west coast roaches Daniel Penunuri

Determining the "legal" owner of a website can be tricky if there is no contract worked out beforehand. The web designer can technically own it if 1) full payment was not received and 2) they are listed in the domain registry. These waters are muddied because Rene Morales is listed as administrative contact, but the email address and physical address is for badazzwebhost. If Rene/Daniel want to reinstate the domain in his name, he has grounds for it. It would also be good for him to register the tradename/DBA in his state to bolster his claim.

The scenario as far as I can piece together is this: Rene/Daniel (the issue of two identities is still not settled) decided to sell roaches online and came up with the domain name WestCoastRoaches.com. He hires badazzwebhost/PX Media Group to register his domain name and create the site. Around this time, he begins marketing his business on sites like HerpFamily.com. At some point, he stops paying for his site (or possibly never paid at all) and badazzwebhost/PX Media Group decides that it would be worth their while to just take it over, and they register Dubiadirect.com and run it as a similar business. Many companies leverage multiple domains in this manner, but most usually put some info on an "about" page that they are the same parent company. It's not required, but I think it's a good best practice.

I think that it is up to Rene/Daniel to get legal representation if he is still interested in doing business as WestCoastRoaches.com. He appears to have a legal claim.

I don't believe that the multiple names for both parties is an issue, as there are reasonable explanations for each. However, it does make it more confusing.

I do think it's shady for Jon Armstrong to claim ignorance and fraudulence against Rene/Daniel, but I can see where the two different names could cause some confusion. However, he obviously should have known that the account WestCoastRoaches was his former client, and he could have been more upfront about the nature of the company name. All he needed to say is "I am now the legal owner of the site, and I here is how I can prove it..."

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

Why in gods name after I paid for a site hosting and the name for a year.Shut it down because someone could not pay the. design bill? The biz or the site did not exist before I registered it.

Renumber badazzwebhost ( thats me) is the original registrar of the site.

As the owner of numerous websites, why in the world would you purchase a hosting plan for a site you designed for a customer??? At one time I have run upwards of a dozen websites through my host at the same time. And that's a low number compared to what a lot of hosts do...my plan is the cheapest plan available and even that plan allows for UNLIMITED hosted domains under one account. When I would design a website, it stayed hosted under my existing host until payment was received in full (I made an exception for this once when a friend of mine was brokering the deal...and I was shafted out of over $2000 so I've only made this mistake once)...if I purchased the domain name, it stayed under my name...though typically I designed the website around the domain name and I let them purchase the domain name on their own. Once payment was received...either we'd pre-arranged an agreement for hosting or I worked with them to get everything transferred over to their own host. It's your business so you're free to do whatever it is you do...but being a web developer, it just seems odd that you would take the route you're claiming to take...purchasing hosting as well as the domain name for them.

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

I have been called a liar, a thief and idiot. i am not inclined to sit and take you attacking me with opinions of your own. Should I also mention you spoke with rene or danial and did not give me the courtesy of a phone conversation before you flat out called me a liar. Oh wait you tried to call and I missed the call. Did you answer when I called back NO.

Welcome to the United States of America...might I invite you to read the 1st amendment of the United States Constitution?

So now you're saying if you and Kevin had actually spoke over the phone, none of this would have happened? Hey man...the only difference between emails/posts and phone calls is the words are typed instead of spoken. You have just as much of an opportunity to disprove any accusations with the typed word as you originally did with the spoken word before Kevin refused to answer your phone call.

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

If you buy a car, bank financed of course, and you dont pay the note and finance company takes possession of the car, are the stealing the car.

A landlord who doesn't get his rent, evicts tenants and don't tear down the house, are they thieves also.

You seem to have a very narrow scope of understanding in all this.

If you finance a car that was used to make service calls for a specific business and default on the payments, the bank will take it back yes...but they will not continue driving it around making service calls for that business with it. They will auction it off to try to recoup some of their losses. And as an employee of a car dealership (my day job), the first thing a dealership is going to do after they purchase the car from the auction is clean it out and sell it for someone else to turn into a work vehicle for THEIR OWN business.

If you rent a shop and have a business in there that repairs computers, again...if you fail to make rent on time and get evicted, they will not take all your stuff and continue running a computer repair business under the same name. If you fail to get your stuff out during the eviction process, yes, it will become property of the building owner...but either they will use it toward starting a new business or sell it off/dispose of it.

It seems to me like YOUR scope of understand is a little off...

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

Now for me knowing who the hell the member is, is impossible unless you share your database and user records with everyone, How the hell am i supposed to know just who posted the threads. It said WestCoastRoaches. It did not say danial, rene, or any other name other than WestCoastRoaches.com

Am I expected to be a mind reader when it comes to your secure user files?

Um...correct me if I'm wrong here...you should be able to see the posts Daniel made without being a member on my website and IMO, it should have been pretty obvious who he was without him ever posting his real name on the forums since it was obvious he did at one point have direct ties to WestCoastRoaches.com AND the official email address. I do keep a lot of the member information secured, but most of the posts are public with exception to a couple of forums...partially to protect our members from spammers who were having a heyday with some of the information that was defaulted to public plus we ran into some issues where a member's ex-husband was using our website to stalk her and as Kevin mentioned earlier...our members are like family to us...we tightened up our security enough to put an end to that as well as prevent it from happening to other members in the future.

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

You did your investigation, slandered me after I made a simple peaceful request to maintain my intellectual business property. Instead of working this all out in email, we gotta run here and drag it all out in public.

Few things here...

1.) Look up the definition of the word "slander"
2.) I informed you that we would comply with your request in my first response to you. YOU then began to get hostile while not providing me with any proof whatsoever that you own the actual business and not just have control of the .com domain...which as I ALREADY MENTIONED on here is NOT THE SAME AS HAVING THE NAME TRADEMARKED.
3.) Welcome to the BOI. We found a "bad guy" thread while investigating the claims that YOU CONTACTED US about...and now you're pissed off because almost every piece of your story just hasn't quite added up? Dude...I work full-time on top of running my website...how do you think I feel having to investigate all these allegations you made when I could be out trying to have a little bit of a social life when I'm not working? By the way...keeping things public makes sure that all lies are extinguished pretty quickly...you tell a lie publicly and you get caught in it, you're screwed. You tell a lie privately and get caught in it...now we have to work extra hard to prove to everyone you're lying because all you have to do is say, "Well I never said that..." especially when it comes to phone conversations. Publicly posted, typed messages...hard to dispute that evidence when you get caught in a lie [isn't it?].

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

All I can see is a request made to have your member change the username of remove the account altogether. Simple. Well should have been.
Instead of having the owner respond professionally and work with us to hammer this out. I get the whole admin berating with full opposition.

Again, read the response I sent to you after your initial email to me. I invite everyone to do so actually...and to everyone reading this thread...did that seem in any way, shape, or form unprofessional? I agreed to comply with the request once I returned home from work...I mentioned I needed to consult with my other admin before I took any additional action...I asked for any legal information proving they owned more than just the domain name...AND I even recommended they contact an attorney to help them handle the issues of someone posting with the same business name.

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

If you like for people to use other business names and post of your site sales adds that are false. Fine, do as you wish.It is your call.

They weren't false at the time they were posted...the user was utilizing the official .com email address in the ads as well as the website. We have a member who purchased from him and left him feedback for the transaction. Do you need to look up the definition of the word "false" too?

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

As for westcoastroaches.com we will do everything in our power to ensure our property and our business is protected from fraudulent behavior whether by everyday people or by sites harboring illicit accounts.

How you maintain your records in general is of 0 concern to me, if it has my business name attached to it, it is my right to oppose it.

And in order to protect my members and the possibility that the person contacting me is actually the fraudulent person, I will continue to investigate allegations...contact anyone I deem necessary during my investigation...and request proof of legal ownership of the business wherever possible.

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

Funny how after all this the name calling BY YOU guys, and the harassment by your and your admin teams for hours results in exactly what I asked for. You just had to find out he is not who he says he is too.

What name calling? I called you an idiot once...Kevin called you a liar. I'll refrain from discussing the idiot part...but you know how to avoid being called a liar?

Don't lie.

As far as the thief part...I don't recall the context it was used in...but that's between you and Kevin. No comment on that.

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

By the way..
Your excellent member was also part of roachesrus and also operates a free website selling roaches. None of which have my name, and all of which is falling apart because he does not follow up on his obligations, all of which I don't give 2 shits about. And suddenly since I financed the deal in the very beginning I'm a thief.

So? He didn't contact us saying someone is posting on behalf of his business without authorization...our members are free to advertise in our classifieds section. If we find out they've had a history of scamming customers, we'll put an end to that. So far he had only received positive feedback on our website. Anything else you want to make us aware of in order to try to shift the spotlight off of you?

Originally Posted by adminwestcoastroaches

Allowing people to purposely administer accounts with biz names they don't own after I have proven who owns, controls and administers the website.In mu view this is no different than the one using the false account.

Now we know why now all of your for sale threads are empty because a biz cannot go in and maintain and expect the admins to do anything about it.

You never proved you owned the business! ...and once again, owning the .com domain DOES NOT PROVE YOU ARE THE LEGAL OWNER OF THE BUSINESS!
As a matter of fact, this again emphasizes the point I made recommending that you contact an attorney. This is a classic situation of two former business partners duking it out, a disgruntled employee trying to get revenge, etc...it's grounds for a civil suit...not a freaking email complaint forcing the owner of an unrelated website to get involved.

We take care of what needs to be taken care of on HerpFamily.com...in this case, it was investigating a claim against a member that totally backfired on the person making the claim.

Well I am not about to let you two guys ruin my day or use up anymore of my valuable time with your trial than necessary.

What we know is I did business with Rene Morales in very beginning and not anyone named Danial pernunni. He (Rene) failed to pay for site design and hosting. The website ownership of name, content, and site design all defaulted back to the registrar .(ME) I might add that all content in the site was handwritten by me, the site code itself hand coded by me.

I do not believe for 1 second Rene's middle name is Danial Pernunni. I cant be responsible for knowing everyone alias's nor can you.

We have also determined that this thread was created because someone got jacked by someone named Danial Pernunni. We have now established exactly who Danial Pernunni is. He is Rene Morales.

If the transaction had been handled as WCR has laid out. He (original poster) would have my name at top of this thread. But it is not. He(original poster) didn't list a name associated with WCR, but an alias of someone.

Again I don't jump to conclusions. At this point I cant claim that his name is really Rene Morales. I can only go buy what the person (Rene) said his name was and what the paypal account states his name is. Rene Morales.

Obviously Rene has a second paypal account altogether that he used to handle this transaction. One named Danial Pernunni. We know this as fact cause that's the name in this thread in the beginning.

Having more than one paypal account is not enough to cause suspicion until they have two very different names on each account.

Rene Morales and Danial Pernunni

Back to my original claim. I do not know Danial Pernunni, never have. I do know Rene Morales and if they are indeed the one in the very same, then by default I would have to know him, but only if I knew both identities at the same time.

You guys only yesterday established the user you had was Danial, and that they are one in the very same.

Now to a partnership.

I was not a partner, only the one who leased it to him (Rene) on a monthly basis. When he(Rene) failed to meet his obligations, I became the owner.

I do not have a partner. I work alone. When he failed I pick it up. I had spent a month hand coding and designing laying out the entire operation. Only to see it dwindle because of ill operation.

Might I also add the name WestCoastRoaches did not exist and Rene was doing business as RoachesRUs and was moving himself from another webmaster. I registered the name WCR and built out the site.

I make no claims and don't speculate what the deal is between that webmaster and Rene.That's between them, and don't concern me.

So there never was any partnership.Now after the first 60 days or so when I was not getting paid for my design work or my hosting everything I had designed, written and coded is now my property. I took full ownership of the site, name and content. Thats when I started getting the emails from pissed customers about short bug counts, extremely late orders, missing items, and shipments that didn't ever show up.

All of which I had to personally cover out of my pocket to protect the name of the business I had worked so hard to create for no payment. I decided to turn it into something that would pay me back for my time and effort.

Rene was asked many times after the lease was dissolved to not use the name and to stay off and out of the social media profiles.None of which he respected. He continued to post for sale threads that people would ultimately come to me pissed about. Eventually at least the emails from his customers stopped so I would have to assume he stopped whatever he was doing.

Then one day I did a search for WESTCOASTROACHES and find this thread. WESTCOASTROACHES Danial Pernunni. I knew nothing of it.

So looking a lil farther I find the information on HerpFamily with posts. Now I am owner of the site, and I see threads from a WestCoastRoaches and its not my account or profile. If he had the account that's cool, but named WestCoastRoaches. I would also like to say he was advertising a package on the page that sold items that were more expensive than listed on the website.

So now we have a listing on your site, that is supposed to be westcoastroaches adverting a package in our name that is more costly than what we sell and no power to change it or alter it.

Hence the request for you to do something as an admin of your site. I left that up to you and sent the email.

Now if we follow the HErpFamily view. I am a liar. In my email I did not make 1 claim as to knowing who the person was on your forums, I only knew it was not me. Could it have been Rene yes. Could I say 100% without a doubt? No your user records are yours, and not for me to see. After all it could have been Danial depending on who he was that day.

The material on your website even though it is pointed to the official address was incorrect and did not match our website prices. Ultimately your members would have ended up paying more for the products than we actually charge.Sounds like a awesome benefit to become a of HerpFamily and pay $20.00 more for products because your a member. Im sure they gonna love that.

Thats just one of the reasons why the content was requested to be removed. It could have been a simple name change on the account. In your phone conversation with (Rene or Danial or Morales or Pununni) Im sure that would have been suitable for Rene as well as myself. Hell he could have changed it himself, but did not. He could have matched his name on your site to match the username he uses on other sites to sell roaches, but did not.

Since I am in the business of slandering people as you put it, notice I did not give the account names he uses to sell on Fauna or on bearded dragon.org or a link to his free webhost he uses to sell. I have left him alone to operate as he please provided its not as WCR

As I stated many times before guys.. I don't care if he sells roaches to the queen England, Jim Hoffa, Elvis or Elmer Fudd as long as he don't do it as WestCoastRoaches leaving me to clean up the messes. I dont care if he is a member of a zillion sites and has positive or negative feedback unless the negative feedback is left in the name of WCR when WCR had nothing to do with the transaction.

In your emails to me I flat out told you I did have dealings with Rene and that I would guess that is who it is. We have indeed established that is who it is.

The only person we have ever had any association with is Rene Morales. Dont know a danial. I think at very least you have rene on your site acting as daniel. I am not the one with false accounts and ID's. I have tried to call you back. Yes i i did set up a new profile on your site. That is not a crime. As you can see in my registration I used the official emails and all as I claim.They match profiles everywhere else. I will also be adding in the next minute to WCR a link to your site so you can see I am who I say I am.

Link will read,
LOcated right side under WCR online.

Herp Family and the title of the link will be. my name is Jon.

Honesty I would not be going thru all this if I didn't own the site and can prove it,

Me clearly stating I did indeed have dealings with Rene and not knowing his alias as Danial.

Yet I am a liar.

I did not answer your phone call and speak with you the previous night. Didn't hear the phone ring, wife was asleep and ringer was low. It would have all been cleared up. Guess that immediately make me a liar, because i didnt jump right on your call.

When asked if I ever had someone affiliated with the name I gave you the name of the person right.

But instead the two partners of HerpFamily jumped right in on me calling me a liar. I call both partners because both seem to be speaking for Herp Family in an official complicity. And if we use their logic, all you have to do to be an official partner is type the name HerpFamily or say your partner as they have allowed Rene or Danial or Morales or Pernunni to do without his own burden of proof.

Point being I was called a liar, had the full burden of proof at my feet, while you took the word of someone who we now know has at least 1 alias and was acting a 3 different people without requiring any shred of proof other than your own judgement.

And your actually gonna sit here on your thrones and put me on trial based on what is nothing more than your own belief and judgement based on a phone of someone we cant even establish the identity of.


Now im not gonna argue with you any more. The content is down from your site, he(Rene or Danial or Morales or Pununni is not operating an account on your site with the WCR name anymore, and we have more than established, you and I both that I am not Danial Pernunni, and that I am the one operating the website as myself, and not anyone else without an alias.

Looks like we all but established everything. We know who I am, who operates the website and who the registrar is. So feel free to continue your biased trail if you like and throw your assumptions around as freely as you have done thus far. As for me, I have a life to live and im not in the business of wasting my time on flat assumptions, not interested in how you feel about the whole fiasco, or who you believe or not. I have a Sunday to get to

Herpfamily.com I am just appalled by the way you treat your subscribers. No reputable business would resort to name calling as you did. I will make sure that I share with everyone I know your business practices. I will let them know that if they would like to be labeled an idiot, thief, or liar to come visit you guys. Just simply amazing!

Originally Posted by michellea910

Herpfamily.com I am just appalled by the way you treat your subscribers. No reputable business would resort to name calling as you did. I will make sure that I share with everyone I know your business practices. I will let them know that if they would like to be labeled an idiot, thief, or liar to come visit you guys. Just simply amazing!

What is simply amazing is your buying into Jon's BS.

Daniel was running West Coast Roaches long before he met Jon. He approached Jon to build a website for him so he could reach more folks. For some reason... the site was built but he couldn't pay off the bill.

Now.... does that give Jon the authority to ASSUME another persons business name.

As for my business practices... You don't have a clue as to my business practices. There are a whole lot of members here that can tell you I run my business in a respectable manner.

What I did was protect my members from folks that are lacking in integrity and willing to steal someone elses business name. If that makes me a bad guy... so be it. If more folks would step up to the plate then the reptile hobby wouldn't be in the shape its in.

As for the accusations... that was done as an individual. Me banning him from our site was done as a representitive of HF.com.

And further more.... when this started off.... Jon was not a subscriber to our site. We were trying to protect a true subscriber of our site against malicious allegations. Jon is just mad that it backfired on him.

Originally Posted by michellea910

Herpfamily.com I am just appalled by the way you treat your subscribers. No reputable business would resort to name calling as you did. I will make sure that I share with everyone I know your business practices. I will let them know that if they would like to be labeled an idiot, thief, or liar to come visit you guys. Just simply amazing!

So I also have to act... would you be Jon's other half... or just Jon using a second account. Yeah.... I was notified of your alter account on here as well.

I am Jon's wife. I know Rene's dealings as well. There is no alter account, this is my account! I've sat here and read your posts and Jon's. I simply stated that it is appalling that you resort to name calling.

When it boils down to it.. Jon and Renee are the only one's that know what there business dealings are. For you to sit and assume...well we all know where assuming gets you.

There will be measures taken so that no assumptions will need to be made. If I had a customer call me or email me at work and I called them a liar, a thief, and an idiot. I can tell you that I surely would be unemployed. No matter if the customer was right or wrong I would not resort to such childish behavior.

Originally Posted by michellea910

When it boils down to it.. Jon and Renee are the only one's that know what there business dealings are.

That is true of many dealings, and misdealings, on the BOI. Often. the buyer and seller, or other parties that have disagreement, are the only ones around when it hits the fan.
That's what the BOI is for, so that both sides can have their say, and onlookers can decide whether future transactions with one, both, or neither are worthwhile.
It's not always perfect, but it beat a shroud of secrecy where subsequent parties have no clue as to who they may want to deal with.