story about the scarlet kings would it have been a violation to purchase the snakes if the person was there as a customer and not a seller ? I know in the past at some of the Florida shows I have been approched in the parking lot, hotel, etc. by people attempting to sell various animals which were usually much cheaper then the animals inside.
Old 12-14-2003, 11:59 AM   #47
Does anyone have a website address or information in regards to the permit requirements for selling reptiles at the Florida shows?
Old 12-14-2003, 12:28 PM   #48

Cost $25.00 (as of 5/5/03)

2590 Executive Center Circle, Suite 200 Tallahassee,FL 32301
(850) 488-6253
Class 3
Amphibians and all class III Reptiles Except Venemous Reptiles

Please call them as I have actually found them to be quite helpful.
Old 12-14-2003, 12:30 PM   #49
Sorry, that's spelled VENOMOUS.
Old 12-14-2003, 12:39 PM   #50
Thank you Bruce

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