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Old 01-07-2010, 02:00 PM   #31
Gary O
Hey Raymond nice to see you. Yeah you dont use tongs you just slap the head of the snake against your own untill it bites. Or force it to bite your arm. Yeah that is so much better.

I tell you this. If you think a human can not make a mistake then you sir are living with blinders on.
 
Old 01-07-2010, 02:03 PM   #32
Gary O
There is no reason to free handle a venomous or venomoid snake in public NONE!!!!

Ray you do not educate on the natural history of the snake you make it the main point to show you can take bites from your hacked snakes. That is not education.
 
Old 01-07-2010, 02:29 PM   #33
Strike_Force_Reptiles
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary O View Post
There is no reason to free handle a venomous or venomoid snake in public NONE!!!!

Ray you do not educate on the natural history of the snake you make it the main point to show you can take bites from your hacked snakes. That is not education.
educational means teaching something productive about the snakes not making yourself look stupid thanks for pointing that 1 out Gary
Ray is not someone to learn from
 
Old 01-07-2010, 03:58 PM   #34
adder
Flame suit on

Dear all, someone here got it right when they said the Australian government is screwed up.
I wrote a couple of relevant books about it.
They are called "Smuggled: The Underground Trade in Australia's wildlife".
And "Smuggled-2".
With S273 coming along in the USA, maybe a few so-called herpers should take a read of the books to see what's coming to "the land of the free" and pull your fingers out to stop the rot!
Mmm, maybe some of you are too busy whtie-anting the herp community by your irrational anti-venomoid zealotry, that plays straight into the arms of HSUS and the like...
Anyway, Gary, your posts about the video are as usual totally misleading.
The video made that you refer to is not a daily occurrence for snake shows here.
It was made in response to a non-stop barrage of false claims on the web on sites you frequent, stating that our venomoids had regenerated venom and were a mortal public risk.
Fact is none have!
And if you read my other post on this forum, you'd recall my comments about how amazing this is, considering I am allegedly an idiot who hacks up snakes in the comfort of my garage with kitchen knives and I'd also allegedly have trouble distinguishing a venom gland from a subcaudal scale.
You may recall that after posting a Taipan bite on the web, I was falsely accused of faking the pic, so the next logical step was to do a series of bites in front of a public audience, as seen in the video.
At least no one accused me of faking it, but as we all know, the "truth haters" raise all these idiot objections, like "what if a kid tries this?".
That we know is bullshit, because no kid would have access to the world's deadliest snakes in such a way as to line them up to bite them.
And here's a simple number to remember - as a result of our world-leading demonstrations (yes our venomoids do snake shows DAILY, which was actually the first justification for the operation - the second and more relevant is the welfare benefits for the snakes - no tongs here!), NO CHILD IN VICTORIA has died from snakebite in Victoria in the six years of our venomoid shows and this is testimony to our success as the main and market dominating snake show in the state.
Noting that we are also top-rated in Schools also by independent comparisons and that teachers are lining up for us, it rebuts the claims our shows are misleading impressionable young kids.
Victoria went from highest death from snakebite rate in Australia (predating our shows) to lowest (for which we, Snakebusters and staff, singularly take full credit) and Gary, you can't argue with the scoreboard ... maybe you will?
As for cruelty, the venomoid operation isn't cruel, free handling is good for the snakes.
Making snakes bite me is an act of cruelty and something I wouldn't do any more than neccessary (we've made about ten such videos and solely for the basis of shuting up the liars and "truth haters"), and the cruelty is that I taste of lettuce and that is not the natural diet of snakes.
PS If you want to say I taste like shit, I'll put up with that too!
PPS You may also notice from our videos that contrary to the crap I see on the web about snakes being aggressive, Taipans, Death Adders and the like are not man-eating monsters itching to kill people.
PPPS I have just loaded a load of elapids into the car for another series of shows today and two lots were mating and NONE had any interest in biting... but of course those who think they know better will continue to post misguided crap about venomoids here and elsewhere and as this happens S273 will roll on unopposed ... and when it hits I will know who to blame!
ALL THE BEST
RAYMOND HOSER:2gu nsfiri
 
Old 01-07-2010, 04:52 PM   #35
Gary O
Fact is you slapped the heads of venomous snakes against your own head to make them bite. You forced the animal to bite your arm.

You say it is not a normal thing you do. But that is all I have seen you do. In two different set ups I believe one was indoors and the other was an outdoor show.

Their was no need for it.

Venomoids are the unloaded gun of the venomous world.
 
Old 01-07-2010, 05:27 PM   #36
hhmoore
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder View Post
those who think they know better will continue to post misguided crap about venomoids here and elsewhere and as this happens S273 will roll on unopposed ... and when it hits I will know who to blame!
R-r-i-i-i-i-i-i-i-ight. Because people are so simple minded that they can't manage to refocus on other things after a prancing pony passes the window. Sure, the spectacle might catch people's eye - and, surely, that was the intent - but after we spend a few minutes on Did you see that? (or, What a friggin idiot, as the case may be) most of us can snap ourselves out of it and get on with our lives.

BTW, proper use of a snake hook is no more traumatizing to a snake than being lifted by a hand....or maybe you do things differently in Australia?
 
Old 01-08-2010, 08:16 AM   #37
adder
Well I think I won the argument.
I pointed out that there was misinformation here about telling the difference between venom gland and muscle and all I got in response was "venomoids are butchered snakes", your venomoid bite videos are shockers and similar.
That view is fine, but please stick to telling the truth about things.
Lets try starting with "venomoid by definition means NO VENOM" ... easy!
 
Old 01-08-2010, 08:29 AM   #38
Lucille
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder View Post
Well I think I won the argument.
I pointed out that there was misinformation here about telling the difference between venom gland and muscle and all I got in response was "venomoids are butchered snakes", your venomoid bite videos are shockers and similar.
That view is fine, but please stick to telling the truth about things.
Lets try starting with "venomoid by definition means NO VENOM" .
Win? Argument? Ahhh, I see, instead of a discussion, sharing information, you seem to be trying to direct the conversation, wanting it to be YOUR way.

Unfortunately, it is not. Venomoid surgery is not an exact science. So if you are standing over a dead person who THOUGHT he was handling a venomoid, and got tagged, and died as a result, and you are smiling down on the dead body and saying 'venomoid by definition means NO VENOM' why yes, you won. Happy?
 
Old 01-08-2010, 08:53 AM   #39
adder
lucille - you have a point - we shouldn't be arguing.

But what am I to do when I point out an obvious piece of
misinformation, only to have a bunch of argumentative people
changing the subject to an irrelevant video that shows nothing like an operation or the difference between muscle and organ, which was the basis of my first post here (please read it, instead of jumping the gun).
The video the referred to by Gary O and others only relates to another bit of a lie in that the said snakes had regenerated venom, which the video more than adequately disproves, totally pissing off the liars!

If you jump off a cliff and kill youself I will stand over your dead body and say, "humans can fly ... but better to have tried a helicopter!"

Ah yes, back to S273, one idiot kills themselves when drunk with a Broghammerus, so we ban all pythons. Makes sense yeh?

Try joining HSUS!

It's the same lies and Zealotry we see against venomoids.

If you have any concern for the welfare of people, reptiles or the legitimate passtime of keeping snakes in boxes, redirect your anger towards those trying to stop the hobby and not the sometimes legit use of devenomized snakes for the snake's own welfare and/or public safety.

ALL THE BEST
 
Old 01-08-2010, 09:03 AM   #40
adder
Exact science - yes it is...

Lucile,
you wrote:

"Venomoid surgery is not an exact science. "

I beg to differ - it is. There's even textbooks about it. Try Doug Mader's for a start...(mm, let me guess, you've never heard of him or some other Funky dude called Dr Richard?)

Here's the science part that is EXACT.

"See gland, cut whole thing out as well as nearby duct and mucle ball at rear (you probably didn't know they looked like this, because you don;t get that off the web)! - Simple"

As for other operation, TEST later to make sure it worked.

Person who doesn't do test is idiot.

Simple.

PS Don't buy a used venomoid from a car dealer...

PPS If yellowish stuff still comes out of fang and snake is missing testicles, you probably cut the wrong end!

Hope this makes sense.

Raymond
 

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