Amazing Dinker Female! Any ideas?

[B&C Ball Pythons]

I picked up this dinker female a few days ago. She's a CH from an imported clutch. What do you all think? Her pattern resembles a super sable w/the blushing of a pastel. She's 1167 grams as of this morning. I'll try to breed her next year and see what she kicks out!

First pic is her as a juvenile, second pic is current/subadult.

I welcome your input!

Bo Whiteside
Newport, OR

[deborahbroadus]

I would first put her to a normal to see if she kicked out anything similar to herself. I would do this twice to confirm results.

Then I would put one of the males that showed similar patterning and color to her (if any were hatched) if not, I would put one that seemed different to see if a super or more visuals hatched...

That's the route I would take before throwing her to anything else, I would see if she had anything going on.

Good luck with her, she's gorgeous!

[chamgirl99471]

If it was a male just imagine what you could pair it with :) Love that pattern... Looks like upside down water drops :D Good Luck with her!

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Here's a couple more shots from the side. I'm still new to the ball python scene, but I haven't seen anything like her.

[David Reid]

I have a female Dinker that looks similar, mine proved out initially to be a Chocolate type.

I have a male that is identicle to yours....wanna bring her down and we will take you to the San Diego Zoo:)

[David Reid]

Here is my male:
http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr277/EmberBall/IMGP3553.jpg

And the female:
http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr277/EmberBall/IMGP3459.jpg

[Abby]

Nice! Looks promising :thumbsup:

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Nice! that has been the general consensus among breeders I've emailed. A clean chocolate or sable. I'm from SD originally too :) I grew up in Santee, and lived in OB & PB.

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Maybe next season we could make one of these but spotless clean?

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Have you bred your male to anything yet David?

[David Reid]

No, I have a clean cool patterned female that is about my best match for him here, and plan on breeding them together. I have not decided if I want to put a Pastel with him or not.

Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

My only option for her next year will be my NERD lemon bumblebee. After seeing your male, it really makes me think we have more than just a clean normal.......hopefully something dom or codom :)

[David Reid]

I doubt they are Sables, I have a Sable and they really do not look alike. I am not sure they are Chocolates either, I think my female is, but not my male, and they look similar but not identical like our two.

Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

I agree. I guess only time will tell :)

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Another thing I noticed and is interesting. Possible het pied markers? Maybe I should pick up a normal het pied male and the Portland show in Jan and follow your advice Deborah, while experimenting? Decisions decisions :)

[David Reid]

I think if you have a clutch of Possible Het Pieds to comb through, and some have the Het Pied marker and some don't, take the marked ones. As far as dinkers go or snakes with no Pied in their history, the markers probably are not a Het Pied marker. If you happened to have a Pied visual male to breed to her, would not be the worst breeding possible, but I would not buy a Het Pied to breed to her, would breed her to a visual instead, just in case she does not prove out. IF she has some babies with Het Pied markers, and then you want to dink around with them and just see if there is any Pied in their past, could be a fun project, but I would do it after you prove or disprove her genetic.

[B&C Ball Pythons]

We are just getting started w/our initial breeding collection. We don't have a lot of rack room left and our budget will only allow for one or two more animals (males) depending on morph of course. So far we have:
1.0 NERD Lemon Bumblebee
0.1 NERD Lemon Pastel
0.1 NERD Pastel
0.1 Woma
0.1 Mark Petros Lesser Platinum
0.1 Dinker (this girl)

So maybe a visual Pied male to round out the initial collection? We're going to a show in Portland in Jan, so we'll have til then to decide on what route to go for our last male or two.

[David Reid]

As far as the visual Pied goes, only get one if you love the Pied look and find one you cannot live without, OR, and this is preferable, get one if you have the females for him. With simple recessives, unless you just want to make Hets, and trust me, you don't, you need to buy some Het Pied females FIRST, because they take longer to mature. Now, if you are going to get into the Pied project because you love Pieds, and find a male Pied you just think is perfect, by all means, pick him up. Just remember, a Pied will be cheaper next year, and you need het Pied females to breed him to. So, if you go to the show and say I found a male Pied I cannot live without, I am going to pick up a couple of Het Pied females or a Pastel Het Pied female for him too, and I can breed the male to my dinker, go for it....but, rule of thumb, get your simple recessive females first, and then get your male.

The good news for you is that you have high females...

Dave

[David Reid]

I just looked at my male and he does not have the Het pied markers, he has a cool funky belly, but not like yours....

Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Here's our options for the $ we have left in our budget as well as rack space:
1. Breed her to our lone male lemon bumblebee and just see what happens (our other girls won't be ready til 2012 or later)
2. Breed her to a normal to try and prove her pattern w/o testing the pied theory.
3. Breed her to a normal 100% het pied and try to prove her pattern as well as test the pied theory.
4. Breed her to a visual pied.

(if we go w/3 or 4 I would buy an additional 100% het pied female subadult or adult to at least make some pieds if she doesn't prove out)

Those are our options for this girl.

[David Reid]

Is she going to be breedable this year? If she is, take her to your best male that is breedable. If she is not going to be breedable, and if you LOVE Pieds, get yourself a Pied male that you cannot live without, and take your time getting him. Try to prove your female genetic this year, and prove out the Pied theory later.

Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

She weighed in at 1167 grams a few days ago on empty. She probably could go this season after a few more meals, but I don't have a male for her that is ready. Our lil bee is only 200grams.

[David Reid]

Ah, then you can buy a larger male of your choice at the show, or just wait. OR, you could send her down here:) My male is about 650 grams or more. They look identical:) Plus, I have a Pied male too...

Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

The show isn't until the end of Jan, so I'll probably just be patient and let her get nice and big and start her up next time. And she is staying right where she is. :P lol

[David Reid]

Yeah, one extra year of eating and growing is not going to hurt....just get her a cool male. Your Pied idea might not be bad, because there is no visual morph to muddy the offspring and make it more difficult to tell if she proved out or not. I will be breeding my male this year, I will post pics of anything cool....

Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

I agree. I think that will be the route I go w/her. Let her get nice and big, so hopefully she kicks out a decent sized clutch and go w/either a het pied or vis pied male for her. Definitely keep me posted on what your male produces. Hopefully we're onto something here :)

[Bob O'Brien]

Amazing Dinker Female! Any ideas?

Yes I have an idea send her over here!!

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Coming from you Bob, that says alot about her lol. You have and produce absolutely stunning animals!

[Bob O'Brien]

Thanks Bo, hopefully she produces some great stuff for you.

[dturner100]

If I may offer my advice: Don't breed her to a normal or a pied/het pied.

As for the normal, people say it's the best way to determine "morph or not". Not true. If you breed her to your bumble bee you could end up with a good mix of babies. Either way if her trait is inherited by any of the babies it will be as obvious as it would be or more than with a normal. On top of that you can end up jump starting into a triple gene with a new morph rather than saying "Oh yay she's genetic. Let's get started with the big stuff next year".

As for breeding her to a pied. I believe Dave also said this, or something similar but if you don't have reason to believe that she has the pied gene other than markers you're just going to end up making dinker 100% het pieds.

Markers like that are often a good sign, but WAY over diagnosed as "het pied" markers. Just keep your fingers crossed that they're unique markers to her genetics.

Anyway good luck with her. She's beautiful.

[B&C Ball Pythons]

I just received an indepth email from another breeder who has done quite a bit of work w/pieds and she also agrees with you guys/gals about the markers. They don't mean much , and at best, something to play with later on with offspring If I want to. Now the debate of normal or single/dlb/triple male lol. We still plan on buying a male or two in Jan at the show up here. This is alot of fun discussing this with all of you! :)

[chamgirl99471]

I would breed to the old standby Pastel Male :D Good basic starter and you could prove out her genetics and see if it's the pattern, coloration or both with a Pastel! That's just me though :)

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Another valid point. That's the beauty of the situation I'm in. Males are so cheap I can pretty much pick w/e I want to test her with :)

[rcpreis3]

Id personally go with a cinny male. I think her blushing would make really pretty cinnys!

[Omnomnami]

I say you drive over here and we can put her in the bed chamber with my Black Pewter. :p She would make some neat Black Pastels and Black Pewters for sure.

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Plenty of people want to offer her a "winter vacation." lol. I'm gonna let her get to 1500+ before she gets workin' us :)

[B&C Ball Pythons]

for us*

[CornNut]

Here is my pet store girl that proved out (calling Garcia line chocolate).

http://snakemorphs.com/collection/images/F97BPET_med_12years.jpg

Not an exact match but chocolates vary a lot so your girl could well be chocolate. After having seen the supers if I where in your position I would be tempted to really muddy the waters and get a chocolate or chocolate combo male. If you produce a super you know but of course there is the down side of not knowing if she proved at all if you miss the super. But I love a gamble so I'd go for the super.

My founder female has a mostly clear belly but doesn't have those het pied markers. I did produce a pair of keeper het pied marked Garcia line chocolates this year breeding to well markered possible het pied girls.

[David Reid]

Bo, you ever produce any babies with that female? I bred my male to a cool female but no eggs, going to try them again this year....going to pair them up soon.

Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

A few locks so far :thumbsup:

[scratchypen]

love the snake!

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Thanks. It's fun to read this after originally posting it a year ago.

[MrBig]

Wow didn't realize how old the thread was. Cool looking girl for sure. WHat did you decide to go with? Can't quite tell but looks Fire or vanilla? Best of luck either way.

[B&C Ball Pythons]

[QUOTE=MrBig;1380684]Wow didn't realize how old the thread was. Cool looking girl for sure. WHat did you decide to go with? Can't quite tell but looks Fire or vanilla? Best of luck either way.

I'm pairing her with a yellow belly. It was the highest voted morph among people I asked :)

[john33]

Bo pick your favorite male and breed them. You know your base morphs so just hope for an odd male out of the clutch to run back to her. Then you can look for a codom super. If you get nothing two clutches in a row, probably not genetic. Chad had a line called PE stripe that bares a strong resemblance. Best of luck!

[john33]

My bad only read first page...

[B&C Ball Pythons]

No worries John :) Thanks for your input. I talked to Chad a while back about his PE stripe. We both agreed after tossing some pics and thoughts around that she probably isn't.

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Well. Bad news. She didn't go this season :( I only witnessed two locks w/our yb and tossed in our bee and she wasn't interested in him either. She was old enough, but just wasn't ready I suppose. She's back on heat and took a rat last night. I'll fatten her back up and hope for next season. To be continued......

[David Reid]

My male is breeding a nice burgandy looking female, I will keep you posted.


Dave

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Sounds good Dave. Best of luck!

[CornNut]

It took me 10 years to get from my pet store pickup to hatching my first supers of my Garcia line chocolate:

http://snakemorphs.com/images/20110715065758_2010garciasuperchocolate1.jpg

Most of that was getting her to start producing so hopefully you will not have to be as patient as me. Best of luck for 2013!

[B&C Ball Pythons]

I hope not Randy lol. It's ok though. We'll just have to see what happens next fall :)

[BaltimoreBees]

I hope it works out! I've been reading this thread since it was posted (or a year or so ago lol) and I've been very excited to see if they prove out. They are such nice animals!

[B&C Ball Pythons]

This has been going for a lonnnng time lol. Guess I have to keep everyone waiting for another year! hehe

[MrBig]

Hey Bo it is way early to be calling it quits already. I have girls who have been paired since October that are just now begining to build follicles (around 5mm) so they probably won't go until mid-late summer. I would keep on trucking and keep on pairing for this year.

[B&C Ball Pythons]

Maybe I'll try to pair once a week and see if she shows interest. I think she wants to get back into feeding mode instead of breeding mode.

[BaltimoreBees]

I was told that after some females lock for the first time they start eating. I also noticed this with our het pied female. She's of breeding size but had stopped eating so we threw the Pied to her just in case and she has started eating like crazy again. Just a thought.