USARK NO More

[JohnRougeux]

"Over turning the federal ruling is still something i see as a priority, however it has to be done correctly. We need strong scientific data to support this and that is something I am personally working on. Once we have that data to prove this is a south Florida issue, then the money will be the next goal. I, as a board member of USARK, do not want to take money off people until we have conclusive data in our hand. Challenge it and lose as a result of no strong scientific support will crush a second chance and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. I empathize with everyone impacted by the python/anaconda ban, and the boa ban still looms over our head, but we need to proceed sensibly, with supporting data not hearsay. As a boa breeder/hobbyist, I have a stake in this but want to see the fight directed correctly.

Regards,
Warren"

For the love of God Dr. Booth, USARK has been asking for donations for the last year for the BIG LAWSUIT.

A year after one of the USARK fluffers shilled money on just about every reptile forum in existence you now state that you "do not want to take money off people until we have conclusive data in our hand"?

USARK asked for money and people sent in $300K in anticipation for a lawsuit. Now we find out that 95% of that money went to the Prez, his expense account and a lobbyist?

WTF?

Seriously, WTF?

Uh, did you not read all what he said? Did Warren come here asking for the money for the lawsuit or did Andrew?

All I recall is seeing Andrew posting about donating. So why are you trying to bust Warren's balls when he clearly states what his intentions are?

And I guess you have never worked in an industry that utilizes lobbyists? Those people are expensive!

We will never beat HSUS if we keep being ignorant of expenditures and have unrealistic goals. Beating any legislate takes money & the herp nation has been POOR at contributing, myself included.

And with herp sites not working together it is further undermining the efforts.

Let things settle down and check out each organization rationally.

I will say this about Wyatt's new one....since when have you all ever seen the Zoo people EVER side with private breeders?

 

[RichsBallPythons]

If not mistaken, the not telling why they were fired is a grey area with Non profit organizations. Since their money comes from US donors, which entitles to a reason WHY.

When a company you worked for and they let you go or fire you, They legally cant say a Negative word about you. If they are caught disclosing information to why your no longer there, they can become liable for all damages and then some in the court of law.


But I know i read somewhere Non Profit was handled differently since WE paid for their income. So Technically we are their boss without out money they HAVE no group

 

[Lucille]

representatives of this site

You do not have your facts, I do not represent this site, I am an ordinary member who has as much right to an opinion (and to ask questions) as you do.
There are many who are asking valid questions about political and financial issues here, it seems as if you are coming here and attempting to hush anyone who voices them.

 

[Skiploder]

Let me throw my 2 cents in here.

If USARK is like ANY other organization out there, they cannot legally say why Andrew left other than what was agreed upon at Andrews departure.

It's just like if you get fired or left your job. Human Resources will only tell your prospective employer that either 1) you will not be rehired or 2) you can be rehired.

Anything else, legally, is not allowed. Granted, it probably happens, but good luck proving it.

They amicably had a difference in philosophy - right? Doesn't sound like he was fired. They both wish each other the best.

Yeah, none of us are buying that either.

So, Dr. Booth is doing the correct thing. If he was to say anything further, Andrew could sue them. If you want to find out what the differences are, why not ask Andrew? Surely he will tell you or put it in an interview with Herp Nation

I am eagerly awaiting the new hype over Mr. Wyatt's next misadventure.

As for the salary, why isn't Andrew being dragged over the coals on that one? Is Andrew here (and at other herp sites) explaining what he did and why he left? Hell no. At least USARK is here.

The Board had a say in what how much he was compensated.

Look John, until a day ago, Wyatt was USARK, and outside of his posts asking for more money, he very deftly dodged all hard questions.

Want to see where the money goes/is going? Take 5 seconds and google it. That's what I did and I will even save you more time:
http://usark.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/US ARK Budget 2011- Actual.pdf

Took five seconds and Googled it before I even posted. Actually I took about 5 minutes and found nothing:

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&tbo=d&...6c4185e3aafb42&bpcl=40096503&biw=1676&bih=936

I am not a USARK shill. I did donate a whopping $40 last year. But I hate seeing mob mentality against someone who volunteers to come to this site to try to answer the best that he can. Had you read on the you would have known that he was over in Europe and traveling back home. Yet he is taking time to post here and at other places.

Can you all at least take a step back and give the man some time? And stop asking questions that he can't legally or freely talk about?

Go do some research on Wyatt's new organization. And ask him why he doesn't come here to answer anything. Gotta make you wonder!

All you gotta do is look around hard at the crumbling support for USARK. Yep, alot of it was due to Mr. Wyatt. At this point, it is in the best interests of Mr. Booth and the other Board members to regain the trust that has been lost - not the other way around.

Getting rid of Mr. Wyatt was a good first step. As was their recent open disclosure of the budget. Judging from all of the people asking the budget question, I'm guessing many of them had the same luck with their 5 second Google searches.

Congrats, John, $38 of that $40 went to the guy you have criticized..........

Not sure why the link doesn't work or why **** didn't show up?

Not allowed here.

 

[JohnRougeux]

If he'd have read, as he's harping on others about, just a few posts up it's mentioned that particular forum is blocked from being posted here.

My mistake, I skimmed over that post.

How is "my harping on others" the same as me missing something unrelated to the topic at hand? Please, do explain.

Are you a representative of this site? Honestly, I don't know.

But that mentality (blocking out mentioning other herp sites for reasons that I am not aware of) of us vs Them is exactly why we as a herp nation struggles with overcoming HSUS or other such organizations. We fight amongst ourselves! Why?!? This division is exactly what the HSUS loves seeing.

Make amends with other sites. Even if "they started it". Be the bigger person/site. Let's band together in this common goal that affects us all. Don't be divisive.

 

[JohnRougeux]

If not mistaken, the not telling why they were fired is a grey area with Non profit organizations. Since their money comes from US donors, which entitles to a reason WHY.

When a company you worked for and they let you go or fire you, They legally cant say a Negative word about you. If they are caught disclosing information to why your no longer there, they can become liable for all damages and then some in the court of law.


But I know i read somewhere Non Profit was handled differently since WE paid for their income. So Technically we are their boss without out money they HAVE no group

I work for a non-profit company. Same laws apply.

 

[JohnRougeux]

You do not have your facts, I do not represent this site, I am an ordinary member who has as much right to an opinion (and to ask questions) as you do.
There are many who are asking valid questions about political and financial issues here, it seems as if you are coming here and attempting to hush anyone who voices them.

Wow, really? I always thought you were a moderator or something, sorry. Then I retract what I said earlier.

My post wasn't meant to hush anyone up. How can I do that when I am a member here like you? Am I not allowed to speak my mind?

 

[JohnRougeux]

You do not have your facts, I do not represent this site, I am an ordinary member who has as much right to an opinion (and to ask questions) as you do.
There are many who are asking valid questions about political and financial issues here, it seems as if you are coming here and attempting to hush anyone who voices them.

Wow, really? I always thought you were a moderator or something, sorry. Then I retract what I said earlier.

My post wasn't meant to hush anyone up. How can I do that when I am a member here like you? Am I not allowed to speak my mind?

Oh, and btw, if your only rebuttal is that I don't have all my facts cause I mistakenly thought you did represent this site....well....look at my response again and see if there's anything else you want to chime in on

 

[Skiploder]

Uh, did you not read all what he said? Did Warren come here asking for the money for the lawsuit or did Andrew?

USARK did.

All I recall is seeing Andrew posting about donating. So why are you trying to bust Warren's balls when he clearly states what his intentions are?

Dr. Booth's intentions and recent statements contradict the non-stop shilling that USARK has done and most of it was done by Andrew's lackeys. You want people to support the new USARK? Have USARK 2013 apologize for the misleading BS USARK 2008-2012 has thrown around.

And I guess you have never worked in an industry that utilizes lobbyists? Those people are expensive!

and apparently pretty damn ineffective.

We will never beat HSUS if we keep being ignorant of expenditures and have unrealistic goals. Beating any legislate takes money & the herp nation has been POOR at contributing, myself included.

Yep. The Herp Nation has been pretty pathetic. Almost non-existent. Most of the donations come from businesses and large breeders. Maybe the Herp Nation was sending USARK a message.

And with herp sites not working together it is further undermining the efforts.

Crappy USARK leadership has undermined the efforts. Right now, even you are attempting to distance USARK 2013 from USARK 2008-2012. I don't blame you, I'm ashamed I ever sent them money.

Back in 2008 and 2009 there were many of us calling for unity with PIJAC, but there was a loud counter movement calling for all of the support to go to USARK.

Now USARK 2013 is calling for a new spirit of unity. It's about damn time.

I will say this about Wyatt's new one....since when have you all ever seen the Zoo people EVER side with private breeders?

Never.

Seriously John, are we to believe that Andrew was the one pulling ALL the strings for USARK 2008-2012? Some other little chickens need to come forward and admit their share in this.

Only after some cards are laid on the table, will USARK 2013 be able to move forward. Lay out what went wrong up to this point and address all of those failures and missteps to those who USARK 2013 seeks to get support from.

 

[JohnRougeux]

They amicably had a difference in philosophy - right? Doesn't sound like he was fired. They both wish each other the best.

Yeah, none of us are buying that either.

Obviously neither of us know if he was fired or what. Obviously they both came to terms on what would be publicly said. Still...USARK can't say anything else.



I am eagerly awaiting the new hype over Mr. Wyatt's next misadventure.

? Ok....


Look John, until a day ago, Wyatt was USARK, and outside of his posts asking for more money, he very deftly dodged all hard questions.

Yeah, ok. So wait...I thought u were sticking up for Andrew....?

Took five seconds and Googled it before I even posted. Actually I took about 5 minutes and found nothing:

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&tbo=d&...6c4185e3aafb42&bpcl=40096503&biw=1676&bih=936


Getting rid of Mr. Wyatt was a good first step. As was their recent open disclosure of the budget. Judging from all of the people asking the budget question, I'm guessing many of them had the same luck with their 5 second Google searches.

Congrats, John, $38 of that $40 went to the guy you have criticized..........

Not allowed here.

Sorry, posting on iPad doesn't make multi-quoting easy.

It sounds like we may be in more agreement than I realize. I am not trying to say that either USARK or Wyatt is right or wrong, but from what I have read, Andrew is not smelling so good.

 

[Skiploder]

Obviously neither of us know if he was fired or what. Obviously they both came to terms on what would be publicly said. Still...USARK can't say anything else.



I am eagerly awaiting the new hype over Mr. Wyatt's next misadventure.

? Ok....


Look John, until a day ago, Wyatt was USARK, and outside of his posts asking for more money, he very deftly dodged all hard questions.

Yeah, ok. So wait...I thought u were sticking up for Andrew....?





Sorry, posting on iPad doesn't make multi-quoting easy.

It sounds like we may be in more agreement than I realize. I am not trying to say that either USARK or Wyatt is right or wrong, but from what I have read, Andrew is not smelling so good.

Andrew never smelled good John.

The only thing we differ on is the steps that Dr. Booth needs to take in order to gain support from the community.

Having Dr. Booth on the masthead is a good thing. But right now the stink is on USARK. In order to come clean they need to come clean. It's as simple as that.

 

[Dan Krull]

NARBC leaves no doubt in this candid interview with Bob Ashley. Listen now at the link below:

http://www.herpnation.com/audio/breaking-news-narbc-leaves-no-doubt/

Dan Krull
Herp Nation Media

 

[WebSlave]

I dont think you can share other forums, i think it happened to another wesite too, someone was trying to post. *shrug*

No, not "other forums". Just one particular forum.

 

[Mooing Tricycle]

No, not "other forums". Just one particular forum.

Oh, i thought for some reason BP.net was blocked too... I tried to click the link ( assuming HAHA WE KNOW WHAT WE SAY ABOUT THAT!? that it was BP.net, not that forum. He who must not be named? lol...) but could not see the FULL link, so i thought it was theirs! I cant even access BP.nets site though, adblock is completely blocking them for me.

Sorry!

 

[JohnRougeux]

Took five seconds and Googled it before I even posted. Actually I took about 5 minutes and found nothing:

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&tbo=d&...6c4185e3aafb42&bpcl=40096503&biw=1676&bih=936

Well, if you google USARK, it is right there:
https://www.google.com/search?q=usa...&sugexp=chrome,mod=2&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

[JohnRougeux]

No, not "other forums". Just one particular forum.

Not wanting to start anything, it's just a question. Why isn't that particular website allowed to be mentioned?

I tried searching here and on google, but got no results.

So for those of us who don't know, how do we find out?

 

[Skiploder]

Well, if you google USARK, it is right there:
https://www.google.com/search?q=usa...&sugexp=chrome,mod=2&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Finally found it:

http://usark.org/library/

Still waiting to see how much of last years money has gone to the lawsuit.

 

[AbsoluteApril]

Not wanting to start anything, it's just a question. Why isn't that particular website allowed to be mentioned?

it's not relevant to this discussion and probably best if the subject is dropped

 

[JohnRougeux]

Finally found it:

http://usark.org/library/

Still waiting to see how much of last years money has gone to the lawsuit.

Since 2012 JUST ended, it'll probably be a few weeks before they finish up the budget from last year.

 

[JohnRougeux]

it's not relevant to this discussion and probably best if the subject is dropped

So I'll just start a new thread? Someone else brought it up because Dr. Booth had in fact responded several times at that site, so they referenced it.

That's how it's relevant to this thread.

And just dropping it because it's "best" is strange. I thought that I was just asking a question. Can you please point me to the rule book here so that I don't step on any more hidden landmines?