Bad Guy jordan russell..broker ..flipper,gone bad

[Guy Castro]

I must be mistaken, I thought Tibor requested/approach Jordan with the idea of consignment for the animals .

JR says Tibor initiated, and Tibor says JR initiated.

 

[Guy Castro]

Everyone sing along........ Oh where oh where have the boas all gone,oh where oh where can they be???

 

[Ed Clark]

I must be mistaken, I thought Tibor requested/approach Jordan with the idea of consignment for the animals .

Yes sir you are mistaken, Jordan contacted Tibor. it was posted in this thread.

 

[D34532]

Yes sir you are mistaken, Jordan contacted Tibor. it was posted in this thread.

I'm not an any side however both side said the other contacted each other... its all he said, he said. It would be more valid if one of the two posted a screen shot of any email that confirms this. Now I can't remember it the start of thus deal was a phone call or not.

What I still find funny is any we have from said convo between Tibor and Jordan is text typed "copy and paste" that can easly be faked. For example:

On Augt 1, 2014 I got an email from Ed Clark:

Ed: I'm going to send you a red dragon boa free of charge.
Me: Cool thanks I can't wait.

Lol I'm still waiting for my boa lol and still waiting for the tracking number.

That is all that that has been shown as "proof" on both side. I for one would like to see more then he said, he said. Now if I said that email from you was real wouldn't you want "proof" or what I type above is enough proof?

Again I'm not on one side or the other. Only reason I'm following this thread is because both guys had stock that I'm interested in the future.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

 

[johnnycamp5]

Yes sir you are mistaken, Jordan contacted Tibor. it was posted in this thread.

Wow.
If someone could please help me understand why a present day, experienced business owner, would choose to sell someones animals (or any object for that matter) on consignment?

Its no secret, more often than not, the consignee comes away with the feeling that "no good deed goes unpunished" and the consignor feels that they could have gotten more.

If it's true , I doubt that selling on "consignment" will be something that Jordan seeks out again, even with a detailed contract .

 

[Guy Castro]

Wow.
If someone could please help me understand why a present day, experienced business owner, would choose to sell someones animals (or any object for that matter) on consignment?

Its no secret, more often than not, the consignee comes away with the feeling that "no good deed goes unpunished" and the consignor feels that they could have gotten more.

If it's true , I doubt that selling on "consignment" will be something that Jordan seeks out again, even with a detailed contract .

Some "broker" other people's animals, so they can pocket some of the money.

 

[David Scarboro]

Wow.
If someone could please help me understand why a present day, experienced business owner, would choose to sell someones animals (or any object for that matter) on consignment?

Its no secret, more often than not, the consignee comes away with the feeling that "no good deed goes unpunished" and the consignor feels that they could have gotten more.

If it's true , I doubt that selling on "consignment" will be something that Jordan seeks out again, even with a detailed contract .

I would venture that Jordan saw some profit, either goods, services or cash in the deal. That is usually the way consignment works. Consignment with no return would make no sense at all. It is a shame that Jordan who has never had a problem voicing an opinion on the BOI is suddenly a no show.

 

[D34532]

Now this is in no way in any means to side with Jordan. Even if Jordan did contact Tibor about the consignment. In no way was Tibor force too do anything.

We would all be screwed if that was so by walking into any shop and an employee ask "how can I help you?" Or "would you like to see anything?" Would mean that we had to buy something because they asked.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 2

 

[DaveyFig]

I will refer others to the original thread again. Even Jordan saw it differently 6 months ago.

The boas were consigned at retail. Something I normally wouldn't do, but he was in a bind and I thought I could help him. The price was $800 ea and if anyone recalls them listed some were listed below this price. I was willing to eat $150 per snake on the less attractive animals and hope to make up the $150 on the more attractive ones. This was not a money making venture for me, I took these on to help him out. When they were not selling and we agreed to try and trade them out to help him cash out I believe I took on responsibility as a buyer. The animals have had to be traded around a few times at this point as quite honestly sales are slow. Beyond slow.

Lessons learned etc... I owe him, I'll pay him, I handled the situation incorrectly by ever trying to help move them by trading around and what I thought was a creative or strategic approach turned out to be nothing positive for the situation. Had that not occurred I would have just driven by and dropped off what hadn't sold and been done with this... instead we have animals he doesn't want, and aren't selling for me and I'm on the hook for the tab. C'est la vie.

Jordan

 

[Ed Clark]

JR says Tibor initiated, and Tibor says JR initiated.

Oh snap! I stand corrected.

After rereading they both are claiming the other asked to consign.

 

[David Scarboro]

Originally Posted by California Breeders Union View Post
The boas were consigned at retail. Something I normally wouldn't do, but he was in a bind and I thought I could help him. The price was $800 ea and if anyone recalls them listed some were listed below this price. I was willing to eat $150 per snake on the less attractive animals and hope to make up the $150 on the more attractive ones. This was not a money making venture for me, I took these on to help him out. When they were not selling and we agreed to try and trade them out to help him cash out I believe I took on responsibility as a buyer. The animals have had to be traded around a few times at this point as quite honestly sales are slow. Beyond slow.

Lessons learned etc... I owe him, I'll pay him, I handled the situation incorrectly by ever trying to help move them by trading around and what I thought was a creative or strategic approach turned out to be nothing positive for the situation. Had that not occurred I would have just driven by and dropped off what hadn't sold and been done with this... instead we have animals he doesn't want, and aren't selling for me and I'm on the hook for the tab. C'est la vie.

Jordan

That puts a new spin on it. Jordan clearly admits responsibility and states that he will pay him. Future buyers dealing with Jordan should beware. He may change his mind and take a completely different view of things at your expense. Jordan, would you like to explain?

 

[David Reid]

I would do business again and again with Jordan. I think people are reading into this based on the outcome they want to see. Jordan took the animals as a consignment, and when the animals did not sell, traded some away, with Tibor's consent. Things drug along at a snails pace, nothing was selling, not the original animals and not the traded for animals. Tibor wanted his money, Jordan, being the nice guy he is, agreed. After some soul searching, decided to go by the consignment agreement and not cave.

 

[DaveyFig]

I do not have a desired outcome. I don't know Tibor from anyone else, and only know Jordan as a breeder and retailer of fine exotic reptiles, and hero of the herp community through his work in supporting USARK. I just know that in both threads Jordan has accepted a debt, and agreed to pay cash. The first time, Tibor didn't even bring it up with him again until June, without any payment in between. This Time it took less than a week for Jordan to change his mind. It doesn't take "Soul Searching" to go back on one's word. If he never intended to pay, why weren't the cages and traded for animals dropped off in January/February? It bought him several months, and the ultimate outcome is that he didn't pay. I don't think he should have paid. I agree with everyone that says it was not his debt to pay. He saw it differently, or at least said that he did. Read his first reply in the other thread; the one where he posted before he was upset with Tibor.

Again, I think Tibor got exactly what he should have, but it is not what Jordan said he would get.

I still want to know when the Rosy boas were traded for, so I can understand if Tibor did know about every trade that ultimately ended with him getting one pair of snakes.

 

[David Reid]

Goes both ways, Tibor knows where Jordan lives, and could have driven over there any day during the 400 days Jordan was trying to sell Tibor's animals for Tibor.

Dave

 

[DaveyFig]

Yep, and you offered a truck both times.

 

[D34532]

I can't speak for Jordan or Tibor....however I've had exp. with people who slack off where I have tried to pay them back money or give them back item they left at my place, they refuse to meet at their requested time/place... Yes, their time and their place. Hence I take video/picture of the said event to prove I was there and such. So I can somewhat understand this mess.

I don't really see the repost quotes of stuff months ago before bad blood happen and question Jordan about it now. As far as my take on this part. Jordan try to make good on the deal with his friend Tibor with those post back then. My guess after those post Tibor made demand and threads to Jordan and Jordan's friend. Jordan change his mind because of these threats and untruths. I would honestly do the same If someone made threats to myself and my friends. I would just give back what was theirs and be done with it.

 

[D34532]

Here is the timeline as far as I understand it.
1. Tibor called/email Jordon for consigned animal Or Jordan called/emailed Tibor for consigned animal. (He said/ He said here) there has been no proof ie screenshot of email or phone bill to show who called who first.

2. Same animal sold and Tibor was paid for said animal. Both have claim this.

3. Some animal where left and were slow to sell. A trade for other animal were made in the hopes for a faster sell. Jordan said that they both agreed on the first thread and this one. Tibor never disagreed about the trade till this thread (unless I missed it in the first one). Again He said/He said. Tibor said he didn't agree to trade and Jordan said Tibor agreed to said trade in all trade or only knew some. Again I have read both thread but haven't seen proof of said Tibor agreed or not.

4. Tibor wanted money and not the animal back his or traded animals and Jordan agreed to give him cash payment or giving back the animals from the first thread but Tibor refused. Jordan has said this in earlier post from 1st thread

5. From the 1st thread Tibor started to tell "story and lies about Jordan" per Jordan. If Tibor can prove any of this statements he made it would be great.

6. Because of "story and lies" that Jordan said Tibor said made Jordan change his mind about eatting the deal and just paying his "friend" Tibor cash value of the consigned animal/traded animal and decided to just give Tibor back his animal or agreed upon traded animal/cages.

I'll say again again and like the 2nd poster from the 1st thread said provide proof or its just he said / he said.

 

[DaveyFig]

I can't speak for Jordan or Tibor...

Good. None of us should try to do that.

...however I've had exp. with people who slack off where I have tried to pay them back money or give them back item they left at my place, they refuse to meet at their requested time/place... Yes, their time and their place. Hence I take video/picture of the said event to prove I was there and such. So I can somewhat understand this mess.

Interesting that you should make this point and then go into your next paragraph. In that other thread Jordan says that Tibor did try to plan a trip to go get the cages, but that Jordan was busy. Tibor could have been waiting for a call for Jordan to call him with a better time. After the threats, Jordan said he did not want Tibor at his house. Jordan was in a position where he had to deliver at that point. It was no longer on Tibor to pick them up, if it ever was.

By the way...and this is not a dig on Jordan, just an FYI for future dealings like this where cages are involved. Uhaul rents pick-ups. I rent one every 6 weeks to go get hay for my goats. Its $29 a day.

I don't really see the repost quotes of stuff months ago before bad blood happen and question Jordan about it now. As far as my take on this part. Jordan try to make good on the deal with his friend Tibor with those post back then.

I assume you are talking directly to me on this one, since I am the one pulling the quotes from the other thread.

That thread was not before"bad blood happen". Jordan said that he heard from a friend that Tibor had threatened him and that friend. That friend was not named. Jordan may be the most credible person on the planet, but Jordan did not hear the threats first hand. He posted that anonymous third party information.

My guess after those post Tibor made demand and threads to Jordan and Jordan's friend. Jordan change his mind because of these threats and untruths. I would honestly do the same If someone made threats to myself and my friends. I would just give back what was theirs and be done with it.

Those threats were an issue in the first thread, but Jordan still agreed to pay cash just 2 weeks ago. He was praised for saying he would pay in the first thread, and then there was no contact until June, and that came from Tibor's side.

Again, none of us can speak for Tibor or Jordan. If someone has questions for either, then they can choose to answer, or not. Their answers, or lack of answers, will remain here for all to read.

 

[David Scarboro]

Dave, That sums it up correctly. I think that no one can disagree that Jordan has backtracked on his word. It is his own statements that have put him in this position. A number of good people have come here on Jordan's behalf, but he is suspiciously absent. Jordan, hiding your head in the sand is not helping you here.

 

[DaveyFig]

Here is the timeline as far as I understand it.

What is missing from your timeline is time. Time is important here, as there were lapses in communication. That is not to say that anyone was avoiding anyone, just that there were long periods without contact.

1. Tibor called/email Jordon for consigned animal Or Jordan called/emailed Tibor for consigned animal. (He said/ He said here) there has been no proof ie screenshot of email or phone bill to show who called who first.

You are right. There is no way to know. Tibor admits to calling Jordan when animals were ready, but that Jordan initiated by asking if he had any available previously. If it matters who made the contact, in a he said she said scenario such as this, we might want to look at previous dealings between the 2 parties, and how they came to be. Tibor says that Jordan called him for animals in previous deals. Jordan did not contest that. I don't think it matters who initiated the sale/consignment.

2. Same animal sold and Tibor was paid for said animal. Both have claim this.

Yes, some sold and were paid for. Again, in previous sales animals were paid for as well, in cash. Jordan said he normally didn't do retail consignments, but made an exception this time. Were those previous deals cash sales? If the others were straight cash sales to be paid for later, why was this one a consignment? What is different if no money was paid up front?

3. Some animal where left and were slow to sell. A trade for other animal were made in the hopes for a faster sell. Jordan said that they both agreed on the first thread and this one. Tibor never disagreed about the trade till this thread (unless I missed it in the first one). Again He said/He said. Tibor said he didn't agree to trade and Jordan said Tibor agreed to said trade in all trade or only knew some. Again I have read both thread but haven't seen proof of said Tibor agreed or not.

That is why I asked when the rosy boas were traded for. Tibor said he had no contact with Jordan between Feb and June. In the last thread there was mention of trades for geckos, and nothing about rosy boas. Did he OK that trade?

4. Tibor wanted money and not the animal back his or traded animals and Jordan agreed to give him cash payment or giving back the animals from the first thread but Tibor refused. Jordan has said this in earlier post from 1st thread

I know you are against pulling quotes from the old thread, but can you point me to where Tibor refused a cash payment?

5. From the 1st thread Tibor started to tell "story and lies about Jordan" per Jordan. If Tibor can prove any of this statements he made it would be great.

...and if Jordan can prove that any of them are lies, that would be great. That part is more of the he said she said stuff that can't really be weighed. All we have to go on are the parts where both sides agree.

6. Because of "story and lies" that Jordan said Tibor said made Jordan change his mind about eatting the deal and just paying his "friend" Tibor cash value of the consigned animal/traded animal and decided to just give Tibor back his animal or agreed upon traded animal/cages.

In what world does someone bad mouthing someone else relieve the other person of their duty to pay a debt? Would Tibor have his money now instead of rosy boas if he had never started that first thread?

I don't know why he did, but Jordan accepted the responsibility for the debt in that thread, and this thread. He then went back on that, in both threads.

Jordan said that inspite of the lies and stories, he would pay just to have Tibor out of his hair, not that he wouldn't honor his word because of them.

I'll say again again and like the 2nd poster from the 1st thread said provide proof or its just he said / he said.

That second poster was followed by Jordan himself. The need for proof went out the window with this...

No need for proof. I most certainly owe Tibor $2,700.00 for a group of consigned animals.

It is not his fault this has lapsed longer than it should, and that is my fault.