Respiratory infection. (long post)

I was administering Flagyl to one of my leos that resulted in a visit to the emergency vet. Why? Because my boy had gotten the medicine down the wrong pipe.

I've given medicine at some point or another to most of my leos, so here I was, thinking I had mastered handling even the most stubborn ones, giving them medication in a passive manner (that is, allowing them to lick it off their snout at their own pace), with proper dosage, and a good safety margin to work with. I thought my leo was just being stubborn when he kept spitting out the medicine. It wasn't my first time seeing that happen.

But when I set him back down into his enclosure, it was obvious something was wrong. He immediately started clawing at the glass, his eyes were squinted, his looked as if in pain, he occasionally opened his mouth as if to gasp, struggling around the tank as he did this. Then when he slowed down he didn't put up a fight (as usual) when I picked him up again to investigate.

This whole time, I'm watching in absolute horror. But when it became clear that he wasn't breathing, I got out of my stupor and decided to bring him to an emergency vet even though it was 10:30 at night. I went to arav.org, but that site SUCKS for the simple fact that ANY non-herp vet can get themselves registered without any special training. Fortunately, it only took a couple of calls to find an emergency vet who specializes in exotic animals.

So I drove to her house, and let me tell you, this lady is very BLUNT. Add the fact that she had been up since 4:30 in the morning and probably got out of bed just to see my leo. But I have to say she is the most knowledgeable person I've met so far when it comes to herp health because she doesn't talk out of her ass. The good news is that by then, my leo wasn't choking. It took me about 15 minutes to get him to the vet. Talk about torture. I had to resist the urge to check on him while I was driving because my driving is already bad enough as it is with both eyes on the road.

The bad news is that he might still have the medicine there in his respiratory system. Depending on how much he has down there, the pH level of what he has, and a number of other factors, he could very well be on his way to respiratory pneumonia. It could take a LONG time for any symptoms to manifest, but by the time they do, it would have advanced to the serious stages.

So that makes me wonder about one of my other leos who hasn't been eating for awhile now. Next to the one I treated tonight, she was worst when it came to putting up a struggle (which I think is what gets the medicine to go down the wrong way). She turns down even waxworms and roaches now. She's not gravid, her temps are fine, she's on paper towels. But we're talking about a deworming I gave her 8 months ago.

Right now I'm very concerned. Some of you already know that I don't shotgun treat my animals. I'm very systematic about getting fecals done for every animal and then medicating. So having something like this come up is just a total shock. It makes me rethink how I do things. Should I give medicine to my herps if they are eating and gaining weight fine? I also have to wonder which other leos may have health problems I'm completely unaware of. I feel horrible because I'm responsible for causing this situation for these two who only had minor parasitic problems to begin with.

The only positive note is that I've found myself a good vet. It's easy to see she's better than my current one. I'm planning on bringing both leos for a check-up so I can possibly get x-rays and/or blood tests done. But gosh, this was beyond scary. I was so afraid I was going to lose my boy, and now I'm just overwhelmed with guilt. I literally started crying hysterically on the way home. Luckily, we both got home okay. I'm still trying to calm down though.

Am I over-reacting? How many of you have dealt with RIs? Any feedback would be appreciated.

i have dealt with RI's in snakes but not leos... anytime i have to give any of my animals medicine i generally use a disposable curved point ot ball type point blacks syringe (no needly) and if i dont have that i have aomse small inulin syringes a take off the needle and attach a small piece of soft flexable tubing to it.... the reason wh... when administering medications you want to make sure it does not get in the glotus )sp?) snakes have one i dont know if lizards do ... but thats how we do it or inject it in a prey item.... go lizards or leos for that fact have a glotis? i never really looked for one hmmmmmm

Olivia, try not to be so hard on yourself... he may or may not even develop a respiratory infection. Just keep them warm... turn up the heat a little bit, and watch for symptoms like; opening the mouth to breath, a clicking or rattling sound when they breath, etc.

Yes, Leopard Geckos have a glottis, or windpipe, that is close to the front of their mouths right about where the tongue begins. It's important to get any medication or liquids administered far back into their throat, past the glottis or they can inhale it. The method you were using by putting a drop on their nose is just fine. Flagyl is very foul-tasting, and usually they just gag on it, and don't actually get any in their windpipe. You can mix it with about .05 or 0.1 mls. of apple juice in the syringe once you have pulled the proper dose so it will taste better.

Flagyl is extremely rough on a gecko's GI system, as it not only kills gram-negative bacteria, but also the 'good' bacteria that keeps the gut in balance. The ones you are treating may have irritated intestines from the medication which will give them a tummy ache and lose thier appetites. You can give them some benebac, nutribac, or any other probiotic to help put back some of the positive gut flora. I use the drug store human variety of Acidophilis/Bacillius/Bifitus tablets, crushed and dissolved in about 10 mls. of pedialite. Try giving them about 0.5 mls a day for a few days, but don't give it at the same time as the Flagyl... the drug will kill the beneficial bacteria in the probiotic.

He did eat last night, so I'm feeling a little more optimistic. I still want to bring him in for another check-up just in case. Thanks for the replies!