And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson)

Author Subject: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson)
Jordan Russell Posted At 21:35:44 02/24/2001
I feel like I must have "sucker" written on my forehead with the last few deals that have happened. Avoid this person at all costs he WILL burn you.

I had an existing business relationship with Dan for over 8 months with buying/selling/ trading with him. He told me about a 64' ford full ton he had for sale we came to an agreement of $1,000 in trade which was 1.1 adult LTC crocodile monitors & $1,000 cash then $1,500 in payments.

He agreed to deliver the truck to the last irba show in san diego then I couldn't get ahold of him for the show. Well what came out after he had all of the money and the lizards was they he owed back registration on the truck. I asked him how much he said not much but he will take care of it. Well finally after going back and forth he said he got ahold of DMV and it was $580 he owed. I said well can't you pay that with the $1,000 I sent you? He said that money was spent..

I then agreed to meet him up about 3 hours south of his house at a bird show I was doing with $500 for him for the registration he agreed and it was set... well the 2 days before and all weekend long I couldn't get ahold of him. He said he had been trying to get ahold of me, hmm... for 4 days I had been calling and then he says he couldn't get ahold of me????

All in all he has told me to screw off and that he doesn't owe me anything anymore after I asked him just to send me $2K in animals back and we will be square. He has womas,super tiger retics, tiger retics, jungle carpets and a whole bunch of other stuff he COULD send me to be square but he says he doesn't want to part with them. Now he wont return calls or emails. It's been way too long. I have bills and money out and money I need to send to people that is on hold because I had to buy a new truck just so that I can work. Totally ridiculous!

I have saved emails if anyone is interested in them. This guy is BAD NEWS!!!


I have spoken with a few other people and heard of 2 other people that were taken by him.

If you have had a bad deal with him let me know I am doing everything legal possible to take care of him and I could use the support.

thanks,
Jordan Russell
Dan Atkinson Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 22:19:58 02/25/2001

All I can is this is a lie!
I never go to these sights most of the guys that do are a bunch of wining punks. Just like Jordan.
The rest of you guy just have nothing better to do. There are better ways of finding out about a personís character than a forum. Especially one that you can post what ever you want, about who ever you want.

I donít have the time for this but I did want to address the fact that this is a bunch of BS!!
Iv been screwed SO BAD this year im sickened by the whole reptile industry.
This $2000 that Jordan sent me was a deposit!
$1000 in cash and a pair of crock monitors.
HE could not finish his payments, he still owes me $1500. He could not afford to come up and pick up the truck and ask if I would deliver it. I said I would try, but I did not go to the show in S. California this year.

As for meeting him to get $500 and then let him take off back to LA with my truck and pay me later $1000,
ď I did not trust him, end off story.Ē
He has not had a job since IV known him, he sleeps in till 1:00 pm every day and I was afraid he would screw me like the rest of the guys IV trusted this last year.

Most of what the KID posts on kingsnake is not his its called brokering. He is not a breeder, or a dealer. just a kid that lives with mommy and sissy.

HE asks me for a refund! I told him I was not prepared to refund his money but I would work with him.
Tell me what the heck is a deposit???
It is to secure the fact that you have bought an idem. RIGHT OR WRONG??
Jordan Who dose not work! Could not finish his payment to me.
I was however willing to refund his money. I did tell him he would have to wait.
The last I heard he was OK with this. Then I get an email from a friend pointing me to this trash. Believe what you will I could give a squat!


So all will no, not that its any of your business, as of me reading this post Mr. Russell has lost his deposit. I have been more than fair and now im finished.
Thanks Jordan youíre a class act.
And a lying piece,......

Dan Atkinson
Jordan Russell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 2 replies)
Posted At 23:14:46 02/25/2001

This shows the character of the person I have been dealing with fully I think. First off that was not a deposit oh and for it to be a non-refundable deposit as you are claiming it was (which it wasn't) you would have to notify me of it in advance YOU DIDN'T. On top of that you didn't trust me? I had sent you thousands of dollars in animals and had you owe me later and vice versa and more than one occasion so the trust issue is a total lie.

As far as you saying I couldn't afford to send you the money that is also a total lie I have had the money on more than one occasion but the last thing I was going to do was send you another $1,500 after you had lied to me and never shown up on the two occasions you were supposed to deliver the truck. I had given you months to make good and send the animals you never did cash was an option too!

On top of that the back registration that was never mentioned until after you had my money was a really nice too. I just hope no one else has to go through this too.

As far as me not working, oh well neither do you this is just mudslinging I think that just about everyone knows that I broker animals that is not something I am ashamed of or try and hide like you are making it sound. I have my breeders and I broker too I don't see why this was brought up but whatever....

Also brokering has brought in 2-3 times per month as I did working, so why work??? I would rather do what I like and have fun doing it, sad when you get taken down through the mud by scum that rips you off when you do nothing but right by people.

you are a total hypocrit and a liar, you will get yours.... karma...

We'll see how the judge decides.

Jordan
Dan Atkinson Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 00:20:47 02/26/2001

This is the way KIDS do business.

He said, she said. Bunch of crap.

Jordan if you had the $1500 a bunch of times why,....why all the games?
Give me a break. If you would have paid for the truck with all this cash that you had then you could have drove it home.
I have a few emails stating you were going to fly up with your Bro. And pick up the truck. Then you did not have all the cash wanted to no if I could still drive it to you.

If you have (but you no thatís BS) had the cash then youíre a liar and a fool. The truck has been here, and still is.
I have busted my but keeping a clean name on Kingsnake and elsewhere. Its little crap like this that makes my skin crawl.
I should not have to air my affairs in public just because you have a wild hair. Grow up.
You can have your truck and be out $0,Ö. but now I would like payment in full. And I want it in 30 days or less Mr. I have the cash!

As far as sending me thousands of dollars worth of reptiles, youíre stoned. We have done a few trades thatís it. NO CASH EVER!
Need we bring up some of the conditions the snakes I have gotten from you were in?? Donít think you want to go their bud.
So donít push it.

I have been dealing with a father that has had 3 strokes in the last year, and is now on his deathbed in North Carolina.
My kid brother has come down with cancer at the age of 29, if he dies it leave a nephew of mine in New Mexico to worry about, and loads of other things.
Being injured at work and almost losing my house,.......starting a new career,Ö.so on and so on.

Do these thing matter, NO!
But there reasons why things happen, thing that we have already spoke about.
Has any one seen me on Kingsnake in the last few months??
I used to be on there everyday. Thatís why allot of you may no me. Iv sold $1000 worth of reptiles on the net. Foresthill Serpentarium and Cold-Blooded Reptiles these have both been me for the past 5 years.
And now because of this accusation I have to post my business, or be marked a crook!!!

Reasons why im selling $5500 trucks for $3500, Boats for $2500 that are worth twice that.
These are MY family affairs now I have to air my business in front of 10000 of folks so they can try and see my side of this.
I donít get it Jordon, we spoke 2 weeks ago. What the hell is your deal?

You have my freaking # use it!

This is why I donít go to these forums. There are always two sides. The liar will look as good as he wants. Iím not saying Jordan is a liar, but we should have got a few things in writing because there are a few different ideas on the matter of how the truck would get to the LA area. I NEVER said delivery was part of the deal, only that if I go to the show I might be able to follow my wife and drive it. Besides a few misunderstandings, I have kept a good name in this reptile business. But little stunts like these are the reasons Iím done.

Am I going to screw you over on this truck!
NO, but Iíll be damed if you will get a refund after this stunt.
Bring me $1500 CASH pick up the truck and go back to bed!
But leave me out of your little crap.

End of story.

Sorry all, I did not start this and I think it it
BULL @%&* that it can go on so easy.
These places would be OK, if you could be sure everything you read was the whole story!

Dan Atkinson


Jordan Russell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 01:03:00 02/26/2001

Ok first off Dan, why don't you calm down and try and remember the truth this is just becoming a verbal war with no facts I am going to break this down and address every issue and let the truth be known.




The only games that have been played here are the ones by you and hiding stuff about the truck from me. As far as me not sending you the $1,500 after you had my money and had lied and fell through on multiple occasions on delivering the truck why would I send you another $1,500 so I could be out $3,500?? Screw me once your'e a fool screw me twice I'm a fool, only happened once and now you are going to be made a fool.



I have a few emails stating you were going to fly up with your Bro. And pick up the truck. Then you did not have all the cash wanted to no if I could still drive it to you.>

Yes I had talked about My brother and I flying up to get the truck since you couldn't come through and deliver it as you said you would, you had said you would cover the $580 in back registration but then when it came down to it you said I would have to pay that when I came up there, so it would have been $580 + $300 in plane tickets $200 in gas and motels. I didn't have that much money at that time then my brother got another job and he was unable to go up there with me and I wasn't going to drive down a fixer upper from the totally other end of the state by myself.

Also I have (although I shouldn't have to prove it to you.) had the money on multiple occasions note the new cages, ackies boas, pythons and my new TRUCK. On top of that as of 2 months ago you WERE STILL replying to my phone calls and emails and you had said on the phone that you would have money for me in a matter of 3 weeks and would get the rest when you could, then you wouldn't return phone calls or emails.


Need we bring up some of the conditions the snakes I have gotten from you were in?? Donít think you want to go their bud.
So donít push it.>

We had done trades worth thousands of dollars, remember the cash I sent you and the animals I sent to make up the balance on that $2,300 order with the San Diego Gopher group, the king group, rosies etc....

As far as the animals being in bad health the ONLY time you ever recieved anything in bad health was a pair of bali retics that I GAVE to you. Animal control had came in and searched my house when I was not home the room mate had let them in, when I came home they had smashed the head on one of my bali retics and the other didn't look good but not THAT bad. The other was as good as dead I was sending you some 66% het albino retics and an adult female red blood so I said I would throw them in the box, northwest delayed the box and they went out of state rather than going straight to you and they arrived dead, my fault?? I don't think so.


My kid brother has come down with cancer at the age of 29, if he dies it leave a nephew of mine in New Mexico to worry about, and loads of other things.
Being injured at work and almost losing my house,.......starting a new career,Ö.so on and so on.>

I hate to be rude and as sad as this is I have been more than fair and waiting this has been going on since october! I was told you were going to try and get me some money back as you got it you have made no effort and have been avoiding me so I have had enough.

But there reasons why things happen, thing that we have already spoke about.
Has any one seen me on Kingsnake in the last few months??
I used to be on there everyday. Thatís why allot of you may no me. Iv sold $1000 worth of reptiles on the net. Foresthill Serpentarium and Cold-Blooded Reptiles these have both been me for the past 5 years.
And now because of this accusation I have to post my business, or be marked a crook!!!>

Actually Dan, you have been having other people post things for you. Anthony your friend from NY was posting your male super tiger retic on there for you(which I emailed you and asked you why you were hiding and having him do it for you.) the ad was very suspicious so I had a friend email him and ask about it and get a pic and sure enough its your snake with a pic right off of your photopoint page, why are you hiding behind these people if you are so honest??




I have been calling you and emailing you for weeks you are screening your calls and won't return messages, I HAVE BEEN USING YOUR NUMBER!



First off you had told me that you WERE going to the IRBA show and that when I sent you the money you would make arrangements to bring it down to the show and stay with me if need be, then you told me you had found a discount thing on the internet for plane tickets for $48 and that you and your wife would be able to fly back with these discounts.

As far as your good reputation from the people I have asked around on you about I have heard nothing good, infact I was even told about some long term captives you sold to a person and they came in emmaciated and totally in horrible condition one even was said to have had a stick stuck in it's side! When the person told you about it and confronted you on it you threatened to kick his ass and said you were going to be there and beat the crap out of him, he even sent you a map you never showed!

NO, but Iíll be damed if you will get a refund after this stunt.
Bring me $1500 CASH pick up the truck and go back to bed!
But leave me out of your little crap.>

As far as your idle threats and ultimatums I am not going to deal with it, I had to go out and buy another truck which was 3 times as much btw, because you never came through I don't want it now that all of this has happened you can send me back payments or send me animals totalling $2K or I WILL take legal action and believe me I WILL.

Why don't you think about that and grow up and take responsibility for your actions instead of point fingers and calling names.

Jordan









Jordan Russell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 02:18:44 02/26/2001

I don't know why it didn't show what I cut and pasted or why the font changed but sorry if its hard to read.

Jordan
john Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 07:30:59 02/26/2001

jordan is an honest guy
so what if he brokers animals
they are all healthy
the problem is no face to face
that is how jordan got screwed
as i said before
if there was more up front and face
to face this would not have happened
as most people are cowards
wouldn't you agree dan
food for thought
john
Dan Atkinson Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 08:07:12 02/26/2001

OK, Jordan I take it back you are a liar!
And im done airing my affairs on the net.

I do think its funny that you never had the money to finish paying for the truck now you go and buy a new one. Oh well your loss bud. Like I said after what you did here, we are done.

I'm not going to address that long piece of work you just posted.
One thing thou, you keep bringing up regeneration on the truck being hidden? It was never an issue.
The registration on the truck was not an extra $500 It was to come out of the $3500 you owed! So stop talking about it like it was an extra $500 you did not no about.
Your total on the truck was always $3500.
As far as being ripped off I was the only one that would be out $$. You had nothing to worry about.
Had you done as you said and picked up the truck.
You were going to come out and pick up the truck only giving me $500 (leaving with my truck owing me $1000)
Air fair from LA to Sacramento is $69 one way. Plus gas back and your done. Iím glade you never did it, as I doubt you would have made good on the $1000.
You were never worried about being ripped off for any more money. It was to be handed to me, and then you left with my truck! So youíre full of it. Any one that reads this crap and thinks about it is going to wonder "WHY" you did not just fly out give me the $500 as you said and youíre done.
Sounds stupid, since you had the money I mean!! You just never had the money!!
You wanted your money back and I was willing to do that but as I said in my time.
We are done, have a lawyer contact me, Please take all the action you want.

Dan

PS....The super tiger was sold to Anthony Marino for $1000.
I have nothing to hide. I still have a Kingsnake account. Enjoy your new truck!

TC Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 11:42:23 02/26/2001

You know it's funny, but if you take a look at the posts, the one that sounds like a whiny little kid is YOU, Dan.
Looks like you would rather sling mud than solve the problem.
Besides, if YOU are right, don't ya think it's kinda cruddy to take advantage of a kid?
You seemed to treat him as an adult in all of your dealings for 8 months, then all of a sudden you are mad when you can't get one over on him?
Pretty childish....don't ya think?
TC Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 19:22:56 02/26/2001

Maybe you should read who posted before you reply.
This was my first post on the subject from a completely unbiased point of view.
I have never met Jordan before in my life.
Just happened to notice his posts seemed a lot more mature than yours.
My "un-asked for" .02................buddy.
TC
Jordan Russell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 19:59:32 02/26/2001

I just wanted to say that my point was made people have been warned about this guy I am not going to continue posting on this thread as all that is happening is mudslinging. The rest will be taken up through court, thanks for your support.

Sincerely,
Jordan Russell
Sal Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 20:52:29 02/26/2001

Mr. Atkinson....in all the above commotion, I noticed that Jordan did send you a pair of crocs and a thousand dollars...as you say a "deposit"....your reason(s) for not refunding it is because you didn't have all of it, and wanted to work something out, and then Jordan posted his opinion of you and his dealings, so forget his deposit?...and you are accusing Jordan of doing business like a kid?....you think it's allright to keep his animals/money 'cause he said something you didn't like?...that's both unprofessional and illegal....much less childish and immature..kinda like discussing Jordan's personal life here in the forum....another classy and mature act on your part....but hey!!....I'm just another whiner who comes to these boards....one that you never, ever, ever have to worry about selling a thing to.....just my two cents!!!
Bill Ryder Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 22:38:48 02/26/2001

Dan,

You had asked if a deposit is a deposit. I'm not going to comment on all the back and forth but $2000 in cash and animals is a lot of loot. I don't care what you call it, if you've given up nothing, but are holding Jordan's $2000, the right thing to do is give it back. Bottom line, you have a dispute over what the terms were before hand. It doesn't matter who's telling the truth. Basically there is a dispute and the only way to set things straight is basically to start over, meaning give the money back.

You then have the right to be very mad at Jordan and even to post the episode here perhaps. But you can't hold the guy's $2000 having given nothing up in return. Again its just a matter of rightousness and honor. And the thing is, even if Jordan didn't honor a promise, that won't being nearly as bad as what you do if you keep the money.

This is even more true if Jordan is a kid as you say. In fact, given this...its a matter of law. A minor can't enter into a contract. So if it goes to court, Jordan will get his money back anyway.

This is all none of my business. I only answer because you had asked the question about deposits. I take deposits on occasion just to see if the person is serious about buying before I hold. But in the end if the person pulls out, I refund the money. In fact, I had a guy pay me in full and request that I not ship for a couple weeks, who then decided he wanted out of the deal (a $500 deal for frilleds). I even worked with this person, reselling the animals and sending him back a check for the full amount. Was I pissed? Yes. But in the end you have to sleep at night, and our system is such that if you take something for nothing, its suppose to make you feel bad. Especially a full 2 grand just because your truck sale fell through. Just go resell the thing thing. At least, that's my opinion.
PBM Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 23:09:40 02/26/2001

WHY is this post on here? Has nothing at all to do with reptiles. I am very interested as to why this is even in here. You all need to settle this on your own. Gonna go to court? Go then. Not going to, then let it go. Just quit wasting space with this. I didn't read all the posts, they are all the same anyway. Just take care of the problems on your own. This has nothing to do with any of us. Keep it that way! Nothing against either one of you, but this really doesn't pertain to reptiles in ANY way. Best of luck to both of you!
Jordan Russell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 03:11:31 02/27/2001

I wasn't going to post but I wanted to clarify that this WAS reptile related he is a fellow reptile broker/breeder and I traded crocodile monitors towards the truck. He is in the business and I thought it would be wise to post something for people to avoid him as I wish someone had done for me.

thanks,
Jordan
Dan Atkinson Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 11:52:28 02/27/2001

I canít believe im even replying to this crap!
But, since we have all these opinions.
I said in my first post and im pasting it in here!

"HE could not finish his payments, he still owes me $1500. He could not afford to come up and pick up the truck and ask if I would deliver it. I said I would try, but I did not go to the show in S. California this year." Did you miss this?

How about this did you miss the below also??
ďYou can have your truck and be out $0,Ö. but now I would like payment in full. And I want it in 30 days or less Mr. I have the cash!Ē

I have NEVER not sent him his reptiles, or refused him anything. Is that not the issues here, on this Good guy Bad guy thing!!!!

I even told him give me a few and Iíll refund ALL of your cash. Something most of you sticking your two cents in probably would not do.

I also said. ďBringĒ not send. John, I would rather have had this face to face. Are you people reading this or just wanting to put in your two cents.

I will not refund Jordanís anything after this!
I will allow him to finish what he started. Pay me in person $1500 and take the truck.
I ran a local add turned down 3 buyers because I told Jordan, (at that time a friend) I would let him have it. There are a lot of issues here and im not going to type all day to address them all.

Bottom line: If I bought a reptile from any of you for $2000 say. I sent you $300 in cash and $300 in trade.
2 months later I changed my mind. You tell me Iíll refund your money but you'll have to wait I donít have it I have some issues im dealing with here. I have turned down other buyers that would have bought these. I wish I new you were going to do this.
You say OK, and next thing you no you see me posting your a crook because you are taking to long to pay me back. Sound fair? If he changed his mind which at this point it is what I think he did. What do I get for waiting 6 months calling him back for 3 of those?
Phone bills, ads that I ran on the truck, calls I answered! Give me a break there are a lot of things to address. And I think PBM hit this on the nose. WHY IS THIS HERE???

The point is in my posts and on the phone to him. Iv never said, Jordan your taking to long to pay me, you forfeit the truck!
Iv been waiting for my $1500! Not him, are you people reading? I even told the "KID" I Understand you donít have all the money Come up with your Brother, as he said he was going to. Just give me the $500 (again being a friend) for the back tags and pay me the rest WHEN YOU GET IT!!!! I did not want to get $1000 in cash, and $500 goes on the back tags so he could drive it home. And end up with a pair of Crock Mon. that I did not want, and could not sell!
The truck is worth 2 times what he is buying it for. I have $4500 in the motor and trans.
YOU PEOPLE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT.

I have been very understanding and have worked with this kid on every level!
Now im getting hammered because he has time to do this.
A friend emailed me this link again today or I would have never even came back here! I think this forum is a JOKE!

The post that has my name on it in small caps is not mine, the one between TC. See how easy it is to put crap on here.
All of these posts that are not mine could in fact be Jordan. Under a different name. That is why these are worthless

How have I been screwing this "kid" HOW AM I NOT ACTING LIKE AN ADULT HERE!! Kiss my ever loven @$*&%!!
You have no idea what you are even giving your opinion on! I have been more than fair here. I posted Jordan you will be out $0 just bring (as we agreed earlier in this deal) My $500 up and drive the truck home (owing me $1000). Iv been waiting for him to finish paying me off for 6 months!!
Now he says in his posts he has had the money all along. In fact he bought a new truck!!
So what,Ö. you have been wasting my time? And admit it, and thatís OK?????

I see, so now im suppose to send him back his money. Repost an add in the local Sacramento Bee (which cost me $50 last time) answer all the calls again. And resell this truck.
Because this "KID" changed his mind!!!!
And posted all this crap about me!

Yah,....I can see all of you doing that.
The truck is here and he has 30 days to pick it up, IV waited long enough.

Longer than most of you would have im sure!

Have a nice day.
Dan Atkinson


PSÖ.If you have dealt with me, you know im very honest and a good herper.

I donít care what is posted after this im not wasting any more time.
I donít have it to spare
Jordan Russell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 14:44:42 02/27/2001

ok there is seriously a problem here I did not post the above message why are people posting things under alias's????? Dan claims it was done to him. If you feel the need to post in this matter do it correctly and post under your real name this matter has enough problems there is no need for added problems.

Thank you,
Jordan Russell
Webmaster Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 15:28:32 02/27/2001

OK. We've got a troll loose among us here. I've removed the offending messages from this
guy. He has been trolling here for a while, according to my usage files, and this isn't the
only thread he has posted messages using a false ID.

Obviously the dweeb has too much time on his hands.

I'm sorry that this forum is such a magnet for those kinds of folks.

Kat *patpats Rich* (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 16:05:37 02/27/2001

It seems like almost any bboard anywhere will attract trolls at one point or another. I guess they just have nothing better to do, or maybe they just think it's funny to see people yelling at eachother. It's sad, really.
Joel Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 19:53:55 02/27/2001

Hi a few years ago I had a bad expperience with Dan Atkinson. I asked for a Hogg Island Boa and after I western unioned the money was told some story about why he didn't have it and I asked about the pic he said was it and got no where. So after he had my 150.00 he told me he sent some guy a large some of money (mine included) and was waitng for a shipment and he would get my snake. Fortunately I live in the state of ca. and was in the process of filing a suit against him and I let him know I was prepared to do this. He kept giving me the sob story about how he was pissed because his order was all screwed up. Needless to say I cut my losses and asked to be sent something which he sent i think 4 baby carpet pythons that were runts. My e-mail is real and my experience is real and I am not a child as you seem to be the reason for your negative feedback. I believe you know this situation I speak of Dan as I do live in Salianas within legal distance to you meaning you knew I could do what others can only speak of. if it was only one person I could see how if could be a misunderstanding but when you get multiple negative feedback something is wrong with your business practices.
Joel Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 21:14:07 02/27/2001

Hi Dan since you e-mailed me I assume you are reading what's being said here. When I stated i could do what others wish they could do I was refering to legally nothing more nothing less. I am not whining but only stating my bad experience with you which was my first online. Apperantly I got over it as I have had many good experiences here also. Like I said it was a few years ago but apparently the problems persist for you. I did call you and e-mail you numorous times and you consistantly blamed others for the problem. If you recall I settled on the carpets as I knew getting my money back was not going to happen as you kept telling me for weeks next Friday and so on so you were notified and when i became upset and angry in my e-mails you returned the favor and told me to g to any cpurt i wanted to you weren't going to give me (explicitive )back. Almost forgot 4 runt carpets don't in my opinion have a value of 150.00 dollars. Enough from me on the matter just be aware of people and ask for refrences.
Joel

p.s. this is the email i just recieved nothing bad just wanted all to see and by the way the town I live in is Salinas as I misspelled it.

Subj: Date: 2/27/01 6:59:55 PM Pacific Standard Time
From: coldblood@foothill.net (Cold-Blooded)
To: jzyyaki@aol.com




WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT.


My e-mail is real and my experience is real and I am not a child as you seem to be the reason for your negative feedback. I believe you know this situation I speak of Dan as I do live in Salianas within legal distance to you meaning you knew I could do what others can only speak of.

And what dose this mean.

If you had a problem, you should have called me dont wine now.

4 carpets are not a bad
Dan Atkinson Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 21:21:57 02/27/2001

WOW!
Those Carpets came from Doug Price, a friend of mine and there was nothing wrong with them. They were new born and all carpet newborns are thin.

I told you I was selling them for $50 BUT,...would send you 4 ($200) since you had to wait so long on the order.
I do remember that you said thanks for the extra and we were done.

NEVER, was I worried about a lawsuit with you!
I donít even no what your talking about. Had you told me of a suit, I would have thought you were a little ridiculous. And thatís about it.

I have been doing this for 6 years I am sure there are a few more Joles out there as you just cannot please some folks.
I could post 20 guys on here that have screwed me but for what.
Iv busted my ass trying to make guys like Joel happy.
He was getting a Hogg (Boa) at a real good price as I was buying a lot of them.
The deposit was just to show he was interested.
I got taken on that deal for over $2000 no biggy. Nothing I could do even a lawsuit would have just cost me more time and money.

THERE ARE A LOT OF ASS HOLE IN THIS REPTILE HOBBY!
I have proved time and time again im not one of them.

Joel you said something about bad feed back, iv done thousands of deals and will do thousands more if I like. As I have allot of good references. 2 complaints are all I see here and I donít even count yours.
Have a nice day Joel.

Jordan you no what kind of a guy I have been, and still am.
I hope your getting a bang for your buck!
Rene Not from where I am sitting. (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 22:08:16 02/27/2001

I have done business with Dan in the past and have never had any problems, I have sent him high quality animals and he has sent me high quality animals in return. Some times I shipped and we squared up later and vise-versa. To me Dan has always been straight forward about any animals he was trying to sell. As far a the dealing between Jordan and Dan goes no matter what the facts are the person who is saying they are getting ripped off is usually the one who everyone sides with. Then you get people that come out of the wood work like Joel who after years wants to finally complain. oh well, life goes on Dan will still make sales as will Jordan.

Sal I am sure Dan and Jordan will go out of business if you don't buy animals from either....lmao.......

My e-mail is also real, whatever that means!!!

Rene
Joel Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 22:13:06 02/27/2001

First it wasn't a deposit for a hogg secondly you said you had it so send the money andd you would ship not that you were getting alot of hoggs (keep the story straight)> I also know what a baby snake looks like and i know what a runt looks like. If i knew you were going to mingle my money with others who you said you owed I wouldn't have sent it. I know there are alot of (explicitive) in the business but that doesn't mean you need to lead them. Enough I stated my point made corrections and I have finished. As stated before me careful who you buy from and check for legit refrences is all I am saying.
Good Luck to all Dan included
Don Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 22:45:33 02/27/2001

I have done more than 50 transactions with Mr. Atkinson over the last 3 years. He has always paid or provided the necessary funds or trade equivalent in a timely matter. I will continue to do business with Mr. Atkinson. I was made aware of this debate and thought it necessary to provide my opinion as to his character. I can personally attest to several catastrophic incidents with Delta of which I was personally involved in, to provide the required documentation and verify value. I would estimate these losses in the 10's of thousands, and Dan has still met his financial requirements to our company. I would say to anyone that you would find yourself lucky to be able to do business with Dan, he will do what is necessary for his customers.
rdc Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 00:33:52 02/28/2001

i have purchased a female emerald tree boa from dan, and i haven't had a more perfect animal, in fact, she just produced the best baby emeralds i have seen in a long time. but i also live close to dan, and went to pick it up rather than ship. but i would do business with him again.
Ryan
Rich Bireley Re: A good Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 01:09:53 02/28/2001

I haven't known Dan long, but already he has gone out of his way to make a sour deal, of which he was only a very small part, work out so that I was not ripped off by a third party. I've bought animals from him, seen his quality animals and had a good experience dealing with him every time.

Sometimes reptile deals get very complex and drawn out. Its not always clear exactly what happened when hearing it third hand or months after the fact even from the people involved. There is obviously a great deal of emotion tied up in the deal with Jordan and Dan. I hope they figure out what they need to do to resolve the deal. I'm confident Dan will do what he legally and ethically needs to do. I hope Jordan does the same. If Jordan is as good as he's claiming, they should be able to bury the hatchet long enough to resolve this.

Dan is a good guy.
Sal Thomas oh well... (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 01:41:50 02/28/2001

Hey Rene,
So if you gave your good buddy Dan a deposit on something,and then you made the "sin" of saying or posting something he didn't like, it would be OK for him to keep your money,right?...is that what you're saying?....uh OK.....you're right, Dan will probably make more sales, I know Jordan will...and you can go back to laughing and wondering how many people who haven't dealt with Dan,aren't going to now because of this....or at least won't send him a deposit!!!
You know the cliche' "Everyone has two things, an opinion and an asshole. Usually, they both stink!!"

Sal
Kelvin Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 05:06:53 02/28/2001

Hi Everyone. I am an asian not an american and I have talked to Dan personally a couple of times. I have actually wanted to make deals with him but he told me frankly that he can't ship to my country. But he is so kind that he offered to help me find other dealers who might be of help to me. Just imagine, I am only an asian and morever not ordering any reptiles from him or watsoever but he took the trouble and time to ask other dealers for me. I really appreciate his help and I believe that such a guy can't be as bad as wat some ppl said. I believe that this conflict is one of those situations when deals just don't go so smoothly and customers or clients just simply can't be satisfied, let alone appreciate the effort put in by Dan. Up till this point, I still treat him as one guy that can make friends with and have valuable experiences to share with and yes I still have his email. Infact, I emailed him not long ago, but he never replied and now I know why is that so due to all these troubles. Hope u guys will settle it peacefully and happy herping everyone!!!
Anthony Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 08:25:43 02/28/2001

I wasn't going to bother but.... I have known Dan Atkinson
for about 4 years now, and I have done hundreds of deals
with him. Dan is a stand up guy who will bend over backwards
to satisfy a deal or customer. As far as this thing with
Jordan I don't know all the details but I am sure of one
thing Dan would not rob anyone. I am sure there is much more
to this whole thing. I don't know about any body else but
every time I see Jordans name attached to something he is
slamming somebody. Sounds like he has nothing better to do
than play on the internet everyday.

Look all of us have been involved in bad herp deals. Some of us
have been screwed bad more than once. The truth is times are changing
there are alot more scumbag theives out on kinsnake.com than
you could shake a lizard at these days. Which is why breeders
like myself have gotten out of the hobby. My point is Dan is
not one of those scumbag theives, and anyone who knows him
whether you have had dealings with him or not knows it.

Later
Anthony
Rattler Good Guy Dan Atkinson (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 09:08:10 02/28/2001

Awhile ago I did some business with Dan everything was 100% perfect. The animals arrived as promised, and looking great. I would not hesitate from buying from him again.
A. Wilson
Texas
Dan Atkinson Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 09:33:40 02/28/2001

That being said, I have been wondering how we were going to finish this Jordan. So lets get off this forum for good,...and do it right.
Neither of us deserves this. Call me and will take care of things ASAP.

I could never just keep your money.
I think you new that to. Maybe thatís why I said a few things that sounded childish. I was a little upset.
I have appreciated your patients till this point in the deal. Lets just forget this took place.

Thanks to all.

PSÖJoel if you feel I still owe you, email me an amount.
I also paid the shipping to you on those carpets, which means you got them for about $30 each. Sorry that still sounds fair to me, as I thought it was then.
If you think I owe a balance. Email me a figure, and we are done.
But lets all stop the posts,...Please.
Take care guys.
Dan Atkinson
Brian Conley Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 10:23:59 02/28/2001

Hello, my name is Brian Conley and it's time for my two cents worth on this matter. Now, first let me say that I can not go into great detail yet, as I have filed a complaint against Mr. Atkinson w/ the FBI (internet fraud) and with kingsnake.com, and I am waiting on their investigation to be completed before "airing all of our dirty laundry" in this public forum. Rest assured I will post the complete details when the time is right (I have over 20 pages of evidence and a tape of Mr. Atkinson detailing the trade as agreed to). However, if anyone is considering doing business w/ Dan I strongly suggest you do the deal in person as his record seems to be much better with that type of deal. Dan seems like a very nice person but we have come to a disagreement over a trade we started back in Oct.'00. I shipped to him first and he was supposed to ship animals back to me. I did not receive all the animals promised and was told he would make up the difference in cash. Two months after I sent Dan my animals he sent me an email stating he had traded my animals to someone else, they had died (in Dec., they were sent in Oct.), and he was not going to send me the rest of the money he owed me.
Now, if Mr. Atkinson would like to send me my money (as this forum seems to be getting results for others) then we can drop this issue, complete our deal as promised, and I will contact the authorities and drop my complaint.
Brian Conley
Dan Atkinson Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 11:37:57 02/28/2001


Bring on your investigations, threats will not make me give you your remaining $150.
I wish I had the $200 I sent you, as $350 would still not be fair on my end.
As I said, Brian I have 3 dead out of 5. Deaths to 2 of the snakes were in less than 30 days.
I told you of the sickness when they arrived, and you assured me they were all fine.
I BELIEVED YOU, and now im out 3 blood pythons. You said you had just got the small pair, there the ones that died first. Maybe they past it to the others I don't no. I do know they died first and another followed.
I would like some compensation for my hassles with you, but we are not seeing eye to eye on this.
Im not sure I understand why you think there is even a Case here.
I will be happy to supply all or any with the facts.
Brian is also a nice guy, and im not sure why these snakes died as fast as they did.
I do know they were sent to two different herpers in my area (both have been in this as long or longer than I ) they both lost the snakes. Craig at C.B. Exotics is still treating the other male. All 5 were sick. If the male dies, that's 4 out of 5.
Bring on the investigation,I stand very firm on this.
As I told you I will not be bullied into paying for what you sent me. I don't think many would.

As I said iv have 1000 of deals im sure there are a few out there that are not happy.
Honesty is a very big deal to me. But,...you can not make all happy.
Dan Atkinson
Jordan Russell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 17:19:10 02/28/2001

First off like I said earlier I wasn't going to post anything on here regarding the deal because all of the facts have been stated. Dan I never thought you would screw me either if I had I wouldn't have sent you $2,000 you have to admit that IS trust I had no reason to doubt you as we had multiple good deals up to that point just as many of the people here have had. I am sure that if you hadn't been in dire straights you would have sent back the money but at the same token I have been emailing and calling for weeks and you HAVE been avoiding me, I even warned you 2 days before I posted this that you need to reply to SOMETHING or else I will post something about you here because I felt at that point that enough time had past and enough chances had been had. I wouldn't screw you and I think you know that so for you to say you don't trust me is rubish. I even told you in more than one email that the last thing I want is for this to turn sour so PLEASE let me know what is going on.

The last time we had spoken you had told me that you would have something happening in 3 weeks and would be able to work something out for at least part of the money after that 3weeks I couldn't reach you ever again after that conversation. I have every email I sent you from these past few weeks saved and if need be and you want me to I can post them here.

I would like to hear what you have been telling these people for them to be jumping on me because it seems very funny that I get taken for $2,000 (and no contrary to what has been told that I couldn't afford the $500 I could on many occasions the problem was going up to get the truck which was set up on two occasions to be met by Dan both times he failed to meet, one time being the san diego show the other time I was meeting him $500 in hand at a bird show 3/4th the way to his house at a bird show and HE NEVER SHOWED UP after 2 weeks of planning to meet there I couldn't reach him all weekend long and he knew where we were meeting.

I am glad to see that at least you are saying you want to resolve this as that's all I want to do too, if I was out to cut throats as Anthony makes it sound I would have never emailed you multiple times asking just for a reply and warning you. I have posted 3 people here under the bad anthony one of which DAN can even vouch for as a scum bag and a scam artist John Doody, the other I posted as I was disgusted at the condition a snake arrived in and left no name it was this persons choice to put his name on the boa forum I had told no one who it was so I think for you to say that I always slam people is just a LITTLE far fetched. I do spend alot of my time on the internet selling snakes and I check the forums and this forum about every other day until recently when this happened I have been coming in a few times a day partially because someone keeps posting things under my name.

Like I have said Dan & I have had MANY MANY good deals go through so I have no doubts at the validity of your posts although I must say that what I have posted is 100% fact.

I am going to be out getting rats and should be back around 6pm if you want to give me a ring so we can work this out (714)771-5828.

Thanks,
Jordan
Brian Conley Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 20:38:26 02/28/2001

Dan, I will address your reply point by point.

1) First, please check your Western Union receipt. You sent $150 on 12/5/00 not $200. I have my copy if we need further verification.

2) Next, I shipped those bloods to you, via Delta Dash, per your instructions on 10/26/00. I can produce that receipt. On 12/5/00 I received the $150 m.o. from you. Around 12/11/00 I recieved an email from you stating you were still "trying" to put the money together. The first email I have from you informing me of the deaths of any bloods is dated 12/28/00 (2 full months after you received them). In that email you state the 3 died 10-14 days ago. That, at the earliest, has those animals dead on 12/14/00; a month and a half after you received them. I can send you a copy of that email also. None of your emails say anything about sick and/or dead bloods until the one I received 12/28/00.

3) When you received the animals you said ONE animal (the small male) had "some fuild in it's mouth." You also said it seemed like a small problem and that you would "heat him up" and yes, I agreed that would probably do the trick. I, AT NO TIME, gave you ANY sort of guarantee on the animals, especially after all the problems you had with Delta. All of those animals were fine when they left here.

4) In our conversation on 2/1/01 I stated I had had the small pair for about 2 or 3 months and that they had always appeared healthy to me. That was/and still is the truth.
I'll post this and then post some questions I'd like answered when you get the time.
Brian Conley Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 21:23:19 02/28/2001

Sorry to split this up put my ISP keeps kicking me offline.

Dan, please help me understand the following:

1) I shipped my animals to you first. I don't think that's in dispute. I sent my animals out on 10/26/00. I did not receive yours until 10/29/00. These dates give you at least 24 hours to reconsider the deal. If you were so unhappy with what you got from me why not contact me and attempt to modify the deal before shipping out your stuff? For example: "Hey, Brian I'm not real sure about the health of this small male. Why don't I send it back with the burms and you deduct him from what I owe you because I can't send out this albino-green." In fact, the only modification you wanted made to this trade was to not send me the albino-green (the most valuable snake you had to offer in our deal).
Now let me say this, you said the albino-green was "too sick to ship" so you held it back. THANK YOU for not sending me an obvisously sick animal. I don't think either one of us would do that. But really, if you were that concerned about the male at that point we should have "fixed" it then, not 2 or 3 months later.

2) One thing I still to this day do not understand is this: You posted your burms for sale on Kingsnake around 10/21/00. We talked about them up until 10/24 when we agreed to the trade. You said the albino-green was in great shape, yet 5 days later, when it was time to send me the animal, it was "to sick to ship!" How is it your animal can get that sick in 5 days yet you can't understand that I seem to think I have a case here?!?!

3) My next question is this: And we can get some help from all the other people reading this on this one, I for one would like to hear their opinion. The first notification I have from you about any dead snake was dated 12/28/00, 2 full months after you received the animals from me. In that email you state the 3 died 10-14 days ago, which still puts them in CA (3500 miles from me) for a month and half before their untimely deaths. Further, you state that you traded the animals off to friends of yours and then they died. How in the world am I responsible for that???? Your albino-green went from great-shape to "to sick to ship" in five days and had to be put down in what, about 2 weeks; yet I'm supposed to be responsible for my animals (that I still haven't been paid for) for 2 MONTHS!!!! Please someone Dan or anyone help me understand this.

Dan as I've said before I'm not trying to "bully" you into anything. I'm only trying to collect what you owe me. One of your first emails talks about how proud you are of your reputation and what an honest guy you are. Please live up to that.

Brian
Shirie Troxell Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 21:34:39 02/28/2001

Ok! The first point I want to make is this... if you've never dealt with BOTH Dan and Jordan then you have absolutely no right to be responding to this ad. I've had the pleasure of dealing with both fairly recently. I hope this isn't going to damage the business relationship I have with either of them. Dan never did me wrong. He was there for me so I could give my husband the Christmas present of his life. He allowed me to pay him in installments from October until December so that I could get my husband an Emerald. He came through for me and I don't know that many people that are like that. I got the Emerald and she's perfectly healthy, and was here on time. I can never thank Dan enough for doing that for me.
Jordan is a great guy too. I wanted to purchase a pair of redtails from him on a payment plan. I even told him that I had done it before with Dan as a reference. He couldn't do it. But he did do it on a hypo salmon boa that he'd had problems with. Jordan went above and beyond for me with this snake. My husband and I aren't rich or well off. We're both military and don't get paid nearly enough for what we do, but that's another story. I couldn't come up with the money for the snake so Jordan sent him to me and I had on;y paid him $25. Dan did the same thing. He sent me the Emerald and had only received $100 out of $400. They both sent animals to me on what monet they had already gotten and a promise. I can't say one is bad and the other is good. They've both done alot for me. All I know is that BAD things happen adn you just have to live with it. You accept it and move on. I've gotten jipped on quite a few reptile deals, but I'd never smash anyone's name because **** happens. I'm not siding with either of you guys. I'm giving you BOTH a character reference. One I feel you both deserve.
Richard Hebron Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 13:27:04 03/01/2001

I don't know why but I did read all of the above issues. Always when money is involved between two people emotions flare. All the above bickering between both of you I am sure will have a negative impact on both of your future business transactions with others. Not though because you both have an apparent disagreement with each other over a deal going sour but in how both of you dealt with it.

Emotions should have been left aside and some professionalism should have been exhibited between both of you. I Agree in having an outlet for bringing to attention dealings gone sour but when emotions start to flare it leaves one to actually believe that someone was taking advantage of another. I for one do not know who was originally at fault ,from what I read, but rest assured I will always remember both of you for the mudslinging. I am sure that alone will leave people leary in dealing with either of you. Imagine having a problem with a future transaction, we all now know the possible reaction and outcome.
PBM Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 21:56:12 03/06/2001

For Shirie-beings your in the US military, you should realize we do have the RIGHT to respond here. And thanks to people like yourself and your husband, we have these rights. Appreciate it! But, really isn't polite to tell people they have "absolutely no right". We DO, it is a PUBLIC forum, which entitles people to respond at will. My response was simply that they need to take care of this outside of here. I don't think that was unreasonable for a response for someone never dealing with either directly. I just think it was pretty bad that they were both sharing there dirty laundry with everyone. Once again, thanks for defending our rights to freedom!
Tetraodon Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 04:13:56 03/08/2001

Shirie-Agree with PBM, that particular statement was inappropriate.

Quote Webmaster from another thread (http://herpwantads.com/forums/Inquiry/posts/1645.html):

"Guess I need to make a statement here.

First off, opinions are definitely welcome in this forum. Personal involvement with the parties
that are the subjects in the thread are not necessary for someone to have an opinion about the
participants."

Opinion.
Fred Albury Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 17:16:25 03/08/2001


BOY!!
Talk about confuseing statements.
jordan told me about this a while back, but i lodged it in my mind ad not imortant(To me anyway)
I am sorry that this thing is so polluted.

I personally bought snakes from Dan Atkinson quite a while back, and they were everything they were supposed to be, I have NO complaints.
Given troubles I have had it would be foolish of me to toss bricks at anyone who is under scrutiny.
HOPE YOU TWO CAN WORK IT OUT.
I have had positive dealings with both.



Fred
Marc Gembinski of REPTILE BLVD
Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson) (Currently 0 replies)
Posted At 14:15:41 03/10/2001

Jordan & Dan, I have done business with both of you and this looks like a situation that has been blown out of control. I know that if the 2 of you just take a deep breath & discuss the situation. I am positive you can come to a conclusion. If it's a matter of whom to blaim. THE BUTLER DID IT!!!
anthony napoli Re: And yet another Bad Guy (Dan Atkinson)
2511.html Posted At 02:58:19 04/12/2001

Let's just do this, I will give you 1,500 for the truck, and everyone will be happy. I think it will be fair, because Jordan will know that the truck is in good hand's and Dan will be happy because he got the rest of his money.

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