ignorent people letting illegal stuff happen

ok am I now posting in the right place hhmoore? I like the pm you sent me (Keep whining about your infraction on the BOI, and you'll find yourself with another one. You've already been advised to limit posting in that thread to the subject of Daniel Christian, and to take your other issues to Feedback.)
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Harald H Moore GGC #121 Looks like they allow illegal activity on here, some peoples nerve. Lets let people sell illegal animals and for the people that complain about it lets be a total a** about it. Im proving a point here where you guys let people sell illegal crap and then bitch to the people that say stuff about and do nothing to the people that are doing the illegal sh*t don't get anything there's the sense in that if any please explain away.

Calling people "ignorant" sure isn't going to gain you any favors.

Your anger, and sense of injustice, are out of control. It does not lend well to adult, professional, communication.

As Robert pointed out, "breath".

One thing I can assure you, the admins do not condone illegal activities nor scamming.

There is good reason to what the admins do or don't do. You really need to calm down, and, if they explain, try to understand the reasoning behind what they do or don't do.
Also, not everything they do is publicly visible.

It seems pretty clear that all the calm explanations that we could muster wouldn't be good enough to halt your little crusade. I think you should take the chip off your shoulder, untwist your panties and gently brush the sand from your vagina. Neither your treatment, nor the site's policies, have come even close to justifying the fit you've thrown. If you're looking to positively influence people into your way of thinking, you've failed miserably, on several levels. However, if you're actively trying to alienate yourself and needlessly irritate people, congratulations, mission accomplished.

Perhaps I can try to explain.

The moderation team enforces the rules on this site. There are specific rules that relate to the BOI (http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...ead.php?t=8880) and general rules for the site, such as no name calling, making threats, etc. Breaking the rules results in infractions. This link explains what the different infractions/rules are : http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=169831

What we do NOT do is act as judge/jury. That opens us up to liability and making judgement calls which can sometimes be a grey area, trying to weed out who might be lying or that type of thing.

What we DO is give users the tools to research and report those things so they can make their own best decisions for themselves. Tools such as the Board of Inquiry and trader rating system.

If you see something you believe is a scam or illegal, you can post a BOI inquiry or bad guy thread, then put a link in the ad as needed.

Here is a semi-recent thread where this type of thing is talked about, there are more of them here in the feedback forum if you choose to check them out
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=283253

Originally Posted by Levi4turtle

ok am I now posting in the right place hhmoore? I like the pm you sent me (Keep whining about your infraction on the BOI, and you'll find yourself with another one. You've already been advised to limit posting in that thread to the subject of Daniel Christian, and to take your other issues to Feedback.)
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Harald H Moore GGC #121 Looks like they allow illegal activity on here, some peoples nerve. Lets let people sell illegal animals and for the people that complain about it lets be a total a** about it. Im proving a point here where you guys let people sell illegal crap and then bitch to the people that say stuff about and do nothing to the people that are doing the illegal sh*t don't get anything there's the sense in that if any please explain away.

So who exactly are you accusing of being "ignorant"? Please check the spelling, btw.

Secondly, do you actually KNOW the definition of that word?

Thirdly, please define fully exactly what animals are illegal and exactly WHERE they are legal. ALL of them, everywhere. Federal, state, and local, all across the USA and internationally. You SERIOUSLY expect US to keep track of such things, each day, every day, everywhere? Have you looked up the word "ignorant" yet? Do you understand now what it means? Feeling kind of "ignorant" yourself right about now? Doesn't your demands of what you feel we are REQUIRED to do here just a mite bit on the side of ignorance?

Sorry, but no, it's not our job to enforce LAWS of any kind in any jurisdiction under any circumstances. We are not empowered with such authority and certainly are not going to take it upon ourselves to attempt such folly. I'll say it again for you: THAT IS NOT OUR JOB. Our JOB is really just to enforce the RULES of this site. And that is really just to try to keep things smooth running here. As for protecting anyone from anyone else, nope. We have provided some tools towards that end, but it's really up to you to utilize them. The tools are there to try to help you from making bad decisions, but ultimately the decision to do, or not do, something stupid, is entirely up to you. We are not going to ban someone for allowing you to make a dumb mistake buying or selling to them. We are not going to hold your hand and try to point out to you that you may be buying something that is illegal in some respect. We are NOT your daddy, I'm afraid. We're not even your friend. If you ignore all the tools and signs and still walk out in front of a bus, well, too bad, too sad.

Dealings between members on this site are between the consenting parties to engage in such business. It is completely up to THEM to determine whether or not what they are engaging in is legal for THEM. We do not, nor will ever, suggest, dictate, or imply that what business transactions members are engaging in are legal for them to do so. To even do so once would then set a precedent that any transactions allowed here ARE legal to do, and therefore expose this site to some substantial legal jeopardy because of that precedent. So I'm supposed to take on that sort of risk for you all to post FREE classified ads here? Yeah, right........

Now, if you feel that you need that sort of rubber baby buggy bumpering on sites where you wish to engage in business, then I'm sorry, but I really don't know who to suggest to you to go on off to in that pursuit. All I know is that THIS site is not it. And I'd be pretty surprised if any other site would knowingly go out on a limb such as that themselves. But if the way this site is being run doesn't satisfy you, then you are perfectly welcome to move on to someplace else more to your liking. I hope you will be just as happy with that outcome as I will be.

So, with all that in mind if you feel that someone is engaging in illegal activity, then contact the proper authorities that actually have jurisdiction over such activity. Seems pretty simple, doesn't it? Any reason WHY you feel you can't do that instead of lashing out at my moderator staff?

Speaking of which, let me get to another very important point: If you belittle or in any way backhand one of my moderators again on this site, I will personally give you the big boot right out of here. These guys are all volunteers here, and are helping me tremendously to manage this site by enforcing the rules that I have set in place, that in MY OPINION are best to try to make this place as smooth running as possible. They do not need to put up with someone's crap that is obviously IGNORANT about the way things are run here and is personally derogatory towards them as a result. I really appreciate their help, and quite frankly they just do not deserve being attacked by anyone.

So again, if you don't like the way I want this site to be run, and the way my moderators are helping me to run it in that fashion, sayonara Dude! Your search for the perfect website for you to make your home is still ongoing.

Originally Posted by AbsoluteApril

Perhaps I can try to explain.

The moderation team enforces the rules on this site. There are specific rules that relate to the BOI (http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...ead.php?t=8880) and general rules for the site, such as no name calling, making threats, etc. Breaking the rules results in infractions. This link explains what the different infractions/rules are : http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=169831

What we do NOT do is act as judge/jury. That opens us up to liability and making judgement calls which can sometimes be a grey area, trying to weed out who might be lying or that type of thing.

What we DO is give users the tools to research and report those things so they can make their own best decisions for themselves. Tools such as the Board of Inquiry and trader rating system.

If you see something you believe is a scam or illegal, you can post a BOI inquiry or bad guy thread, then put a link in the ad as needed.

Here is a semi-recent thread where this type of thing is talked about, there are more of them here in the feedback forum if you choose to check them out
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=283253

Your answer does not stop the illegal selling of native turtles nor does it resolve any issues. The simple fact is Moderators should know the native laws of each state. If their is one in question, such as this Daniel Christian dude, then his ad should be removed until he submits a picture copy of his permits in order to sell. Which in Ohio you MUST have to sell any Easterns. The fact you guys are giving a we are not responsible answer is the exact problem of encouraging a poacher to do what they are doing. Whether they were Captive Bred or not they must have a permit. Bet you if you ask him for a copy of his permit you will come up with a blank on this guy. So another Eastern Box Turtle taken out of the wild, you have a better responsibility then say you aren't responsible. The Ad should be removed until proven otherwise. Don't be apart of the problem be apart of the solution.

Originally Posted by EPBoxie

The simple fact is Moderators should know the native laws of each state.

Says who?

Please show we where and how, in fact, that what you claim IS a "simple fact" such as you are claiming.

Originally Posted by EPBoxie

The simple fact is Moderators should know the native laws of each state.

That is a ridiculous statement (and obviously not a 'fact'. Laws are not black and white, there are interpretations and opinions and circumstances.

If you are the one purchasing a critter YOU should know the pertinent statutes and not expect that a moderator will strap you in a high chair and spoon feed you that information.
You sound as if you are part of the Entitled Generation that expects everyone to trot around and work hard on your behalf. Welcome to the Real World.

Originally Posted by WebSlave

Says who?

Please show we where and how, in fact, that what you claim IS a "simple fact" such as you are claiming.

If you chose to be a moderator then you chose to have a greater responsibility to the site....right? So when illegal activity is present, you don't feel you have any thought on monitoring that ad? Hence, you witnessed a crime but decided to walk away? Its like saying I was promoted to become a police officer yet I never studied the laws. So its not my responsibility if someone does illegal stuff on my watch.

Originally Posted by EPBoxie

If you chose to be a moderator then you chose to have a greater responsibility to the site....right? So when illegal activity is present, you don't feel you have any thought on monitoring that ad? Hence, you witnessed a crime but decided to walk away? Its like saying I was promoted to become a police officer yet I never studied the laws. So its not my responsibility if someone does illegal stuff on my watch.

Sorry, but you simply need to take responsibility for your own understanding of the legality in what you engage in and not try to require others to do your work for you.

It's just not our job. Period. If you need an authority figure to do that for you, you have come to the wrong place.

Your convoluted attempts at logic and legal reasoning are falling way short of the mark. There are no crimes being committed on this site. Is the ADVERTISING of potentially illegal animals actually an overtly and provable illegal act? Not that I am aware of. There may be OFFERS to engage in activities that would potentially expose the PARTICIPANTS in such a transaction to illegal activities. Once a physical illegal act actually takes place, then the proper authorities for such matters are then able to become involved.

There are likely true authorities with jurisdiction over such matters (which does not include the staff of this site), and I fail to understand the reticence of some people to avail themselves of such services and agencies when they feel they are warranted by their suspicions. We are NOT a law enforcement agency. Never have been, are not now, and never will be.