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Old 01-11-2010, 01:24 AM   #82
Strike_Force_Reptiles
very good post! the only problem is that they need venom to digest food is still unproven so that needs to be fixed
 
Old 01-11-2010, 02:07 AM   #83
hhmoore
I haven't had a chance to look at the links (though I'm sure I've viewed them before), and I have been out of hots for some time....my understand was that the whole "need venom for digestion" argument was not applied to hots in general, but to certain types. (ie montane vipers and pit vipers that are regularly exposed to cooler temps. The premise being that the action of the venom sped the digestion, reducing the risk to the snake during colder periods.) Is that no longer thought to be the case?
 
Old 01-11-2010, 09:23 AM   #84
Strike_Force_Reptiles
that could be why the digestion arguement is still at hand, it is still unproven though that hots in captivity where temps are monitored need venom to digest food. although i'm still not knocking the idea that they do but until it is proved one way or another i cant say either way. i'ld rather be positive than to send false signals to anyone. also as far as the venomoids shouldnt be used for educational things that the links say, they are looking at it as if you will be free handling them like Crazy Ray lol. that is also not true and should not be done. i do not free handle mine at educational shows. i simply pull them out with a hook and put them 5' - 6' from me and also use the hook to extend them so that the kids can see their pattern good so i can point out markings and help them id the snakes incase they do find them selves running up on 1 they know to get away and leave it alone. i also use a 6@1/2' plexiglass cage around me to help in keep the snakes from getting loose from me. thats just another way i promote safty. i for no reason will free handle venomous or venomoid. the only way i would is if it did get loose and get close to someone watching and then ild snatch it up and take my chances but so far have never had that happen. its goes back to responsibility. and again i am in no way promoting the ownership of venomoids because i prefer hots but i do think its best to use venomoids for (REAL)educational shows for extended safty reasons. i also say this again venomoids are not 100% safe so procations should always be taking. i go the extra mile to protect my customers and others around me as should all herpers.

ok this was my last post lol just had to get that out there
 
Old 01-11-2010, 12:39 PM   #85
Gary O
I do not agree with taking out a venomoid or enomous snake in an educational show. If the animal is out of the cage anything can happen. I personally will leave them in LOCKED cage and the kids can walk by the cages at some point of the show.

No need to even put a little danger out there when it comes to children.

Why you ask. I think of venomoids as the unloaded gun. How many times have you heard sorry thought the gun was unloaded. What happens if the snake gets loose from you and does bit a kid and so an invection happens. Papers will say VENOMOUS SNAKE BITES CHILD IN EDUCATIONAL SHOW........

Bad press for us is bad press. We like to just stay out of the news.

Not being mean to you at all. But no reason to take a venomous snake out in public
 
Old 01-11-2010, 12:48 PM   #86
Strike_Force_Reptiles
when you have a 6 @ 1/2' plexiglass cage (cage is 6 @ 1/2' tall x 8' wide x 8' deep) completely around you and you are inside with the snake the child can not get too it and is practically impossible for the snake to get loose. i just use venomoids just as extra procation. unless those snakes can jump 6@1/2' there is noway they can get out of that but i always go the extra mile for safty. the floor of the cage is made so i can bolt the glass to it so no going under it. its basically a snake cage but big enough for me, the snake, and the show. i will get a few pics of my setup and post them on here as soon as i get my new cam. i dropped my other one and broke it a few weeks ago.
 
Old 01-11-2010, 12:56 PM   #87
Gary O
Then you are doing it for you more so then the children. Not fighting but if you are in a cage to small like that it is another reason not to hae a venomous snake out. When it comes to venomous snakes and public no reason they need to leave the cage. The public does not need to see how they are handled becuase they should not handle them.

On thing I have noticed about venomous educational shows. People forget aout the venomous education part and just say the guy had a cobra or had a viper.

IMO there is no room for venomoids. All venomoids are made for is to put venomous snakes into the hands of people that should not own a venomous snake. There is a clear danger in venomoids. I would not have so much of an issue if these people that made them would talk about the clear dangers...........
 
Old 01-11-2010, 01:04 PM   #88
Gary O
And just to say one more time I am not putting down what you do. You seem to have a very level head on your shoulders. It works for you. I just do not agree with it. Does not mean I hate you lol
 
Old 01-11-2010, 01:14 PM   #89
Strike_Force_Reptiles
i do not do it for me. i have been bit more times than i can remember by venomous not venomoids. i could have been killed when i was 5 because i didnt know what snakes were and sure didnt know they could kill me and when i was left outside alone i found 3 baby copperheads that i started to poke and then i ran got a big mason jar came back and picked them up and put them in the jar. i played another 45 mins or an hour then took them in the house to show my mom. lucky they didnt bite me cause i was the kinda kid that wouldnt run tell mom i got hurt i would just keep playing. yes copperheads a very rare to kill someone but a 5 year old could die from 1. i want to teach these kids what they look like, and what to do if they see one as well as what not to do. i do not do shows for kids with exotics only snakes from our state. parents dont seem to watch their kids anymore and therfore kids can get into all kinds of thing including venomous snakes. it is better to do all you can to stop it before it happens than to wait til after it happens and wonder what could i have done to stop it. i could bring up how dangerous it could be to do shows with large non venomous but then everyone would just say its not dangerous lol an animal is an animal and they are just like us with there good days and their bad days, at anytime those nice snakes can say ok ive had enough. try getting a 18' burm off a 10 year old or even and adult. the fact is responsibility remains on the handler not on what others think so if the handler feels he should go the extra step to use a venomoid for extra safty to protect others then great and if not and something does happen we could all wonder if only... going the extra mile to keep yourself and others around you safe is responsability. short cuts should never be taken
 
Old 01-11-2010, 01:15 PM   #90
Strike_Force_Reptiles
lol no worries Gary, we are just laying down and viewing others sides. no harm done at all. i respect your views as well
 

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