What will happen if I....

[joseydiann]

Breed a male Pastel to my 100% het Albino female?
What will they make?

Here is the male Pastel..

http://i464.photobucket.com/albums/rr6/SnS_Dragons/user15027_pic7848_1277156196.jpg

Thanks
Amanda

[Miss Tuniwha]

you will get pastel 50% pos. het albinos, and normal 50% pos. het albinos.

[joseydiann]

Thanks Brandi...

Also I put my 100% het male albino with my girl and he's not doing anything at all.
He is almost 600 grams, people say he is at breeding weight but I don't know???
And I only have 2 males.

[deborahbroadus]

Thanks Brandi...

Also I put my 100% het male albino with my girl and he's not doing anything at all.
He is almost 600 grams, people say he is at breeding weight but I don't know???
And I only have 2 males.

If you didn't know and couldn't be bothered to research, but needed to be spoon fed the genetics. I don't think I would be buying any hets from you.:ack2:

FYI: Just because a male is 600 or "almost" grams, that does not mean that he's ready to breed.

[hhmoore]

FYI: Just because a male is 600 or "almost" grams, that does not mean that he's ready to breed.

Deborah is correct - I had a male BP that showed zero interest in breeding until he was 4 yrs old.

[joseydiann]

LoL.. Excuse me but what is this site for? Is it just to come sell your animals or is it to come learn and get help from a community of reptiles loves who care to help??

You know how I feel about you Deb!!! Also I wouldn't sell you a normal for $1,000 if you begged me. So take your smart*** comments some place else.

Do you always get so nasty with every person that comes along looking to get some help? Oh that's right, duh you DO...

[joseydiann]

Thanks Harald, that's what I was wondering. He is supposed to be 6 years old, but he seems small for that.

[hhmoore]

6 yrs old, and 600g? Give the little guy a rat, already, lol.

[joseydiann]

I've tried Harald, he won't eat very good. The person I got him from said he was eating one mouse a week or so because they couldn't get rats, well I've tried everything for a few months now and he has only ate one small rat pup. I'm all out of ideas. I have papers for him, he really is that age.

[joseydiann]

Oop's sorry, I just looked up his papers and it says beside his picture that he is an 07'

Got them confused the 100% het female is 6 years old, his supposed to be mate lol.

[hhmoore]

The male I mentioned earlier was 1500+g going into that 4th winter. He was definitely "breeding size" the two prior years, he just didn't wanna do it :shootfoot

[deborahbroadus]

LoL.. Excuse me but what is this site for? Is it just to come sell your animals or is it to come learn and get help from a community of reptiles loves who care to help??

You know how I feel about you Deb!!! Also I wouldn't sell you a normal for $1,000 if you begged me. So take your smart*** comments some place else.

Do you always get so nasty with every person that comes along looking to get some help? Oh that's right, duh you DO...

You might not "get it." That's fine.:shrug01:

But whether you come for help or not, you do need to show by your questions that you have put in SOME work. You seem to be still asking the basic questions of someone that hasn't even done ANY research before deciding to breed... And many of us do pay attention to the types of questions asked by beginning "breeders."

"Know how you feel about me." No, as a matter of fact, I DON'T know how you feel about me. I don't normally get emotionally involved in my advice attempts. I do know that you aren't all that ethical, but other than that, I haven't paid that much attention to you until you come across my radar. You are free to ignore any advice I give.:shrug01:

[gsrept]

ok ladies retract the claws, she came looking for advice if you have nothing good to say to her it would have been best to ignore the post. And yes there are males that will breed at 600 grams more often than not they are closer to the 800 gram mark when they start producing plugs the female sounds plenty big enough give him a few months and get him eating good before you attempt any breeding with him it is still early in the season my females are still taking meals I would say try putting them together in december if he has started to eat if not wait until next season. don't be discouraged with the site there are a lot of good people on here willing to give good advice and opinions, some you will agree with and some you will not. best advice i can give you is read and talk to as many people in the industry as you can ask lots of questions thats how you learn. Good luck and happy herping.

[deborahbroadus]

ok ladies retract the claws, she came looking for advice if you have nothing good to say to her it would have been best to ignore the post. And yes there are males that will breed at 600 grams more often than not they are closer to the 800 gram mark when they start producing plugs the female sounds plenty big enough give him a few months and get him eating good before you attempt any breeding with him it is still early in the season my females are still taking meals I would say try putting them together in december if he has started to eat if not wait until next season. don't be discouraged with the site there are a lot of good people on here willing to give good advice and opinions, some you will agree with and some you will not. best advice i can give you is read and talk to as many people in the industry as you can ask lots of questions thats how you learn. Good luck and happy herping.

I do not know who you are, but the best breeders *IMO* look up information and research. The information she is asking for could have been found by a 5 year old with a little bit of Googling. Perhaps you think coming and asking a simplistic question is "research." I do not agree. I am simply pointing out that if you want to be a breeder, any type of breeder worth your salt, you have to put in the work.

P.S. There is no reason to be "discouraged with the site" I am not FAUNA. There will be plenty of people that can answer her question. I answered it MY way.:reddevil:

[joseydiann]

Thank you very much Craig, I appreciate it...

This will be the last question I ever ask on this site and someone should let Rich know that this site is for buying and selling only, not for coming for help or asking questions.
Oh and it's just for the "best breeders" the "pros" not for people who want to learn not for new people to get help!

I will be moving on like about 20 other good people who have left here recently, as for the 10 or so good people still here, you know where to find me.
As for the friends who have been asking where I've been and why I left well now you know, it's because of issues like this.

Good luck on counting to 1 mill guys, and take care!

[Bob O'Brien]

All this from a simple question!!

[joseydiann]

Have to talk to big bad miss Deb about that one, guess I'm not pro enough or one of those best breeders, she had to get rather nasty and rude instead of answering the question or could have kept her crappy comment to herself. I don't remember asking her to buy a snake from me but yeah ya know..

I kinda thought it was simple question too, in fact I do believe I've seen it asked about 30 other times on this Forum.. Have a look, wonder if she had the same rude comment on their "same" question?!

[jparker1167]

i think people just get tired of asnwering the same stuff over and over.

if the same question was asked 30 times before you would think that you should know the answer lol...

[Melinda]

It's early in the season, I just started putting my males in with my girls yesterday. Some of them aren't interested in breeding yet, but are previously proven. Keep trying and he may get it later.

Have you thought about putting both the het and pastel on the girl? If I'm thinking clearly, you'd get possible hets either way. And if that het male gets her, you may get an albino or two out of it. If he doesn't do the deed, you should get a pastel or two possible hets. Maybe you'd babies sired from both daddies!

If this is the girl from my place, we know she is proven 100% het, so there isn't any worry of trying to prove her out by limiting her suitors.

[joseydiann]

Thanks Melinda, I'll try that!

Joe I was talking about people asking the question "what will I get if I breed this pair or this one with that one" not my same question lol.

[Shadera]

Have to talk to big bad miss Deb about that one, guess I'm not pro enough or one of those best breeders, she had to get rather nasty and rude instead of answering the question or could have kept her crappy comment to herself. I don't remember asking her to buy a snake from me but yeah ya know..

I kinda thought it was simple question too, in fact I do believe I've seen it asked about 30 other times on this Forum.. Have a look, wonder if she had the same rude comment on their "same" question?!

Drama Queen much? If it's that bad, just leave. No need for the big dramatic scene.

There is much to be gleaned just from web searches, reading other breeder's sites and blogs, and studying the questions and answers on forums.

Deb wasn't being nasty, she was being honest. How many people do you think would buy hets from someone who has been into balls for at least a year and doesn't know what offspring a simple cross would yield? Punnet squares are great tools, as are the several genetics calculators out there.

[jparker1167]

i know you didnt mean your exact question but i could not resist posting it.

but i do understand that people get tired of typing the same stuff out over and over, i have answered the same stuff tons of times too...

i have had questions about breeding x to x is first thing i do is try the search box i just type what im looking for like spider x pastel normally you find enough to get your asnwer.

[Utta]

Im only going to say this: we all, at some point, had no idea what that would make. Deb, you may have chosen google to seek your answer, amanda choice the advice of her friends.

[deborahbroadus]

Im only going to say this: we all, at some point, had no idea what that would make. Deb, you may have chosen google to seek your answer, amanda choice the advice of her friends.

Give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. TEACH a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. :thumbsup:

** My name is Deborah.:dgrin:

[Utta]

1st, sorry! Thought you didn't mind being called Deb.

2nd, im not saying I don't agree, but isn't this the same thing? Were fishing, but she's watching us. Learn by sight? :shrug01:

[gsrept]

Tyler i totally agree, i thought this site was about meeting and helping people if this is how it is withDrama Queen much? If it's that bad, just leave. No need for the big dramatic scene.

joseydian if you have any questions feel free to email me i am always willing to help uot a fellow herper including newbies. craig gsrept@live.com

[deborahbroadus]

Wow..y'all really took this out of context. She asked, I answered, she didn't like my answer and performed for attention and lo and behold everyone (that I expected) rushed to play MOD on my answers.:ack2:

As I said before, this is how I answer questions. It is not meant to be "mean" but I am not responsible for how someone else's "internal white noise" interpretes or projects into my answers.

The forum where I mod in is encouraged and EXPECTED to do the research and I am not shy about telling them that or (if they are younger) saying something like, "The search button is your friend, use it." However, Amanda is not a child, so I didn't feel the need to sugarcoat anything. She's breeding NOW...she should have had this known before she started, IMO.

The other answers may be more "soft" but I don't get called MEAN anywhere but HERE so it makes me wonder what the motive behind this drama is:rolleyes_.

If Amanda is so thin-skinned that she can't simply pass over advice or ignore it (as she suggested I do if I have nothing "nice" to say...then perhaps breeding isn't for her?:ack2: But that's not my judgement to make, any moron or idiot can breed, it's not a rocket science (see, I'm doing it):rofl:. But it does take work and not just "asking a question once you have already started!":eek:

[deborahbroadus]

"called mean" - implies that I was being intentionally cruel, and being "nice" means babying up someone.

Yet, you all forget, she said, "You know how I feel about you." This implies that no matter WHAT I said, she would not have liked it. LOL

[Subdriven]

Put my proven male with a proven female ( same bread last year ) about 2-3 weeks ago.. they didn't start getting interested till today. sometimes it takes a while...

[Melinda]

Sometimes when I pose questions, it is also to get other people's opinions on the subject, not just the easy answer. This often opens up a friendly chat about other people's opinions, choices, experiences etc... and can be a valuable tool to people like me that don't know everything. I think most people like to talk about their hobbies.

[hhmoore]

Well, she succeeded in stimulating discussion...even if it wasn't with her opening post :shootfoot.

It wasn't exactly a thought provoking question...and, I agree with Deborah, in that if Amanda is already actively trying to breed her snakes, she should probably already have considered the outcomes. I'm one that gets tired of answering the same question month after month, year after year. Basic genetics discussions are common, and there are a number of genetics calculators that are mentioned on a regular basis. I don't remember details, but it sure seems that there is a history between those two (I think I remember some karma complaints, and general claws out kind of stuff). Sadly, past squabbles aren't always left in the past, and one side or the other can rekindle things pretty easily - purposely, or not.

[gsrept]

I would agree that it can be tiring answering questions over and over Harold, but there are a lot of people not so computer savy or may not know where to look so they ask the question. I look at it as a newbie as being the future of the hobby they can not learn if we do not teach. And if we do not teach we are bound to make the same mistakes and look at the industry in a whole with all the reptile bans going on. We are quick to preach to people about resposible ownership and in the same breath we turn them away, and that is not what the reptile industry needs at this point, to all reading remember USARKS logo United We Stand. thats the only way for this industry and or hobby to survive. Thanks for hearing me out.

[Melinda]

I agree, it does get tiresome to answer the same questions over and over. When I'm not in the mood to answer a question, I back out of the thread and let someone else answer the question. It doesn't do any good to get my knickers in a twist over a question when there will ALWAYS be newbies with basic questions. Without newbies with questions, our hobby and or sales will not prosper.

Like Craig said above me, I think it is important to teach newbies. This is good for the animals and for breeders. If a newbie does not feel comfortable in a forum, they will go elsewhere. This does not help the forum or the breeders that the newbie may buy from in the future. We can help support our favorite forums by also supporting it's members. Without members/traffic, sponsors won't pay for ads which help keep forums up and running.

I do not visit many other forums because I don't feel comfortable with constant bickering and snarkiness.

[Shadera]

Not everyone is so touchy feely. :shrug01:

Wouldn't the world just SUCK if we all agreed all the time?

[deborahbroadus]

I agree, it does get tiresome to answer the same questions over and over. When I'm not in the mood to answer a question, I back out of the thread and let someone else answer the question. It doesn't do any good to get my knickers in a twist over a question when there will ALWAYS be newbies with basic questions. Without newbies with questions, our hobby and or sales will not prosper.

Like Craig said above me, I think it is important to teach newbies. This is good for the animals and for breeders. If a newbie does not feel comfortable in a forum, they will go elsewhere. This does not help the forum or the breeders that the newbie may buy from in the future. We can help support our favorite forums by also supporting it's members. Without members/traffic, sponsors won't pay for ads which help keep forums up and running.

I do not visit many other forums because I don't feel comfortable with constant bickering and snarkiness.

I understand what you are saying, let me say this. I personally wouldn't be one to sell her an animal. I was appalled that she was breeding an older seriously underweight male that wasn't eating, apparently without concern for his health (I wonder who sold him to her :shrug01:).

But some people need those kinds of customers or just don't care, as long as they make a buck. :shrug01:

Personally, I didn't consider her a noob, she's been around long enough to know that she's not always going to get a "sweet" answer (she doesn't always give a sweet answer either..but some people love drama and always fall for it).

So if everyone can return to answering and evaluating their OWN posts and stop trying to make other people conform to unrealistic expectations of how people should respond to posts when no rules were broken and no one was actually RUDE..it would be appreciated. :rolleyes:

[SIGNATURE DESIGN EXOTICS]

dont get me wrong but i thought this was a forum for pros and novice alike. so maybe she was jumping in on a breeding project but so what. she came here to get answers and instead got chewed a new one. all because your sick of hearing it. it is a simple question to answer! whats so hard about just given a simple answer and directing her to a good gene site?(like bhb they have vids on this) instead of attacking her for trying to find out whats up. you get more bees with honey then vinger. frankly im disappointed i thought this site was here to help.

[joseydiann]

Ha and I see a few of you are no better than her, if you are tired of seeing questions or the same kinds of questions over and over maybe this site should be for the pros only, lets lock all the new comers out and throw away the newbies trying to learn something, that will solve your problem. OR maybe YOU should avoid those posts and questions if they bother you so much???

As for those of you that do care and would like to answer a few questions, please email me and let me know so I can ask you, because as I said I don't care to "learn" on HERE anymore! :D

Oh and yes, I can search for hours and read MANY sites to get information, however it is the same as care sheets, I can look up 10 different ones and 8 of them be totally different and have false information.
I for one like to ask people who I know cares for many snakes daily and have for years, I like to talk with people NOT just read info that could have been posted by someone who has no idea what they are talking about, I'd like to do it right..
BUT that's just me!

And "Deb" this is my thread I made it, anyone is welcome to stay right here and post all day long if they'd like, no one has to go back to "their OWN posts"

[Melinda]

Amanda, feel free to email me at cauldroncreations@hotmail.com with any questions. Keep in mind, I'm not an expert and my mind is mush these days. lol

[hhmoore]

She got chewed a new one? Really?

As far as being tired of responding to the same old questions, it's a little different when they come from a newbie...but, regardless, as I said in a PM to somebody, if I don't feel like answering them again, I close the thread and leave it for somebody else.

The temper tantrums are a bit ridiculous - how old are you?
You're acting like the little kid at the playground that has a hissy fit and storms off...and when nobody came to get you, you came back, stamped your feet some more, and said I mean it, I'm not gonna play with you guys.

[joseydiann]

LoL.. And just WHAT is a newbie to YOU?

I have only owned snakes for a few months, other reptiles YES I have many but yeah I am still "new" to snakes and their genetics..

"The temper tantrums are a bit ridiculous" Really, where? I'm yet to see people throwing temper tantrums!

The only thing I find ridiculous here is the fact that you and a few others don't see a thing wrong with her very first post to my question, that is pretty pathetic to be honest.

You really don't think it was a little rude and uncalled for? The whole "needs to be spoon fed comment" or the "I'd never buy a het from you"....?
Hum again I didn't say I was selling snakes and I didn't ask her to buy anything from me, not only that but my question was answered already and she seen that!!! So what was the point? Oh that's right it was to insult me, make me look bad, and start drama..

It was RUDE and uncalled for plain and simple!!!
But wait I'm not supposed to say anything, I'm wasn't supposed to reply to the insults or explain or stand up for myself.

"could have been found by a 5 year old" Sound a little rude and insulting to you?

[Omnomnami]

What I find sad is that when I take Deborah and Shadera off of my ignore list and check out my CP to see what kind of Karma I'm receiving, guess who has been leaving me bad karma? ONLY Shadera and Deborah, nobody else. I haven't received a single bad karma from anyone else since I have started coming here. And the even sadder thing is that half of those bad karma points is just them asking me a question. Hence the reason why I went on Deborah's profile and asked her to please ask those questions directly instead of through bad karma. :)

I've learned that the ignore button does wonders for people who are sour towards someone from the get go. :D Mmmm...peace and quiet. Now I'll go get my umbrella...I sense a downpour of virtual hate coming my way. n.n

[hhmoore]

I didn't incorporate the full message, but perhaps further explanation would have helped. Regardless of your experience with snakes, you have been a member on this site for 6 yrs...and you have alluded to participating on other forums. You've been around long enough to know how to do a search, and mentions of various genetics calculators/wizards are common in the "what do I get" type threads.
I also acknowledged that I could see how Deborah's comment could be considered abrasive...but that I thought your response was disproportionate. Maybe that's because I understood the points she was making, and because I know that she thinks people should be a little more proactive in their learning attempts - researching instead of just asking, especially for the really basic stuff (that could be generational, as I feel the same way).
It's no secret that I consider Deborah a friend; but, then, neither is it a secret that I've come down pretty hard on her when I thought she was out of line.
I know you two have had issues, which is why I suggested that responding as you did might not be the best idea. I'm sure that the readers of this thread will fall into a few different categories - the ones that think Deborah was out of line from the start, the ones that think you overreacted, the ones that think less of both of you based on what they've seen here, and the ones that shake their heads and wonder why situations like this keep turning up.

This was a simple beginner's type post, and now there's a full page of back and forth + some ill feelings...all over a question that was asked and answered.
Not everybody is going to like you, and nobody expects you to like everybody...but what's the point in getting oneself worked up over it? It's the internet. A little self control is all it takes to pretend they aren't even there - which, btw, is what I'm going to do with this thread. I knew getting involved in any capacity was a bad idea, right from the start.
Click.

[joseydiann]

"I consider Deborah a friend"
I figured that much from the get-go!

Yeah I may have opened this account 6 years ago but I left and didn't come back for years too. Not only that I don't "lay" on this site literally 24/7 like "some" people do! A month or weeks might go by before I log back on here.

And no I guess I don't find and use the search, I just go through page after page one at a time reading all the titles looking for that info and I didn't see any!

"I know you two have had issues, which is why I suggested that responding as you did might not be the best idea." (Did a mod send her friendly heads up that maybe she should be so rude and insulting?)
Nope, I was just to sit back and take it huh, all because "you know that she thinks people should be a little more proactive in their learning attempts" so it's ok for her to treat people like that, it's ok for her to insult who ever she likes? Because she has an excuse because she thinks this and she thinks that? Pleaseeeeeeeee!!!!

Well I'm glad you understood the point she was making and you agree with her or feel the same way!
However I feel real sorry for the next poor fool that comes along with the "simple" and "basic" questions or questions about genetics!

But anyway I'm not all worked up, I'm perfectly calm!
Point is she had no right coming on my thread slinging insults right and left, yet something gets said to me about it because I have a response.

Well no harm done here, I am getting what I came for after all through email with the ones that do care! :)
No hatin' going on here and I have no bad feeling towards you Harald!

Lol omg you too Nichole? Wow, I thought they were just hitting me with the BK like that. Well I don't feel alone now, but yeah Shadera is really good about that, I totally let it go and ignored it till today! And believe me no hate will come from that..

Anyway I going to go spend more hours trying to learn genetics! :D
Thanks for the help guys!!!

[Omnomnami]

Good luck with your research! Hopefully you will find some good stuff buried in Google. :) If I find any good links I'll be sure to post them. Oh! Calculators like these: http://geneticcalculator.traxxtec.de/en/rechner.aspx can be pretty fun to dink around with when it comes to genetics... :)

[SIGNATURE DESIGN EXOTICS]

harald harald harald, i must say i usually agree with you but i cant say i do or dont now. when i first started on this site you were very kind to me and pm me the do and don'ts of this site. now im sure as a mod you have had to do that a lot right? so my point is is if your getting sick of it why do it. i personally know if i get sick of answering questions or trying to help wether it be a sale or not its time to get out. i think the problem is not that she could have looked around the web first but she came here. she trusted the incite of all of us. i said chewed because the comments where just not called for. wether deb and amanda like each other or not there is no need for the insulting comments. i do agree that i would think twice about buying a het from amanda but usually i would ask what the pairing was first anyway. look at it this way though, she could have breed them and just sold them not knowing. instead she came here to make sure. that should get some merit no? please do not take this post the wrong way im not here to fight. i just wouldn't want to get a answer like that if i started a post here. i just think we all forget that at some point we all had to ask the same questions. maybe amanda is a little late(as far as trying to breed first) but she did ask. we should all be here to help the herp community. the fight is with jonny law not are fellow herpers. any who harald i still always love getting your opinion and hope this does not cause bad blood between us.

[Miss Tuniwha]

Ok.. I have read this. Amanda, do you not understand the frustration people might have?? Yes, Debs post was a bit terse.. but .. that's Deb.. And before you jump in, thinking I am best buddies and saying it was all peachy keen, take a peek through a few of the threads on here.. Deb and I have had our share of disagreements..

The issue is this.. If you have 2 snakes, and don't wan to do a 5 minute google search... what are you gonna do when the eggs are laid? Are you already prepared? Do you have the proper incubating substrate? Do you know the temperatures?? Are you prepared to cull a deformed baby???

Do you know how to properly sex the snakes??

There are A LOT of things you need to know before you try to produce babies!!!

I think a lot of people are having some issues with people these days wanting to breed everything and anything.. Without doing proper RESEARCH.. and not caring about strengthening the lines.. they just want to make babies..

That irks a LOT of people.. because now there will be more snakes around, with crappy genetics.. etc etc..

Like last year, one lady was so proud of her crap brown pastels.. WHAT?? She said they were so cheap everyone could get one.. .. guess what people now will breed? those crappy brown pastels..

MANY people that are "breeding" these days don't know crap about what they have.. and aren't doing the research..

So stop getting your panties in a bunch because someone talked to you as an adult, and not as a 5 year old.. Do some research.. Take charge of what you are doing.. not just posting your questions and letting others do the work for you..

And yes, others post genetics questions.. but they are more like.. "what will a killer bee and a mystic potion make"... .. um.. those are a little different from yours.. You chose 2 of the most simplistic genes.. that are VERY easy to understand.. a codom, and a recessive.. and if you do not know those at the basic.. you should NOT be breeding them..

Its like taking a mutt.. off the street.. that you don't know what it is.. and breeding it.. WHY the heck would you do that??? You don't even know what the babies will be?!?!.. Now if you did research, tracked down the genetics, then figured out what it was.. and what the babies would be.. that is another story..

Yes fauna is here to help.. give tips, and point in the right direction.. It has helped many people over the years, myself included.. .. but you need to realize that "breeding" when you don't know crap about what you have, is gonna be a touchy subject.

[SIGNATURE DESIGN EXOTICS]

ok i have to agree brandi that you should look at the whole picture of breeding before you do it. there is alot more involed then just putting two snakes together.

but i do disagree with the mutt comment and heres why. how many snake are imported that could be mutts and have to be proved out to find some hidden gene? how many times have you heard some one putting this to that and getting something completely new? you use the crappy brown pastels but whos to say that someone doesn't like the brown. what about choc pastels i have one and think its great. i even hope to make coco bees this year. and all the same mutts need love too. every snake not matter what size or color is different in its own way. dont get me wrong i dont agree with breeding a sick or unhealthy animal but i dont think thats what amanda was doing. she just wants help so if your worried about it just help her. if not there no need to get your panties in a bunch either.lol

also the talk to you as an adult comment. i dont remember rude comments as adult talk. i always thought it was do unto others as you wish others to do unto you.

[Shadera]

also the talk to you as an adult comment. i dont remember rude comments as adult talk. i always thought it was do unto others as you wish others to do unto you.

The OP has been way more out of line than any comments by Deb. If someone can't see that, they obviously came in here leaning to one side and aren't willing to put that aside.

What I find sad is that when I take Deborah and Shadera off of my ignore list and check out my CP to see what kind of Karma I'm receiving, guess who has been leaving me bad karma? ONLY Shadera and Deborah, nobody else. I haven't received a single bad karma from anyone else since I have started coming here. And the even sadder thing is that half of those bad karma points is just them asking me a question. Hence the reason why I went on Deborah's profile and asked her to please ask those questions directly instead of through bad karma. :)

I've learned that the ignore button does wonders for people who are sour towards someone from the get go. :D Mmmm...peace and quiet. Now I'll go get my umbrella...I sense a downpour of virtual hate coming my way. n.n

Yes, it does work wonders. What I find sad is that someone takes up so much time fretting over a comment someone left on their online profile. And please, look up the meaning of "rhetorical question". But it's okay, you're young, you've got a ton of maturing to do. I'm not insulted by your comments because you're a child.

Know what I was doing at your age, almost twenty years ago? I was in boot camp. Doing stuff most women, and most people for that matter, haven't got the guts to do. I'm proud of where I've been, the things I've done. And no teenybopper on a reptile forum will ever change the person I am.

And for the record, most of that karma was probably for you standing up for a guy who's been shown to lie, deceive, and steal. In one breath you would claim you never saw proof and had read everything, then when confronted with proof you'd backpeddle and say you'd missed that part. It's pathetic is what it is. Speaking of the ignore function, I need to go add a person or two who've proven to me that they don't have anything of merit to add to a conversation.

Not only that I don't "lay" on this site literally 24/7 like "some" people do! A month or weeks might go by before I log back on here.



Who cares what someone else does with their free time? Myself, I'm retired. Who cares if I spend a few minutes of each hour perusing the forums as I take a break from something else I'm doing. I have a nice place to live, the money I need to buy stuff I want, and we pay a hefty sum in taxes each year. I do a ton of extracurricular stuff, not the least of which is volunteer work. I'm just not the kind of person who feels like I need to share every gory detail of my life with strangers on the internet. I think people should be more concerned with how they are spending their time.

And for the record, you're no angel either. After I left you that karma comment, since I hadn't posted to this thread yet you ran to my most recent post to send me negative karma in return. And here's the post worthy of a negative..
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1137454#post1137454

But even though it's clearly retaliatory, I don't whine publicly about karma that's left for me. I'm a bit too grown for that. You two play childish well enough for the masses.

And that's my last comments here. I'm not gonna continue to argue with a couple kids. I've actually got better things to do. Just wanted to set the record straight and not leave things hanging with only half the story, and a bit skewed at that.

[Miss Tuniwha]

but i do disagree with the mutt comment and heres why. how many snake are imported that could be mutts and have to be proved out to find some hidden gene? how many times have you heard some one putting this to that and getting something completely new? you use the crappy brown pastels but whos to say that someone doesn't like the brown. what about choc pastels i have one and think its great. i even hope to make coco bees this year. and all the same mutts need love too. every snake not matter what size or color is different in its own way. dont get me wrong i dont agree with breeding a sick or unhealthy animal but i dont think thats what amanda was doing. she just wants help so if your worried about it just help her. if not there no need to get your panties in a bunch either.lol

also the talk to you as an adult comment. i dont remember rude comments as adult talk. i always thought it was do unto others as you wish others to do unto you.

I didn't get my panties in a bunch. I was trying to explain why she got some attitude. And if you look back.. i was the person that actually, straight up answered her question.

The mutt comment was a general analogy. By the by.. I don't play with the imports.. and usually the people that do, are well into this hobby and KNOW what they are doing.. .. they are also willing to hold back, and prove out the genetics and so on..

Brown snake are fine.. if they are meant to be brown.. but low grade is low grade.. that is just someone being cheap.. go back and find the thread.. you will see there is a big difference..

And yes.. as I said.. Debs comment was terse.. but for Deb, that is her adult talk.. a persons personality DOES come into play here.. People will not always sugar coat, or pretend to be who they aren't just because someone might think they are rude..

As I mentioned, Deb and I often butt heads.. but we both know that it is not personal, it is merely different views/personalities etc..

[SIGNATURE DESIGN EXOTICS]

Brandi don't get me wrong I'm not attacking you. The panties in a buch comment was a joke so please don't take it wrong
as far as low grade that's opion who's to say that's not the next big thing. After all most morphs are mutts in there own way.
Again please don't take me wrong I love all herps in any color or grade.
Also I'm not telling deb to be fake but if you don't have something nice to say don't say it at all.

[joseydiann]

LoL.. Yes I have know how to incubate! Yes I know all about the temps! Yes I can sex the babies! And yes I can take care of deformed babies!

I have already hatched 25 snakes.. I was just asking a question because I can't breed my two 100% het albinos so I was going to breed her with the pastel but wanted to know how the babies would come out to be sure I wanted to do it at all.

No, I did not know about genetic calculators or where they are found!

I'm not wanting to breed everything and anything, I only have 3 adult BP's

I disagree with the "mutt" comments too and the crappy genetics, I guess I am no good mutt lover as I have mutt dogs and mutt reptiles as well. They all need love and care but that's just me!

And in case some of you still missed my comments about selling I'll say it one more time. I didn't come here to sell any snakes, I didn't say a word about it, I didn't ask any of you or Deb to buy from me. I plan to keep my snakes.

As for yet another comment about Deb and "that's just her" or "that's just how she is" or "we know how she thinks"
I'm going to go around acting just like her, talking to people in the same way, with the same comments, throwing the same insults and lets just see how long I last. Lets see how long it takes before I have 5-6 fractions for the same post!

Yes all this drama and childish mess over me asking the "basic question" (when clearly I should have never came here) seems a little much when it could have been done and over with when Brandi answered the question!

[joseydiann]

Oh and talk about childish, pathetic, and petty well just who are the two people who ran to my profile like little childish high schoolers to "mark all over my locker" so to speak! And left comments like -sob- -boohoo- -cry- ect.. Humm wonder who that was? Oh and wait they have their profile blocked so you can't leave them any comments teehee sounds so adult like doesn't it???

[deborahbroadus]

The OP has been way more out of line than any comments by Deb. If someone can't see that, they obviously came in here leaning to one side and aren't willing to put that aside.



Yes, it does work wonders. What I find sad is that someone takes up so much time fretting over a comment someone left on their online profile. And please, look up the meaning of "rhetorical question". But it's okay, you're young, you've got a ton of maturing to do. I'm not insulted by your comments because you're a child.

Know what I was doing at your age, almost twenty years ago? I was in boot camp. Doing stuff most women, and most people for that matter, haven't got the guts to do. I'm proud of where I've been, the things I've done. And no teenybopper on a reptile forum will ever change the person I am.

And for the record, most of that karma was probably for you standing up for a guy who's been shown to lie, deceive, and steal. In one breath you would claim you never saw proof and had read everything, then when confronted with proof you'd backpeddle and say you'd missed that part. It's pathetic is what it is. Speaking of the ignore function, I need to go add a person or two who've proven to me that they don't have anything of merit to add to a conversation.



Who cares what someone else does with their free time? Myself, I'm retired. Who cares if I spend a few minutes of each hour perusing the forums as I take a break from something else I'm doing. I have a nice place to live, the money I need to buy stuff I want, and we pay a hefty sum in taxes each year. I do a ton of extracurricular stuff, not the least of which is volunteer work. I'm just not the kind of person who feels like I need to share every gory detail of my life with strangers on the internet. I think people should be more concerned with how they are spending their time.

And for the record, you're no angel either. After I left you that karma comment, since I hadn't posted to this thread yet you ran to my most recent post to send me negative karma in return. And here's the post worthy of a negative..
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1137454#post1137454

But even though it's clearly retaliatory, I don't whine publicly about karma that's left for me. I'm a bit too grown for that. You two play childish well enough for the masses.

And that's my last comments here. I'm not gonna continue to argue with a couple kids. I've actually got better things to do. Just wanted to set the record straight and not leave things hanging with only half the story, and a bit skewed at that.

:hurray::hurray::hurray::hurray::hurray::hurray::h urray::hurray:

Thanks for putting the truth out there. Their childish attempt to play victim really was transparent. Those who want to know can ask the Mods who did what and whose neg was retaliatory. Like I mentioned before, Amanda isn't too ethical and now i have learned that Om isn't above exaggerating to sway people.

Could I have phrased my response better, of course!! I certainly could have...but what would have been the point?:shrug01: I am disgusted with people who don't know what they are doing breeding underweight/possibly sickly animals and it showed in my post. It is incoincidental that it happened to be a response to someone that I had little respect for, given my previous run-ins with her and her subsequent lies, but the disgust that showed to was for her actions not her personally. although, she certainly took it personally and continues to.

Those of you that are older members all know that I have made my own mistakes starting out, I have paid dues the hard way as have many other breeders including Shadera, and I still haven't scratched the surface of what the older breeders know. I do know that when I am corrected, I research or ask Harald where my misunderstanding lies (poor guy, he's so patient with me.)

I am well aware that some take the forums entirely too personally, I am guilty of that at times...so I try not to go off had-cocked every time someone may say something in a way that "could" be an insult. I also don't back down when I believe I am right:o

Shadera has at no time acted in any manner deserving of the disrespect you and your friends are showing, I hope you realize this. Personally, I don't actually care how much neg you two give me...I always consider the source. However, when Harald or the like negs me then I take a step back and approach from another perspective, or...I shut up.

Hint hint hint...:dgrin:

[deborahbroadus]

LoL.. Yes I have know how to incubate! Yes I know all about the temps! Yes I can sex the babies! And yes I can take care of deformed babies!

I have already hatched 25 snakes.. I was just asking a question because I can't breed my two 100% het albinos so I was going to breed her with the pastel but wanted to know how the babies would come out to be sure I wanted to do it at all.

No, I did not know about genetic calculators or where they are found!

I'm not wanting to breed everything and anything, I only have 3 adult BP's

I disagree with the "mutt" comments too and the crappy genetics, I guess I am no good mutt lover as I have mutt dogs and mutt reptiles as well. They all need love and care but that's just me!

And in case some of you still missed my comments about selling I'll say it one more time. I didn't come here to sell any snakes, I didn't say a word about it, I didn't ask any of you or Deb to buy from me. I plan to keep my snakes.

As for yet another comment about Deb and "that's just her" or "that's just how she is" or "we know how she thinks"
I'm going to go around acting just like her, talking to people in the same way, with the same comments, throwing the same insults and lets just see how long I last. Lets see how long it takes before I have 5-6 fractions for the same post!

Yes all this drama and childish mess over me asking the "basic question" (when clearly I should have never came here) seems a little much when it could have been done and over with when Brandi answered the question!

Of course you, too, can go around being direct and honest, try it. Some may take it as rudeness, but that's a chance you'll have to take.

At least you won't have to sneak around misdirecting and lying...and that's a plus!

[Clay Davenport]

I think this horse has been beaten enough. Time to let it go folks. The pointless back and forth has run it's course.
So far nothing has been said that is overtly abusive, but it's heading in that direction. I suggest everyone find something else to do as any further posts on this thread are going to be read with a more critical eye.