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General BS forum I guess anything is fair game in here. Just watch the subject matter doesn't get carried away too much.

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Old 12-07-2003, 12:43 PM   #11
Glenn Bartley
If I had her email address I would gladly give it to you. The thing is you are unlikely to find it here because she seems not too well liked by people whom I think are in the know when it comes to practicle reptile & amphibian care.

As for you other guys, Seamus wins first prize, that was absolutely precious. I may have to make a life sized copy and see if I can contact the spirits of - no wait a minute - I would not want to contact the spirits of anyone whom I could reach with that thing. But it really had me howling, I love it.....

All the best,
Glenn B
 
Old 12-07-2003, 01:17 PM   #12
Seamus Haley
All kidding aside here for a moment...

Out of curiosity, I just looked up the thread starter's profile and, from that, his homepage.

He was born in 1988 and his homepage has links to care sheets that he reccomends... The first one for every species (where she's plagarized one) is off Kraplan's website.

She's infecting children with her PETAspeak! I forsee a group of iguana owning youngsters, all with "Iguanas For Dummies" tattoos shouting slogans and marching to show their anti-pet solidarity... The Kraplan Youth Brigade.

All joking aside for the moment though... And to the original poster... Melissa Kaplan is easily among the biggest dangers to our hobby (and in many cases our businesses), she supports legislation which makes it more difficult or even impossible for individuals to own animals, believes that it's cruel to keep reptiles in captivity and has subtly inserted herself into this new mainstream front of herpetoculture... The average Petco/Petsmart employee and customer thinks that she, and her ideas, are an accurate representation of a hardcore herper, because she is the first thing they are introduced to when looking for information and her information seems, upon very... very... casual reflection, to be correct... I mean, it has words over six letters in it sometimes, so it has to be true, right?

Our hobby is undergoing a massive change, from being something participated in only by a fringe group of naturalists and academics, to something that is seen frequently in the family home... We need to be vigilant about who influences all these new herp owners and ensure that the information they get is doing what it's supposed to be... educating them about the best care for their animals. Kaplan, and a few others in her camp, don't want animals owned at all... a moral position that they wish to shove down the throats and legal systems of everyone else, they facilitate their goals by spreading subtle misinformation. By doing so, they build a larger and larger group of people who will attempt to keep a reptile and fail, based on their advice... Furthering the idea that it's impossible to keep a herp in captivity.

When she says that an iguana can be trained... and some poor slob who bought her book tries it and gets mangled by the one they purchased... That slob now thinks reptiles are bad pets, impossible pets, dangerous pets... and this WILL be reflected in legislative attempts to ban our animals.

Incidentally... anyone else notice that her book's biggest sales seem to be through the big two chain stores... While she makes statements and supports groups and movements that directly oppose their businesses? I know that many of us would rather have them stick to the dog and cat food, but she's gone and tried to make it impossible for the companies to sell live animals... any live animals. Yet they indirectly support her financially and further her attitudes and goals by promulgating her book... Wander into one of the big two chain stores sometime... ask for a book about iguanas... that nasty yellow and green paperback will be in your hand shortly.

To the original poster... I have no idea why you want to contact Kaplan, but in looking at your webpage, I suspect it's not for the same reasons I, and others here, used to... and as much as it sounds like I'm being petty... I won't help or encourage her in any fashion, which includes getting you in contact with her. Check someplace else.
 
Old 12-07-2003, 01:23 PM   #13
Seamus Haley
Er... Ignore the first "All kidding aside"

I had a late night.
 
Old 12-07-2003, 02:41 PM   #14
Glenn Bartley
Essentially, I agree with Seamus on this one. Melissa Kaplan, in my opinion, is nothing more or less than an undercover ultra extreme animal rights activist who wants ultimately to ban the keeping of reptiles and amphibians. One might wonder, well if she is so against keeping pet herps, then why does she write so many herp care articles, and why does she present articles of others on her web site! Her articles on reptile & amphibian care are fraught with innuendo that reflects her desire to ban the keeping of reptiles & amphibians, or top at least make the keeping of these animals seem undesirable to many. See this linked article that she wrote, it is a good example of what I am writing about: URL=http://www.anapsid.org/parent.html]So You Think You Want A Reptile?[/url] and here is another, this one is one that is shown on her site but apparently written by someone else, it is a great one to show lots of discouragement that, in my opinion, is camouflaged as good advice College Student Speaks Out About Iguana Ownership. Read both of these. They are in my opinion, full of malarkey! Which do you think after reading these. Are these articles actually trying to foster responsible herp care, or are they trying to discourage herp care with such concepts as saying that you SACRIFICE when you own an iguana, or that you will need at least $200 on hand at all times for vet emergencies. Please note the author's iguana required a vet because of improper care given to it - it had metabolic bone disease - heck, would it not be better to actually promote good iguana care therefor avoiding a trip to the vet because of a totally avoidable illness like metabolic bone disease. If you let your iguana get into that condition in the first place, then you were irresponsible as I see it! And what about this line from Kaplan’s article "So You Think You Want A Reptile:
Quote:
Keeping a reptile properly can provide a wonderful learning experience for the family. But so, too, can choosing not to keep one.
Do you get that 'so too part'; the whole article is chock full of the attitude that this one line portrays - you are better off without a reptile for a pet.

Melissa Kaplan, in my assessment, is no friend of the herp hobby or of herp keepers or even of the herps themselves. She is, rather, in my opinion, a friend of, what I consider to be, the control freaks at PETA, and the Humane Society Of the United States. I don't believe they care about the animals, I think all they want to do is to be in control and they use animals as their way to take a power trip. Now if you doubt that Ms. Kaplan wants to be in control, take a look at this article that she wrote: Responsibility & Accountability An Alternative To Banning. Wow that sounds great doesn't it! Until you realize that what she wants would raise the price of herps so high as to make them virtually unattainable for the regular working person. Can you imagine the bureaucratic nightmare that would be caused by the legislation necessary to bring all of these rules about. And what about the responsibilities of the buyer. Isn't the person who buys a pet responsible for its care. If you go to a store and buy an iguana before knowing what you need to know, and just depending upon the word of a salesman, well then you have been a dope - pure and simple. You need to educate yourself before going out and buying, and the best way to do that is to pick up a book and read it, and talk to other herpers. The best method is not to make stores and other retailers follow regulations that are virtually unenforceable. Sure I'd like to see retailers take better care of animals too, and give better info on them, but to hire two vets per store. To make each employee an expert. To have detailed care sheets for free. Don't you think things like this will get figured into the price somehow! Sure it will, and the bottom line price will be the destruction of the herp industry, and of the herp hobby as I see it.

What I do not understand is why Ms. Kaplan does not promote the responsible care of reptiles & amphibianas asd a good thing, as being fairly easy (for the great majority of species that are in the pet trade), as being a wonderful hobby, as being a good thing to get your children involved with, and so forth instead of also adding that negative and discouraging twist she so often seems, at least seems to me, to throw into her articles. The only thing I can come up with, in my opinion, is that she wants to be in control of things, and that she has to be the grand poobah so to speak above everyone else, she has to be the one who gives off an air of knowing what is best for all of us. People like that scare me very much.....

Just in case it was not extremely clear to you already, the above is my opinion, nothing more and nothing less.

Best regards,
Glenn B
 
Old 12-08-2003, 06:15 PM   #15
John Apple
Just in case it was not extremely clear to you already, the above is my opinion, nothing more and nothing less.
spoken By Glenn B

Glenn your opinion is shared by many a herper senior and junior,
I think your words and Seamus well represent what Kaplan and her 'flock' of followers are trying to do...
NOW there is a cult forming if I ever saw one, every one of her followers have to eat an iguana turd , and those that get salmonella are out, those that survive are members of the kraplan kult
 
Old 12-10-2003, 12:06 PM   #16
eric adrignola
Along the same lines...

It's sad. I've seen several people come into the hobby, learn stuff the hard way, try to educate others, and eventually become frustrated with the seemingly "ignorant" public.

In their frustration(or in some cases, feelings of their own superiority), they take it out on the REST of the hobby.

Melissa Kaplan knew her stuff. she tried to get info out there. the public STILL had the nerve to not listen, and thousands of iguanas turn to MBD-jelley despite her efforts. so now she wants to keep them out of the hands of the ignorant masses, for they (from her high-up, holier than thou position)lack the ability to properly care for reptiles.

I have seen the same thing with Chameleons, Namely Ardi Abate, the editor of the CIN. I used to talk with her all the time whenI got started. She was full of info. The last issues of the Chameleon information network were mostly geared towards the elimination of the hobby. More than half the pages were full of old data on mortality rates of imports(back when there were no restriction, and even less knowledge on husbandry). there was even a section where little schoolkids drew pictures of chameleons, and wrote little messages saying"Karmaleons need to stay in the rain forrest, because they die in kages!", or "Please keep the chamelions in madagazcar. they belong in the jungle, not in a cage."

Disgusting. Filling the porus minds of inncoent, eaisly influenced children with PC, tree hugging(and lets not forget communist, Peta and the HSA are communist-goal-seeking organizations)agendas...Ok, the communist part MIGHT be a bit of a stretch, but over-regulation iIS kinda communist...

In Ardi's situation, she didn't start out like that. It only happened after years of hearing from the people that were haveing a hard time with chameleons. The people that were sucessful were obviously NOT calling her. So, she got inundated with horrible stories, year after year, and now, she's trying to push chameleons as "immoral" to keep.

I HATE it when people want to tell me what I can or cannot do when they have no reason to do so, except that they think THEY are right. Example: vegetarians. I know PLENTY of vegetarians. Most are just that, they don't eat meat for personal reasons. period. OTHERs will preach, saying I am wrong, meat is cruel, and people should "Rise above" eating meat, and "move up" to a higher moral level--if that aint elitest I don't know what is. The same way PETA thinks they are "better" because of their beliefs.

It's funny, that I see so many gun owners in the reptile buisness. I thinkt he common link is that Reptiles and guns are two things we LIKE to keep, but others are always trying to take them away, because THEY don't want us to have them.

The fact that people like MK and Ardi get recognition, and have credibility(in the public eye), is dangerous. For example, if the HEAD EDITOR of the Chameleon Information Network(the #1 organization for information regarding the KEEPING of chameleons IN THE WORLD) is saying that keeping chameleons is WRONG, people that DO NOT KNOW anything on the subject will assume that that is the general consensus of the members of the CIN, and chameleon keepers in general.

It's too bad that the reptile industry does not have a political group to keep people from infringing on OWR rights. The NAtional Reptile Association, a political group dedicated to preserve the rights of people to keep whatever the heck kind of abhorrent, nasty, cold-blooded , venomous creatures they want, as long as it aint hurting anyone else." ----the N.R.A. good ring to it.

Sorry for the rant, I'm bored at work, and I had a lot of coffee.

Eric A
 
Old 12-11-2003, 12:50 AM   #17
meretseger
PETA is pretty frickin' socialist. Reading enough of their stuff you almost get the idea that animal welfare isn't really part of their agenda at all- just a front to get their foot in the door.

Erin B.
 
Old 12-11-2003, 02:18 AM   #18
WebSlave
PETA and the rest of that ilk already have their foot in the door.

It all starts with a permit system. Sounds innocent enough at first, so sure, why not? Helps to clean up the place since only the bad guys will not be permitted. Yeah right....

A permit is asking permission to do something. Take a look at ANY permit application that was first required and then take a look at it several years later. Each year more and more requirements will be added in to being "permitted" to do what you want. And if you violate any of them, well then you are no longer permitted. Permission denied. So sorry, but heck, you agreed to this, right?

Permits are attractive to the people already in the business. Why? Because it makes the hoops harder to jump through for the people who want to get where they already are. So they are supported because of self interest. But eventually, sooner or later, even they will be getting their feet dampened as the tide rises higher every year of the demands needed to be met in order to get that once "just a formality" permit. It's for your own protection and better for all, remember?

Your rights will not be taken away at gun point. You will give them away bit by bit. And unfortunately, it is like trying to protect your sand castle on the beach from the rising tide.
 
Old 12-11-2003, 02:26 AM   #19
Seamus Haley
I disagree to a certain extent with the statement that Melissa Kaplan knew her stuff and tried to get the information out there...

I think she probably knows full well what good iguana information is.

I also think she knowingly states the exact opposite and always has as far as her public statements and "educational" attempts are concerned. Her sociopolitical agenda comes first, reptile education isn't even on the list of her priorities despite statements to the contrary.

Meaning... you need to know accurate information in order to give BAD information of the type needed to sway unsuspecting minds.
 
Old 12-19-2003, 11:51 PM   #20
snakegetters
Until you have volunteered too much of your own time and money trying unsuccessfully to save too many reptiles that have been abused and neglected by too many idiots, don't be so quick to defend the pet trade as it exists today.

I am heartily sick of seeing the neglect and abuse of reptiles that is standard in the pet and wildlife trade. In my opinion there does need to be more regulation to prevent the incredible amount of suffering that happens because uneducated and uncaring people (including kids) buy pets with special dietary and environmental and veterinary needs. Often they don't have a clue as to what those needs are, causing these animals to die slowly and unpleasantly for lack of adequate care.

If you are not prepared to care for an animal, you should not be allowed to keep it. I hear some people crying that this idea violates their "rights". Perhaps it does, if you think that your rights include being able to abuse and neglect your pets. Almost everyone would agree that it is illegal (not to mention sick and cruel) to keep a puppy cooped up in a tiny, freezing cold cage and feed it only lettuce, causing the animal suffering, disease and deformity. But no one seems to care that this is actually the fate of a large number of the baby iguanas sold by pet stores.

I do not agree with PETA's extremist tactics or politics, but I have seen more than my share of cruelty in the pet and wildlife trade and it makes me very unhappy with the situation as it stands today. I do hope that some improvements can be made that will stop the worst of the abuse and also allow responsible people who do care properly for their animals to continue keeping and breeding them.

As for Melissa Kaplan's husbandry information, I regularly attend lectures and classes given both live and online by some of the world's most respected writers and researchers in the field of reptile medicine. It's expensive but worth it - I learn a lot, and I get to hear what the real experts in the field are doing. Ms. Kaplan's web site is referred to repeatedly by these authorities as a good site for veterinarians to consult and to send their clients to.

In my recent memory, Doug Mader and the Hernandez-Divers have cited Melissa Kaplan as a good and informative resource for veterinarians in the course of their lectures. So have a number of other prominent lecturers, but I don't have written notes in those cases so I don't want to quote them.

Clearly the information on her site is considered good by the people who are acknowledged as among the world's foremost authorities in reptile medicine. Anything that general folks-at-large have to say about it on the Net does not impress me by comparison, not if they are contradicting people like Doug Mader and Steve Divers.
 

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