Scam Artist Keven Vogenberger

Originally Posted by Wilomn

It wasn't you I was referring to. And mr clark did change. In the beginning, when he was doing ball pythons, he was a decent guy. Now, not so much.

I see.
I don't know much about Mr. Clark, so I cannot comment on that, other than there isn't any recent negative threads about him.

Originally Posted by Snake-Queen

I will say this, there doesn't appear to be any new BG threads on Ed for the past 6-7 years, that should say something.

I think it was some snark directed at me. Like you, I have observed that he has had no bad guy threads for a while and has racked up some positive feedback scores. But in one of the threads I specifically said recently that Ed doesn't get a pass for his transgressions.
Wes and I go way back, with his then girlfriend Rozann, who wanted us to talk to each other (even wanted us to fly out and meet one another). We talked a lot. But during hundreds of hours of conversations about politics, children, etc, he was never happy that I would not criticize Fauna, at the time, he had been banned from here a number of times and wanted me to agree that Rich was unfair, which I didn't. So every once in a while he gets a case of the nasties, because I wouldn't cave.

Originally Posted by Lucille

I think it was some snark directed at me. Like you, I have observed that he has had no bad guy threads for a while and has racked up some positive feedback scores. But in one of the threads I specifically said recently that Ed doesn't get a pass for his transgressions.
Wes and I go way back, with his then girlfriend Rozann, who wanted us to talk to each other (even wanted us to fly out and meet one another). We talked a lot. But during hundreds of hours of conversations about politics, children, etc, he was never happy that I would not criticize Fauna, at the time, he had been banned from here a number of times and wanted me to agree that Rich was unfair, which I didn't. So every once in a while he gets a case of the nasties, because I wouldn't cave.

ms. hollander, you are a bald faced liar.

No, Wes. You are a controller. I think you have some good qualities, but you start spewing vile nasty stuff when people disagree with you.

Originally Posted by Lucille

No, Wes. You are a controller. I think you have some good qualities, but you start spewing vile nasty stuff when people disagree with you.

Vile, nasty, truthsome, honest, tomato tomaato.

Please move on from this side disagreement.

Kevin is posting new animals. Frogs, to be exact, even though he has admitted that he knows nothing about frogs and can't tell when they are sick.

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=661662

Kevin, how can you justify selling frogs before knowing if the sick one is contagious?

Originally Posted by JCCS

If you had reservations about the ability of the buyer to care for the animals, you should not have sold them to her. Yes, she screwed up, she's a newb, they screw up, it's what they do. The point of an ethical seller is to set them up for success and that includes not selling to them if they do not seem ready. You were obviously suspicious that she was going to stick them in a 20 gallon, but you did not require proof of proper enclosure before shipping her the animals. I'm not claiming you owe her a refund or anything, I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy of your claims that you care for your animals more than anything while showing all the actions of a common, low level flipper.

I've purchased god know how many animals over the years ( some sellers here) and not a single seller asked if I knew how to care for them. It's up to the buyer to research the care of the animal their buying not the seller.
I don't know the seller nor do I know anything about him selling unhealthy animals.
My comment is in regards to your comment about him selling to her.

Joel, I've bought and sold many, many animals over the years. If I had any doubt, as Keven had expressed in this thread, that the person did not have the equipment/knowledge to properly care for the animal for sale. I sure as hell would have voided the transaction. Just from a business aspect, it's just an accident waiting to happen and a bunch of drama avoided. From the much more important aspect, I will not put animals in a place where I know they will not receive proper husbandry, period. Keven was the one who knew she didn't have the proper equipment and still just wanted the money bad enough to put the animal in a crappy situation. If you're fine with that, I just don't know what to say. Also, if you read the rest of the thread, you might get some more context on the whole situation.