Disgusted with Banner ad on this site...

[Tim Cole]

These people are advertising and selling one eyed and no eyed turtles and are proud of it! Obviously they are severely inbred. Some of the turtles they are selling do make good pets but COME ON, Red-eared Sliders have became a major burden on Rescue Groups just like Green Iguanas & Burmese Pythons. Selling these is bad enough but to sell ones that are defective is really low.

:angry:TurtleSale.com (http://turtlesale.com/1html)

[boybronco]

Wow...I never even pay attention to ads but now that you bring it up you have a great point. That is pretty ridiculous. The advertiser should be removed...

[Scott Ashton]

Its not a banner on the Fauna system - its a Google banner ad that runs in a rotation.

It is possible to block that ad through the AdSense control panel.

[Clay Davenport]

Or even better, every time you see the ad displayed, click on it. Rich will get a little money from Google and the owner of the website will have to pay for the click.
Kind of a win win situation as long as you don't actually buy anything from the site.

[Otter_23]

I think I'll do that.

[Stardust]

Or even better, every time you see the ad displayed, click on it. Rich will get a little money from Google and the owner of the website will have to pay for the click.
Kind of a win win situation as long as you don't actually buy anything from the site.

:rofl: Never thought of it that way.

[Clay Davenport]

I use the same thing on my site to help offset the hosting costs and all. I also get a few ads we would consider unsavory. One for instance was a company that sold snake skin products. Billfolds, trinkets, and whatnot. I could have blocked the ads from being displayed on my site, but I figured why bother? No one visiting my site is going to buy anything from them, and any time someone clicked on the ad to see what it was I got a few pennies and it cost them a little more than that.
I haven't seen those particular ads show up on my site in a while, so I tend to think they discovered it was not a viable advertising source and quit the program, which was just as good.

I have however blocked ads from Peta and the HSUS, just because they are our mortal enemies and I don't want anyone encouraged to go there for any reason even if it is to put a few pennies in my pocket.
Everything else is fair game though. I don't mind Petco or the guy selling snake skins helping me pay server costs.

[Stardust]

:rofl: I like that logic! All of it including but not limited to peta!

[KelliH]

I agree Tim, the ad and the folks behind it are disgusting. This is another reason on my list of why I will not use Google ads on my site. I'd rather pay the hosting fee each month than have to look at ads for one eyed turtles and snake skin trinkets, yucko.

[boybronco]

Or even better, every time you see the ad displayed, click on it. Rich will get a little money from Google and the owner of the website will have to pay for the click.
Kind of a win win situation as long as you don't actually buy anything from the site.
Actually mentioning this is illegal and can get your advertising privledges pulled.

That post along with this one ought to be removed.

I've had sites lose their advertising for saying things like this, just a suggestion.

[Scott Ashton]

Actually mentioning this is illegal and can get your advertising privledges pulled.

That post along with this one ought to be removed.

I've had sites lose their advertising for saying things like this, just a suggestion.


Its not illegal.

It violates Googles TOS for their AdSense program.

Clay saying it isn't an issue since Clay isn't the owner of nor in the employ of Fauna Classifieds. It would be a problem if Rich made a similar statement.

[Clay Davenport]

Scott is absolutely right. It isn't even remotely illegal. While if I said the same thing on my site it could cost me my account with Google since that would be a violation of their TOS, I can encourage clicking on them all I want here because I in no way benefit from those clicks.
There's a huge difference between violating a terms of service agreement, which hasn't been done here, and actually breaking the law, which is the definition of illegal.

[Lucille]

ought to be removed.



Scott has a good analysis; it is neither illegal; nor when done by us a violation of anyone's TOS.

And I do not think it ought to be removed. It is a thoughtful way to deal with people who advertise to make money off of handicapped animals not apparently to benefit the animals themselves but it seems for commercial purposes..

I do not know exactly how adsense works but it seems to target words we use while talking. Here, from one of their ads:



Google AdSense is a fast and easy way for website publishers of all sizes to display relevant Google ads on their website's content pages and earn money. Because the ads are related to what your visitors are looking for on your site — or matched to the characteristics and interests of the visitors your content attracts — you'll finally have a way to both monetize and enhance your content pages



I have noticed before that these ads reflect our conversations. If we talk about turtles, we might get the ad in question. If we talk about birds, or playground equipment, or recipes, somehow a program picks up on that and the ads reflect what we are talking about.

[Chris89]

The worst part was them breeding him to make more no/one eyed turtles..

[Tim Cole]

The worst part was them breeding him to make more no/one eyed turtles..

My point also.

[garweft]

I have noticed before that these ads reflect our conversations. If we talk about turtles, we might get the ad in question. If we talk about birds, or playground equipment, or recipes, somehow a program picks up on that and the ads reflect what we are talking about.

What conversation was it that initiated the dove womens deodorant add??? :rofl:

[Jim O]

What conversation was it that initiated the dove womens deodorant add??? :rofl:Had to have been something in Lonely Hearts. :rofl:

[Double LY]

What conversation was it that initiated the dove womens deodorant add??? :rofl:

Probably some "fecal" talk over on the BOI :D

[ReptileEmpire]

I have to say I didn't realize it was a google ad until someone mentioned it. That's just disgusting that they actually advertise it as some kind of valuable trait. They also advertise in Reptiles Magazine.

Probably some "fecal" talk over on the BOI :D
:lol01:
That's great...I haven't seen the Dove ad pop up yet.

[Clay Davenport]

Here's a good one. I got an add for "Pro Extender" penis enlargement system on a page I'm working on about reptile genetics. I don't know how talk about Punnett squares and possible hets draws an ad to enlarge your penis, but apparently Google sees a connection somewhere. :rofl:

It is however, the first of what I would consider an adult oriented ad to show up on my site. I would think Google wouldn't allow it. I think I'll block it regardless, I just don't want that one on there.

[ReptileEmpire]

Looks like they changed the ad. "Freddy" is not on the banner ad here anyway, I haven't went to their site to see if they are still advertising it there.

[Nirvana]

It always kind of surprised me that this company and their poor, eyeless turtles never came up on the BOI. I guess maybe it's just because there was nothing to inquire about; this company was and still is deliberately breeding deformed turtles -- animals deprived of an entire sense, I might ad -- and that's that.

In a way, I think it's almost a good thing that they make such a huge deal out of it -- that way anyone considering a purchase from this company will know that they're also breeding these deformed animals and can therefore know not to support them, and take their business elsewhere!

[darkbloodwyvern]

It always kind of surprised me that this company and their poor, eyeless turtles never came up on the BOI. I guess maybe it's just because there was nothing to inquire about; this company was and still is deliberately breeding deformed turtles -- animals deprived of an entire sense, I might ad -- and that's that.

In a way, I think it's almost a good thing that they make such a huge deal out of it -- that way anyone considering a purchase from this company will know that they're also breeding these deformed animals and can therefore know not to support them, and take their business elsewhere!

It helps when they put their cards on the table. I feel rather dumb regarding this ad since I PMed Webslave about it and he had to explain the google thing. :o oops, i hadn't known that that was how that sort of thing worked *sheepish* I don't know how much turtles use their sense of sight, but it is still pretty messed up to limit pet animals in ways like this. I know that diurnal albinos can also have problems, but this just seems taking the trend a bit too far.

[Nirvana]

Right. Morphs are one thing, and breeding for other forms of morphological differences can be debatable (the "scaleless" snakes, for example, or hairless mammalian pets) but deliberately breeding an animal to be deprived of one of its senses is just disgusting, IMO. I know my turtles seem to be very visually oriented...

On the topic of the Google ads: I think the subject of the ad displayed depends on what conversations are currently being posted on the forums. For example, the ad currently being displayed on my computer is for none other than the topic of this conversation: Google ad services! (No kidding!)

[ReptileEmpire]

Looks like I spoke too soon. The eyeless turtle ad is back up again. I wonder why they changed it for awhile then changed it back?

[theturtleshop]

I'm not sure if any turtle breeders actually responded to this thread but www.turtlesale.com does not breed one eyed and no eyed turtles. That is just an advertising gimmick. These are simply deformities of nature. Millions of red ears are bred each year and the sheer number of hatchlings produces deformities such as one eyed and no eyed turtles. They sell so many varieties of turtles and tortoises, I doubt they do any breeding themselves. I by no means agree with turtlesale's advertising tactics. I remember they used to or still sell turtles with turtle lagoons. I just want to put everyone's mind at east that no one is breeding deformed turtles whether it be 2 headed turtles or no eyed turtles.

Andrew Yau

[Cat_72]

While this may be true, here is the actual text from their site:

No Eyed
Red Eared Slider Hatchlings
WELL THE PARENTS OF STEVIE HAVE DONE IT AGAIN !
These little babies are true miracles of nature.They have the same parents as Stevie our no eyed mascot.

[Stardust]

I can not for the life of me think of WHY this would be an advertising gimmick. What would be the purpose of it?
I find no humor or logic in it, all and all it is just disgusting.

[LadyOhh]

It always kind of surprised me that this company and their poor, eyeless turtles never came up on the BOI. I guess maybe it's just because there was nothing to inquire about; this company was and still is deliberately breeding deformed turtles -- animals deprived of an entire sense, I might ad -- and that's that.



This may be a little late in coming, but I think the fact that hopefully no one in their right mind on this forum would support that site and buy an eye-less turtle is one of the reasons that said topic is not on the BOI.


I HOPE :ack2:

[Tim Cole]

correct. Thats why it's here. There is a BOI thread about them stealing pictures though."Turtlesale.com Bad guy" (http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98163)

[Nirvana]

Andrew -- As Cathy pointed out, while I know they don't breed for bicephalic (two headed) or conjoined twin turtles (I don't even think it's possible to breed for those), they are definitely breeding for the eyeless trait.

[theturtleshop]

Although I don't want to get into an arguing match-think of the logic. 2 BLIND turtles breeding is nearly impossible. Red ear sliders have a courtship where both male and female red ears will vibrate their arms/nails in front of the others' head. This courtship requires eyes. Likewise when the male pursues the female-this also requires eyes. Although turtles do have a great sense of smell, I doubt they can find each other in a tank-mate no less. I'm not saying that it is impossible-but very unlikely. Turtles do not have a mating call-they use their eyes. So back to the point of breeding eyeless red ears. If turtlesale is in fact breeding red ears, he should consistently be producing perfect hatchling red ears with no eyes. He would also have plenty available. Instead of getting a perfect red ear with no eyes, he often has eyeles red ears with split scutes. This is an indication of deformities either due to temps during incubation or just a random deformity due to the sheer number of red ears being bred. Will any other turtle breeders chime in and give their two cents? So the question remains why would turtlesale say that eyeless turtles are a genetic trait? This is because believe it or not, there are many people out there that want to breed eyeless turtles and would be more inclined to buy an eyeless turtle if it was a genetic trait. Every year I get calls asking me if 2 headed or siamese turtles are genetic traits. If you want me to get into the nitty gritty about genetics and how unlikely it is that he is breeding eyeless turtles I would be happy to but anyone who has any turtle experience will know how quite impossible it is. Again-I don't like turtlesale-the company is whats wrong with the turtle business, I'm just saying that you guys are getting upset over nothing.

Andrew Yau

[ReptileEmpire]

If you read the site they are not breeding eyeless turtles together, they are breeding two turtles that produce eyeless offspring together repeatedly. Basically they are claiming the parents are heterozygous for a genetic defect causing the homozygous offspring to be "eyeless".

Whether their claims are true or not does not matter to me, it is just plain wrong to even claim to do it.

[Cat_72]

I'm just saying that you guys are getting upset over nothing.

Turtle breeding 101 aside....the guy is advertising defective animals at a premium price, he is either breeding them purposely or lying to the buying public about doing so (thus perhaps inspiring the inflated price, making people think it IS a genetic trait), and he steals other people's photos to represent the animals he is selling.

He is dishonest and selling defective animals at a premium price. In my book, that's not "nothing".

[boybronco]

Looks like I spoke too soon. The eyeless turtle ad is back up again. I wonder why they changed it for awhile then changed it back?
Google ads are randomly generated based on the words on the website. They change every time you refresh the page.

[Nirvana]

I can see how two eyeless turtles would have a tough time mating, but I don't find it too hard to imagine that there's some major defect that the phenotypically normal parents are carrying that would cause the eyelessness -- as well as the split scutes and other deformities. I know there's (essentially) no way to breed for conjoined twinning, but wouldn't it be possible to consistently produce eyeless babies? (I'm not trying to start an argument; I'm just genuinely curious...)

Genetic or not, it's still deliberately marketing severely deformed animals in one way or another ... I can understand selling the two-headed ones I guess -- I realize those poor things just crop up naturally due to the sheer volumes of turtles being farmed, and the high price just reflects demand -- but eyelessness?

He also seems to have a lot more eyeless turtles than two headed ones ...

[ReptileEmpire]

Google ads are randomly generated based on the words on the website. They change every time you refresh the page.

Correct, what I was saying is that they had actually changed their ad, they have one showing land tortoises and not Freddy. It was showing up for about two days, now it is showing Freddy again. It looks like they have several different ads, but the one with Freddy runs the most.

[ReptileEmpire]

He is dishonest and selling defective animals at a premium price. In my book, that's not "nothing".

:iagree:

[theturtleshop]

Well, just randomly finding 2 "normal" looking turtles who happen to be both "het" for the eyeless gene seems a bit ridiculous to me, no matter if their claims are true or not I agree that their advertising tactics are less than kosher. Turtlesale to me-and to serious turtle hobbyists/breeders are what is wrong with the turtle business. As for the question as to why eyeless turtles pop up more than Siamese or two-headeds? I don't know but I am guessing that 2 headeds and Siamese turtles are a more extreme deformity which requires twins to begin with. Anyhoo, let me share with you a picture of my personal 2 headed turtle. They are 2 years old and growing great! On another note, I acquired a pastel western paint with no eyes last year. The pic is shown below. Pastels of any turtle morph are not a proven trait and most likely due to incubation temp irregularities. Anyhow enjoy. The pastel is currently living at a reptile exhibit and to my knowledge is still alive and well.

Andrew

[Nirvana]

Andrew -- you're right in that it does seem pretty unlikely that there would be two "het" for eyeless parents ... I could see it happening, but who knows. They do claim that the parents that produced their "mascot" eyeless turtle also produced the eyeless babies, but then again, why should anyone believe them? Also, what you say makes perfect sense as to why the eyeless trait would pop up more than two-headedness...

That two headed baby you have looks remarkably healthy -- two years old -- Wow! Good luck with it! :)