Notices |
Hello!
Either you have not registered on this site yet, or you are registered but have not logged in. In either case, you will not be able to use the full functionality of this site until you have registered, and then logged in after your registration has been approved.
Registration is FREE, so please register so you can participate instead of remaining a lurker....
Please note that the information requested during registration will be used to determine your legitimacy as a participant of this site. As such, any information you provide that is determined to be false, inaccurate, misleading, or highly suspicious will result in your registration being rejected. This is designed to try to discourage as much as possible those spammers and scammers that tend to plague sites of this nature, to the detriment of all the legitimate members trying to enjoy the features this site provides for them.
Of particular importance is the REQUIREMENT that you provide your REAL full name upon registering. Sorry, but this is not like other sites where anonymity is more the rule.
Also your TRUE location is important. If the location you enter in your profile field does not match the location of your registration IP address, then your registration will be rejected. As such, I strongly urge registrants to avoid using a VPN service to register, as they are often used by spammers and scammers, and as such will be blocked when discovered when auditing new registrations.
Sorry about all these hoops to jump through, but I am quite serious about blocking spammers and scammers at the gate on this site and am doing the very best that I can to that effect. Trust me, I would rather be doing more interesting things with my time, and wouldn't be making this effort if I didn't think it was worthwhile.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 04:41 PM
|
#151
|
|
Imajacobian, you wrote:
"Instead we get go to my FAQ's."
My apologies it is not the answer you wanted, but it is the answer you got.
Plenty of answers to all your possible questions, without risk of lies and misinformation polluting the webpages.
Venomoid snakes paper photos.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 05:28 PM
|
#152
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder
When I look at web forums I see an endless lot of dribble prostituted as truth
|
That is amazingly perceptive. And beautifully said, too.
The problem is that each side believes they have a monopoly on the truth.
But if you look hard enough, you can usually find that in most disagreements, each side does indeed have a little bit of the truth by the tail. And just as in real prostitution, it's how the tail is used that determines its value.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucille
Well, if your goal is to have a conversation and not be a control freak, let people have their say. There are other opinions besides yours, and some of them may be equally or more valid. Listen.
I believe there is no good reason for venomoid surgery and that one is hurting the snake and asking for trouble by doing said surgery. My opinion is every bit a valid as yours, and by trying to control what I think, and what other people think, you are merely creating a justifiably poor rep for yourself.
A piece of advice, and it's free: Don't come out swinging and putting folks down. I mean really, if you do that, what did you expect in return?
|
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 06:01 PM
|
#153
|
|
taken from your venomoid snakes paper photos "operating plank"
you mean a 2x4 with some nails sticking out of it. i hope thats disposable, how do you properly sanitize a surface like that? another piece taken from your website "As a procedure it is remarkably simple and while it would be generally advised that a qualified veterinary surgeon perform the operation, this is not necessarily essential or for that matter the most important requirement." you really believe that invasive surgery can be done by someone else than a veterinarian? Dont you think that ruins the reputational idea that we as an industry should try to keep our standards high? Dont you want the absolute best for your animals by ensuring there safety when being surgically operated on? This is just like arguing that the general public can give the rabies vaccination to there own pets. Sure some people will do it correctly, but many others will do it wrong. Im sure your animals are perfectly fine after you do the surgeries, but your stimulating the idea that its okay for pretty much anyone to do these surgeries who have a scalpal and some suture, which will ultimately lead to improperly performed surgeries that can have risky outcomes.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 06:28 PM
|
#154
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by hadenglock
risky outcomes.
|
Risky, painful, and possibly fatal, to snake or people.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 06:53 PM
|
#155
|
|
Personally, I'm still trying to wrap my head around this statement:
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder
Anyone who puts the welfare of their snakes first free handles instead of using metal sticks to attack snakes.
|
I handle my (non-venomous) aboreal snakes with hooks. Based on their attitude and how they react, this appears to cause much less stress to the snakes than when I use my hands (and not for lack of soft handling technique, but because of the heat of my hands). My observation. I'd be interested to look at your sources, if you have some, in regards to free-handle vs hook.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 06:58 PM
|
#156
|
|
Hadenglock
You wrote:
“Im sure your animals are perfectly fine after you do the surgeries”
Yes
“but your stimulating the idea that its okay for pretty much anyone to do these surgeries”
No – I never said that. In fact I wrote (and you quoted):
“it would be generally advised that a qualified veterinary surgeon perform the operation”
Thus there is no need for you to put spin or interpretation on an explicit statement!
All the best
Absolute April, I am not at your facility so cannot comment on what you observe.
I can however state that thermally, the human hand is generally far better for a snake than a usually too cold or hot hook or other metal implement, so on that basis alone is the better handling implement.
Added to that the fact a hand can contour to fit the animal, it wins hands down. That others agree with me is seen by the general preference by everyone to handle non-venomous snakes by hand. I have never seen a Corn Snake handled with tongs!
Your inferences that sticks are superior to hands as a handling tool for the snake’s welfare is therefore patently false.
All the best
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 07:13 PM
|
#157
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder
I can however state that thermally, the human hand is generally far better for a snake than a usually too cold or hot hook or other metal implement, so on that basis alone is the better handling implement.
|
hook is in the snake room so it's a nice 70-75 degrees just like everything else. (and yes, I've used it for my corn snake before lol)
to clarify I am speaking of a HOOK not TONGS
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder
Your inferences that sticks are superior to hands as a handling tool for the snake’s welfare is therefore patently false.
|
well.. in your opinion. I guess that is the part missing from your first statement which seemed like you were stating a proven fact.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 07:48 PM
|
#158
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder
Description of our venomoid operations as subpar is not supported by the evidence, which is a perfect record of results and happy healthy snakes.
|
This rings false, how do you know your snakes are 'happy'?
And I doubt your perfect record, so I'm calling it a lie. In the medical profession, despite skill, technology, and training, no surgeon has a perfect record. There are always some surgeries with unforeseen problems, contaminated or non-properly-working equipment, and days when despite experience, the surgeon has an off day.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 08:02 PM
|
#159
|
|
This guy reminds me of the clowns at BallBids. Making contradictory and self-serving statements, with no basis in any sensible plane of reality. And he even has a magic link that'll dispel any arguments. Deja-vu all over again.
'Oh, you don't agree with me? Here, just have a look at my handy-dandy link. This'll explain it all. Quantifiable data? Crikey, mate, who needs that!? I said it, so it must be the truth.'
Such an accomplished attention-whore has no qualms about prostituting his own ideas as facts. He's shown an inclination to do little else. That, and blatantly anthropomorphize snakes to try to back up his ridiculous claims. He's very quick to say that he knows what makes snakes "happy". It's a shame that he doesn't carry that anthropomorpization to it's logical conclusion, regarding his surgical butchery: amateur surgery, done with crude instruments, without pain medications, and without professional surgical training, leads to pain and misery.
Gotta get a good chuckle out of someone that's not honest enough to admit he's already been soundly beaten.
|
|
|
10-23-2012, 08:06 PM
|
#160
|
|
The three last posts are akin to creationism arguments from Christian Fundamentalists.
I clearly cannot reason with any of them - ever!
If making "noise" wins an argument, you definitely win hands-down!
All the best
|
|
|
Join
now to reply to this thread or open new ones
for your questions & comments! FaunaClassifieds.com
is the largest online community about Reptile
& Amphibians, Snakes, Lizards and number one
classifieds service with thousands of ads to look
for. Registration is open to everyone and FREE.
Click Here to Register!
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
Similar Threads
|
Thread |
Thread Starter |
Forum |
Replies |
Last Post |
[For Sale] Venomoids
|
devenomized |
Venomous Snakes |
0 |
09-23-2009 09:41 PM |
[For Sale] Venomoids
|
SamC |
Venomous Snakes |
9 |
03-28-2009 01:15 PM |
Pro Venomoids
|
bowhunter |
Venomous Snakes Discussion Forum |
31 |
02-16-2006 03:51 PM |
Venomoids?
|
Darin Chappell |
General Business Discussions |
11 |
06-14-2002 03:43 PM |
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:34 AM.
|
|