3-way trade between myself, HerpLuver, & Michael Williams

[PerfectPetPython]

I'm planning on sending $150 via postal money order to HerpLover (Chris Altzer). Chris had originally sent this amount of money to Michael Williams, who did not end up sending him the right animal. Michael had told Chris he would replace the animal with the right animal.
I had told Michael that I was looking for a 1600 gram female, but Chris declined stating he wants a refund. Michael has agreed to allow me to send Chris his refund, and I will send Michael $50 to help cover shipping on his behalf. I feel I am helping both parties solve a problem, and I am getting a snake that I would eventually bought from someone else anyway. This may also help clear up any bad name associated with Michael/Elisa Cox.

After Chris recieves his money and verifies he has recieved it, he is no longer responsible for what happens between Michael and I. I would like both parties to include some form of agreement publicly.

Thank you,
Anne Marie Troff

[HerpLuver]

The refund is actually based on a purchase i made with Micheal in June of 05 where i purchased 0.2 LTC Ball Pythons. Micheal had agreed on a live arrival, health, etc.. guarantee. The largest of the females was DOA when she arrived and the smaller female was over 400 grams smaller than advertised. The total purchase price was 250 plus shipping, so i asked Micheal via email if i could get 150 back, 125 for the DOA and 25 for the misrepresented size of the smaller animal. Micheal had agreed last year but i never received a refund. In an Ad that Micheal and Elisa Cox had posted selling some animals Elisa stated she would make good on any bad deals that Micheal had made in the past. Micheal also agreed. He offered me a replacement animal, but i refused saying i just wanted a refund. Charisma offered to send ME the 150 dollars for an animal she wanted from Micheal, a 1600 gram female. She will also send Micheal 50 dollars for overnight shipping as has been stated already. Micheal has agreed to this process, and Charisma has agreed that after i receive the money and verify that i have received it, that i am no longer responsible for what happens with Charisma and Micheals deal. In other words, i will not be requested to refund the money to Charisma.

Im 100% in agreeance with this deal and as far as i can tell so is Micheal.

Charisma, thanks greatly for your help in getting me what is rightfully owed, i appreciate your assistance!

[HerpLuver]

Also, i wanted to put my contact info here so it is publicly known that i have given it

Chris Altizer
126 W Inca St
Aberdeen, MD 21001
410-306-6192

[PerfectPetPython]

I'm just waiting for Micheal to post publicly that this is at least a 1600 gram female, nothing is wrong with her, she is not sick and does not have any parasites, etc... and guarantees live arrival on her.
When I hear back from him, I will send out the money orders.
Also, Micheal, I need your address.

[PerfectPetPython]

Also, we need to know when the animal is to be shipped.
I will put delivery confirmation on both money orders, and I expect my animal (1600 gram female ball python, 100% healthy) to be shipped out within 10 (ten) business days.

[HerpLuver]

All sounds fair, have you PMed Micheal (im sure you have, just checking) or maybe called him to let him know of this thread? Im sure he'll get to it ASAP, he has been answering posts on a semi-regular basis lately so it shouldnt be too long.

Micheal, when you post please verify our agreement and answer these questions for Charisma;

1- What is the exact weight or approximate weight of the female BP?

2- Is the female healthy?

3- Does she have any parasites known or possible?

4- Will you be able to ship within 10 business days of receiving Charisma's 50 dollar money order?

5- Do you have any issues you wish to bring up regarding this agreement?

[PerfectPetPython]

thank you Chris.
He's been PMed the link already. :)

[Bigman101]

1- What is the exact weight or approximate weight of the female BP?
the one im sending is 1300gr. eating live smal rats once in a while. or african fats often.

2- Is the female healthy? she is healthy in every way. but she has shed bad a few times for me. but she hasn't done that in a long time.

3- Does she have any parasites known or possible? none. inside or out

4- Will you be able to ship within 10 business days of receiving Charisma's 50 dollar money order? yes i would be able to send

5- Do you have any issues you wish to bring up regarding this agreement?
no

[PerfectPetPython]

the 1300 gram female sounds fine Michael.
I'll send you a PM for your address.

HerpLuver--Your money order will go out tomarrow. If you would like tracking information just send me a PM or give me a call.

Michael--If I hear back from you today with your addy I'll go ahead and send your money order out tomarrow as well.

Thanks guys! :)

[HerpLuver]

Today i received the $150 dollar postal money order from Charisma, although the name on the money order is Anne Troff as who its from. Everything is good from my end.

Micheal, if you received the $50 dollar money order please post here and let Charisma know a shipping date so we can finalize this agreement.

Again Charisma, I want to thank you very much for this, especially NOW that im in a financial bind it helps a WHOLE lot.

Charisma is a great person and very easy on the ears via telephone ;)

Incoming feedback for Charisma!

Just wondering, Who's Anne Troff?

[PerfectPetPython]

Just wondering, Who's Anne Troff?


That's my real name. Charisma Star is just my online screen name. I've been meaning to have Rich change it in my profile... just been lazy. :)

I'm glad you received it. Thanks for the feedback, I'll post some for you too now. =o)

[PerfectPetPython]

Charisma is a great person and very easy on the ears via telephone

Aww, thank you! :)

[PerfectPetPython]

Just waiting to hear back from Michael. Sent PM earlier today.

[PerfectPetPython]

Label/Receipt Number: 0305 0830 0004 2022 2575
Status: Delivered

Your item was delivered at 9:49 am on May 10, 2006 in CORPUS CHRISTI, TX 78412.

Michael it's been 4 days since you've received the money order.... I've sent you a PM... can you please send me a reply or give me a call at your convenience?

[PerfectPetPython]

Day 7; 72 hours remain.

[PerfectPetPython]

Day 8; 48 hours remain.

[PerfectPetPython]

Day 9; 24 hours remain.

[Cat_72]

Today is Sunday, there is no way for him to ship her out in the remaining 24 hours.

[PerfectPetPython]

The least he could do is CONTACT ME. He CAN do that in 24 hours.

[Cat_72]

Anne, you have much more faith in this transaction than I could. After owing Herpluver for nearly a year, and everything else that has gone on, I have a hard time believing he's suddenly going to make things right. I truly wish for your sake that he does, but I'm not holding my breath. Good luck to you.

[norsmis]

I have to agree with Cathy on this one. I do wish the best though.....

[PerfectPetPython]

thank you Cathy. :)
I know it sounds stupid... but I like to see the best out of people. I believe people can and do change. I'm not saying Mike is or has, but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt.

[PerfectPetPython]

well he's definitely behind.... no contact, no email. Looks like I'll have to find other means to get my money back. I wont throw out threats though... Welcome to the real world Mike, you'll be getting a taste of it shortly. :)

[norsmis]

Anne, I wont preach to you and I do hope the best for you but I think you just got a taste of the real world. There are a lot of people in this hobby/industry that will take your money and run. That is why the BOI exist. Please don't put yourself out there like this because people will take advantage of you. Best of luck in getting your money back.

[Cat_72]

thank you Cathy. :)
I know it sounds stupid... but I like to see the best out of people. I believe people can and do change. I'm not saying Mike is or has, but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt.

Trust me Anne, I understand what you say. It hasn't taken me long to learn how a person gets kicked in the rear for trusting too much in this business, though.

[PerfectPetPython]

Norsmis--I'm well aware that there are people out there that take money and run... I've read all about it on the BOI. I guess I just don't understand why someone would try and steal money.... while giving out their personal information.....um...duh??? Does he not think that people won't do anything?? $200 may not be MUCH, but depending on how LOUD the person who complains is, it CAN and WILL have the FBI showing up at his door. I've had to do it before--Someone sold me a PSP from California and did the exact same thing, had to send them a money order. To make a long story short, the FBI was involved, this person had to pay restitution, went to court, had 25 hours community service, had to pay court fee's, went on probation for a year.... and this person was a minor.--this was all over $150.

I trust people until they screw me. I won't throw threats out at Michael--I will just do what needs to be done and contact who needs to be contacted. And as soon as it's all over with--you bet, there will be a post in the BOI all about this. This is sad it came to this, and even though some may think I am making a deal about such a low amount of money--they need to think that it's not about the money--it's the moral. bad people like him need to be stopped early.

[norsmis]

Anne I don't disagree with you at all. I don't care if its $200 or $2,000,000, the person is stealing something that you worked hard to get. I guess what I was trying to say was most of the people in this industry who are labeled bad guys tend to stay that way and never change their ways, no matter how many times the chance to redeem themselves is offered. This person was a known bad guy. I understand you were only giving this person an opportunity to make things right and get the snake you were looking for. But look where trying to help one of these guys out got you. No money, no snake and lots of bs trying to get what is yours.

[PerfectPetPython]

just for a little update, I did give them a call, they're great at returning phone calls, no problems there.

He said the postal money order was not recieved.....
tracking info is:
03050830000420222575

on the USPS site it said it was received.

Here is a copy of the stub, I've also emailed this to both email addresses I have for Elisa & Michael.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v363/feathernfur/Picture145.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v363/feathernfur/Picture146.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v363/feathernfur/Picture147.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v363/feathernfur/Picture148.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v363/feathernfur/Picture149.jpg

Tomarrow I will file a claim at the post office.

[norsmis]

Good luck Anne. I hope you get your money back at least. Now we all have another name to add to the LONG list of bad guys.....

[Bill_Leverton]

Anne, I am truly sorry that this has happened to you, And so much for them trying to become upstanding citizens, :rolleyes: I hope this all works out for you and you get your snake or "Cash".

[Bill & Amy]

So if he never received the money order, why didn't he return your emails? Something smells and my cages don't need to be cleaned. :raspberry

[PerfectPetPython]

eh, some people change, others dont I guess. My bad, I thought they all did at one point or another, maybe it's just not time for Mike to grow up yet!

I'll be honest, I've been busy working, and haven't put much effort into getting my money back, I'll contact him again in a couple of days.
Bill--asked him that, he changed the subject.