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Info Keven Vogenberger, Keven2, questionable stock

If you cannot properly care for the numbers of animals you have without selling some, you are no longer a 'rescue' but a hoarder or flipper. That tech also had no business telling you an animal was healthy, especially when they have no real knowledge of chams.
 
You have done this to so many people.its insane you called my animals stock they are not stock! Anything I say you find fault so I'm not responding anymore I apologized took the add down you just have nothing better to do then to Terrorize some one. I've sold tons of reptiles on here about a hundred with no complaints. I'm done with this do what ever you want.
 
Keven
You lied about what kind of cham it was
You lied about its health
You lied about taking it to a vet

And after being perfectly willing to sell this sick, miserable creature to some newbie telling them it was 'as healthy as can be' you ended many of your posts here with 'have a blessed day' trying to wrap yourself in religion I guess to make yourself seem better than you are.

You are not upset about this poor miserable critter which you didn't take to a vet
You are upset because you got caught, and that your efforts to minimize your false advertising didn't work.

You say you ended up selling this cham for $15, unfortunately since you have lied about everything else and have not put up any proof it is difficult to take anything you say as true.
 
If I was trying to pull the wool over someone's eyes do you think I would post a pic of what I thought was a helmeted chameleon a very ugly one at that! I did not know!! If I was trying to be deceitful I would have put a great looking pic up and sent someone the veil in question. I thought it was a helmeted chameleon. And I sure as hell had no idea it has mbd or whatever it is you say it has. I thought it was a helmeted chameleon and that's how they look. I never even sold the darn thing off the add I took the add down immediately! I sold it to a guy that lives around here for 15.00 dollars once I was informed of all the crap I was told that it had. He in turn took it to his vet which said yes it has had problems but seems still healthy and alert! Your making up stuff that's not true! I am guilty of getting pissed when some one tried to tell me it was a veil because I truly thought it was a helmeted chameleon! Search my adds I've posted around 85 or 90 adds of reptiles for sale.only a few being chameleons which I know truly nothing about. Out of all those adds and all those sales not one person has said anything bad about anything I've done! What your doing is not right you are purposely trying to hurt me because of what you think! I am guilty of not knowing my chameleons! Im just learning about them! which will never happen again believe me! I DID NOT KNOW IT WAS A VEIL If I did I would have listed. The add VEIL FOR SALE instead I listed the add I don't know what kind of chameleon this is but it's not a veil. Yes did my ego get into the way when people started yelling at me how bad off the animal was and making me feel stupid for not knowing it wasnt supposed to look like that yes I looked like an idiot and it hurt my feelings so I lashed out and that was wrong but hey that's a character defect I need to work on and i opologize for that! I know 100 percent I did not try to take advantage of anybody .I just didn't know all the stuff you all were belittling me about! Maybe some constructive criticisms instead of making me feel like idiot for not knowing it was a veil. I thought t was just old but healthy. As soon as you all were telling me how sick and bad the animal was I took it down. Jesus it was listed for 60 bucks what do you think I was gonna retire on that. You see my actions as Decietful because I made you mad with my attitude so this has gone from some guy that didn't know what the he'll he was selling to some huge conspiracy that I was going to slip what I thought was a helmeted chameleon by some poor soul! if i knew it had problems don't you think I would have taken such big huge pictures that showed the whole animal! I thought it was a helmeted chameleon That's why I didn't know it looked messed up. I thought they all look like this. Other people on this thread thought it was a helmeted chameleon.what you think is common knowledge might just not be to someone else!
 
Keven2 said:
And I sure as hell had no idea it has mbd or whatever it is you say it has.
Click to expand...
One person after another told you that this was a veil and it appeared to have mbd. Here is how you responded:
You have no idea what you are talking about! It is not a veil look how small his crest is and he definitely dies not have mbd. You obviously don't know what mbd looks like im chameleons. If you don't like the way he looks don't buy him. I have had him for 6 months he came to me looking like this. He may not be the prettiest Cham in the world but he isn't sick!
Keven2 said:
He in turn took it to his vet which said yes it has had problems but seems still healthy and alert!
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You offer no proof that you sold this animal or that it was subsequently taken to a vet who pronounced it healthy, and the pictures you posted in my opinion did not show a healthy, alert animal, so if I have a choice between believing my own eyes and believing your unsupported claims, I believe from the pictures that this critter appeared ill. And after all, you lied to us about taking this critter to a vet yourself:
Keven2 said:
Omg I took it too a vet .
Click to expand...
Keven2 said:
First off im not throwing the vet tech under the bus I called and talked to the vet tech.
Click to expand...
The reason this thread is here is for readers to make up their own minds.
Keven2 said:
You see my actions as Decietful
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Yes, I do. But I have always thought that the readers here should read what is posted and make up their own minds. I think there is enough information for them to do so in this thread.
 
It's also worth mentioning that Keven started two other BOI threads (since deleted because they were in the wrong section, should've been in the Help forums) that were trying to distract from his own mistakes by undermining Lucille and others' credibility by claiming they were not using their full names on posts (which is a lie). Pretty underhanded. I would avoid this seller at all costs.
 
Keven2 said:
He has had a fecal and look at by my vet and the vet said he is healthy as can be.
Click to expand...
Keven2 said:
First off im not throwing the vet tech under the bus I called and talked to the vet tech ***I've never sold a veil before not that that is an excuse but the vet tech did give him a clean bill of health.
Click to expand...

After seeing a lot of newly posted classified ads by Keven, I felt compelled to write about the vet/vet tech situation, because I have a lot of respect for vet techs and I don't believe it went down like Keven said, and that is relevant to any claims of healthy critters he might make in his ads. The reason I had made an issue of the vet claim by Keven was because it was an outright lie, by his words above, he did not take the critter to a vet as he had first claimed.

But I wanted to point out that from what he says here, Keven did not even take the critter to a vet tech either, he claims he just made a call. I have my doubts that he even did that, I am thinking that any self respecting vet tech may hesitate about making a phone assessment and pronouncing an animal he/she has never seen as being a particular kind of cham or as being 'healthy as can be'.
 
Lucille said:
But I wanted to point out that from what he says here, Keven did not even take the critter to a vet tech either, he claims he just made a call. I have my doubts that he even did that, I am thinking that any self respecting vet tech may hesitate about making a phone assessment and pronouncing an animal he/she has never seen as being a particular kind of cham or as being 'healthy as can be'.
Click to expand...

You would be correct, because that is *illegal* for a vet tech to do. It's even illegal for a vet to do, regarding the 'healthy as can be' part.

A registered vet tech would lose their license. Any vet tech would be fired from their job. Because *illegal*.
 
Hi. I just wanted to say that Keven Vogenberger is the most honest person i know. He cares deeply about his animals and helps any in need. He is always here if you have a question or need anything. I have referred alot of people to him for Reptiles and they are so happy they went to him. I cant say enough AWESOME things about Keven Vogenberger. Thank you and have a bless day.
 
trickslovedogs said:
I have referred alot of people to him for Reptiles and they are so happy they went to him.
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Can you please post their names, or ask them to post here, so that they do not remain anonymous? That way, we can see more about how their transactions went.
Of course, as it is always said here, it is how sellers handle their challenges that define them as good or bad sellers. Keven has not seemed to have handled the challenges presented by this thread very well at all. Strange how he has kept the other parties involved in the transaction outlined here anonymous as well...
 
Everyone relax

Hello all, I’m very new to keeping Reptiles. Very new to buying from anybody online. I currently have a adopted ball python that I got from a fellow service member that was deploying overseas. I wanted a new reptile and wanted to stay away from petco etc. so naturally i visited this site and found the species I wanted to get into (uromastyx). I saw Keven’s posts and animals and decided to contact him. If Keven is some kinda crook that is just looking to screw over people, he could of easily did it to me. Especially as a first time buyer online. He was really great and informative to me about the process and transaction was smooth as can be. He even held my animal for me at no additional cost till weather in my area was warm enough to ship. This guy is awesome. He loves his animals. And loves spreading the love of reptiles with both new people and experienced people of all kinds. You guys asked for someone who’s bought from him, well here I am. And I plan on going to him again for my next species. My uro came to me healthy and active. Crazy colors for such a young Moroccan uromastyx. He’s available whenever I have questions. Everyone has their day when they make mistakes. You guys aren’t perfect. You guys make mistakes. But you don’t see a thread being made bashing you for whatever mistake you made. Thank you Keven for everything. I truly and glad you guys took care of my with my first purchase.
 

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BlueCrowned said:
Gee you sure do sound almost exactly like Keven...
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A quick google search would suggest that Candie Faye Trick is, in fact, a real person. She also has been on Fauna for several years.
I once worked with a guy named Trick, also from Ohio. They're probably related.
 
For all you posting now in support of Keven, please try to explain the following:

Keven said they took the lizard to a vet, who said it was healthy when it clearly is not.
Then he said a vet tech looked at it.
Then he said he called a vet tech, who didn't know much about chams but said it was healthy (this was ILLEGAL for the vet tech to do, if it happened)

How can you call Keven 'honest', if he lied about taking it to a vet?
 
Herpin Man said:
A quick google search would suggest that Candie Faye Trick is, in fact, a real person. She also has been on Fauna for several years.
I once worked with a guy named Trick, also from Ohio. They're probably related.
Click to expand...

She may have been here for years but she has only four posts and there is nothing to say Keven can't use someone else's name on a second account.
 
So mind you I’m new to this whole reptile thing still. If a reptile develops mbd, is it doomed with no hope of recovery? I’ve seen tons of mbd posts on the groups I follow on Facebook and I’ve never once seen a owner put down their animal that developed mbd with a previous owner. They put the animal in it’s correct environment and it thrived. Even if it had mbd in the past. I would really be more understanding of all you guys bashing Keven if more than just ONE of these instances happened. But one mistake out of hundreds of animals he’s sold on here. You literally see his name in just about every category in the classifieds. Cmon now. It’s really not worth adding fuel to the fire. I’ve never seen a bad review from any one who’s received a animal from
Him.
 
The whole vet thing was of course nonsense. Same for the vet tech backpedal. Plain to see.

Anyone caring so much about the animals is not going to imply a threat that animals will be killed off due to the fallout of exposing that situation. A low move IMO.

Finally, the majority if not the totality of someone's offerings posted on multiple sites have a theme in common with a wholesaler in Hollywood, FL. Anyone aware of the list knows where I am coming from on that. I have no problem with that sourcing, but maybe we can stop playing pretend about the rescue stuff and any pseudo-benevolent motivations. There is buying and reselling afoot. Possibly reselling with work put in. Possibly a straight flipping process. Like many other sellers falling into either category. Checkerboard worm lizards, as a glaring recent example, are not rescue stock. Resale stock from wholesale (and primarily import) stock purchase. Call a spade a spade. It is a money-making endeavor. Not altruism. I have no bone to pick with that aspect aside from properly recognizing its label. The embellishment feels gross.
 
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