Deobra Martin

I agree that it did look that way, especially since he'd already commented about you being cranky (for the record, I'm the cranky one)....but let's not distract from this topic with a pi$$ing match over karma. It's been said over and over (and over, again) that a BOI thread is not the place for members to bicker over karma. ok, there are a few select reasons it is appropriate...but this isn't one of them

Mr Pitt already explained that the comment was a quote of the karma message he received. If you didn't give the karma, you didn't make the comment. (no, I haven't looked to see who gave it).


I've started a couple of comments on this thread, and abandoned them for a couple reasons...I think I'll have to try again when things settle a bit.

Deobra, You purchased the Pastel and you know it's just a Pastel but you're giving your potential customer the choice in believing or not it could be a Super Pastel/

Why can't you just be flat out honest and sell it as a Pastel?

No soup for you!

Correction





Deobra, You purchased the Pastel as a Super but you know it's just a normal Pastel but you're giving your potential customer the choice in believing or not it could be a Super Pastel/

Why can't you just be flat out honest and sell it as a Pastel?

No soup for you!

since you think I am lying (or not being honest) I will post this up here that came with him. He was purchased as a super pastel, and the seller was confident enough to put a genetic guarantee on him. That is why I have him posted as a "ugly super you decide", because I have a guarantee that he is but he does not show common characteristics. It is an honest thing? Not me trying to sucker anybody. I do believe that me saying "ugly super? You decide" is not stating he IS a super or NOT, just me putting out there what he was sold as but that I am unsure

and this is the original thread he was for sale in as well

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=196026

I’m not saying you are lying about purchasing that Pastel as a Super Pastel. I think you had enough feedback within his ad and yours to realize it’s just a Pastel. You say it does not show common characteristics of it being a Super Pastel, you know why that is?


You have a genetic guarantee from the seller, ask him to take the snake back and refund you or give you back the difference of what a Pastel is worth. If you don’t want to do that cut your losses and sell it as a Pastel rather than jeopardize your reputation. If it proves out which I don’t see that happening than you will have one extra happy customer!

1) People can ask whatever price they want for their animals. I have alternately been criticized for both high and low prices...and those comments never compelled me to change my prices. If buyers think the price is too high, they won't pay it.
2) I asked Deobra if the guarantee was limited to her, as the original purchaser; or if it would cover the person she sells it to. She may not feel it is worth pursuing with the seller, but that is her choice...it's her snake, her sale.
3) FWIW, I'm not a huge BP fan - I don't spend a lot of time looking at ads (unless there is something specific I am looking for...and I have never considered adding a super pastel to my group), and I pretty much don't even look at BPs when I go to a show - and even I have seen "super pastels" that were virtually indistinguishable from regular pastels within a few months. This particular one was unimpressive from hatching....I would be hard pressed to label it a super, even an ugly one, if I had produced it. I would have sold it as a nice pastel; and if was an ugly super - oh well At least my reputation would be intact, and my customer would be happy.
4) I don't know the experience level of the original seller, so I won't comment further on her judgement - besides, this thread isn't about her.
5) I'm glad that Deobra posted the guarantee. I suspect that there was at least a handful of people that doubted that whole premise, and figured it was just a sales ploy.
6) I think that Deobra's approach in the classifieds rubbed a bunch of people the wrong way. Now, with her posting something questionable, it looks like some are overlooking her attempt to be forthright about the situation. I wonder how people would respond if someone with more experience posted that same snake, with the same explanation?

I agree, she can charge whatever price she wants, and if she finds someone who would play 150.00 for what is a 50.00 Pastel (see Genefreaks pictures of Pastels sold for 50.00) more power to her, but that doesn't make what she did "fortright" or even above board, in my opinion.

To be frank, I would not label her marketing ploy an "attempt to be forthright." Personally, I think Kevin nailed it. Forthright would be, I got suckered into buying a Pastel that was marketed as a "Super produced by someone that probably knew less about how genetics worked than I did. My loss is YOUR gain." By putting up the "You decide," in my opinion, it was an attempt to fool the next person that knew even less about genetics than she did and get some of her money back. If she honestly thought it was a Super Pastel as she's trying to imply that she doesn't reallllly know if it is or not, she had the choice of keeping it and proving it out herself.

That is a Pastel, no matter how ugly it is, a Super would never have a head THAT browned. As for "proving" it out, what happens if that ugly brown Pastel, just produces Pastels and Normals? By effectively NOT saying it's a NORMAL PASTEL, and not going back to the seller for her money or just swallowing the loss and selling it point blank as a Pastel, her marketing ploy is questionable at best and unethical at worse.

EXACTLY!

This particular one was unimpressive from hatching....I would be hard pressed to label it a super, even an ugly one, if I had produced it. I would have sold it as a nice pastel; and if was an ugly super - oh well At least my reputation would be intact, and my customer would be happy.

And her's is taking a hit for doing what she did even if she had the "Right" to do it.

Again, IMO- Now if someone else had done it...I would have said the same thing. Simply because someone has been in the business for a long time, that doesn't mean that the rules get bent for them. The generally accepted rule (GAR) is, if it doesn't have the distinguishing characteristics of that particular morph, it should not be marketed as that morph and if the seller does attempt to market it as a particular morph, he needs to be ready to defend his decision and prove it, or give a guarantee... (just saying).

Originally Posted by hhmoore

1) People can ask whatever price they want for their animals. I have alternately been criticized for both high and low prices...and those comments never compelled me to change my prices. If buyers think the price is too high, they won't pay it.
2) I asked Deobra if the guarantee was limited to her, as the original purchaser; or if it would cover the person she sells it to. She may not feel it is worth pursuing with the seller, but that is her choice...it's her snake, her sale.
3) FWIW, I'm not a huge BP fan - I don't spend a lot of time looking at ads (unless there is something specific I am looking for...and I have never considered adding a super pastel to my group), and I pretty much don't even look at BPs when I go to a show - and even I have seen "super pastels" that were virtually indistinguishable from regular pastels within a few months. This particular one was unimpressive from hatching....I would be hard pressed to label it a super, even an ugly one, if I had produced it. I would have sold it as a nice pastel; and if was an ugly super - oh well At least my reputation would be intact, and my customer would be happy.
4) I don't know the experience level of the original seller, so I won't comment further on her judgement - besides, this thread isn't about her.
5) I'm glad that Deobra posted the guarantee. I suspect that there was at least a handful of people that doubted that whole premise, and figured it was just a sales ploy.
6) I think that Deobra's approach in the classifieds rubbed a bunch of people the wrong way. Now, with her posting something questionable, it looks like some are overlooking her attempt to be forthright about the situation. I wonder how people would respond if someone with more experience posted that same snake, with the same explanation?

That snake is a pastel with a head stripe...no questions asked....I have seen a lot of pastels....a lot of supers....I even have a super sitting in my rack right now, who even in shed its easy to tell the difference.

that pastel has nearly 0 blushing anywhere on it...and does not portray the head blushing of a super AT ALL....and as a hatching is waaaay to dark for anyone who knows anything about genetics to even think it could be a super

this is what happens when someone buys the cheapest version of the morph they can find....instead of looking for even a TINY bit of quality in the snake

as a pastel...its average looking.....but its not a super...and should not even be hinted as one in the ad....because the only person who is going to fall for that is someone with less knowledge then Debora about pastels...and allowing that, or causing that is not reputable in most peoples eyes

Really?? Wow. Willow, Deborahbroadus and serpents den really seem to have it in for Deobra.
I say give it a rest.
She posted the sellers guarantee. I see nothing wrong here other than the berating of Deobra.

I don't have it in for her...my post was about the snake....the only thing I had to say about Deobra was she might need better skills at picking out quality animals....it can help her avoid this situation in the future....and help keep her from passing this problem to someone else

in fact personally I think Deobra should try dealing with the person who sold her the snake in the first place....as it would most likely work out better for her then not being able to sell this snake.