UPS and Shpping Snakes (a chance at legitimacy)

I have been going back and fourth with UPS for nearly a month trying to find suitable means for me to ship live animals via them. In the process of negotiations, I have found we may have an allie on our side inside the corperation. I recieved an email, that had communications back and fourth from my sales rep to a corperate guy named BRAD COOK (nrb1bxc). The letters in the ( ) I believe are a corperate id tag. Im not sure what his email is, but Im sure with some digging we can find it.

The reason I started this thread is this. I have this corperate guy Brad Cook on email stating to my sales rep that he has spoken many times with people up the ladder about shipping non venoumous snakes. From the comments made in his email to my rep, it sounds like he thinks its a sound business decision. He is also well aware people allready ship snakes "under the table" with ups.

I feel if enough of us directly email Mr Cook, explaining the amount of business that UPS could generate would they openly accept HARMLESS, NON VENOUMOUS, SNAKES.

We may even need to come up with a guidline for what would be acceptable to ship UPS. Maybe we need to start with asking them to openly ship harmless non venoumous snakes that are under 4'. I have a feeling the thought of a 20' Burm in a UPS truck has them nervous.

Anyone who wants to help me track this Mr Cook down, and would like to communicate with them on this option please contact me. I will email my sales rep later today, asking for Mr Cooks email addresss from her.

I can also forward the email with the comments made by Mr Cook to anyone who is interested.

Lets all work together to see if we cant show this corprate giant what kind of money they could make if they were to OPENLY accept live snake shipments. Anyone contacting Mr Cook should explain the amount of shipping, stress that its their premium services, and the realities of the snake market (i.e. we would like to openly ship BABY snakes). Again we should start with smaller snakes as it will likely be our best route.

Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles
402-934-9906

definately count me in 0on helping

I just spoke with my UPS rep in person when I was dropping off a package, and she says she will email me Mr Cooks info asap. She also said she thinks a letter writting campaign wouldnt be a bad idea at all. From the sounds of it, if we give the company enough reasons, and maybe enough assurance, we could make this happen.

However lets be realistic here also. How many people are actually going to play by the rules soo to speak. Thats the biggest problem with this industry. Say we are able to get UPS to allow us to ship snakes openly, with the only stipulation being they MUST BE BABY SNAKES. (I.E. under 4 ft and non venoumous, yada yada yada). How long do you think it would be before somebody decides, well that rule doesnt apply to me, and decides to ship a 12' retic. Thats the kind of thing that would bring everything crashing down.

I plan to try and put together as good a presentation as possible, and try and "pitch" the ups guy on allowing snake shipments. I figure if I get some pictures (i.e. photos of baby corn snakes next to a quarter, or baby boas next to a dollar bill, ect) and then add in some names and numbers showing what kind of money they could make, you never know they could just say why not.

I remeber a few years back when animal shipments were not allowed by UPS PERIOD. I cant rember who it was, but I think it was someone in OK that started the ball rolling, and got UPS to allow a few people to ship. Maybe we can do the same thing with snakes, to benifit all of us.

So again, anyone willing to step up and help out with this would be appreciated. I would love to get a few big time people on board, to help show them the money they can make. However again I will be realistic. Not many of us want to rock the boat with them, and risk them opening boxes that suprise suprise will likely allready contain snakes. Me personally I have nothing to loose by persuing this with them.

Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles

Sounds like a great idea to me. Forward me the addy when you get it and I will write a letter to Mr. Cook explaining that while I would not be a massive customer, if they opened up and allowed shipments of harmless non-venomous snakes, I would be a new customer they would not get otherwise . There would probably be a LOT of new customers if they opened up to harmless non-venomous snakes.

Like you were saying, there will be people that will assume the rules do not apply to them. Maybe point out to them that these people already exist and ARE shipping all kinds of things that are "Not allowed" anyway...........it's human nature....there will ALWAYS be someone breaking the rules. However~ opening up and allowing harmless non-venomous snakes above board would just increase the profit margin from those who do believe the rules apply!

Here is a pic of a baby snake I took yesterday to try and sell this clutch. I took a pic of her with some change to show her size.....you can use it to demonstrate size of "Baby" cornsnakes. This one is a "Juevenile" at 4 months old.

Thanks for the pic Cheryl, thats exactly the kind of thing I need (and since Im not a colubrid keeper, I dont have any to get the pics like that of).

I will forward the info once I know the address.

Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles

me in too Mickey! If I can help, just HOLLER!!!

Please count me in as well. I would be willing to send an email(s) or call.

Firstly, let me say that I am more than willing to help in any way. I have been working on the same issue at the local level with a certain degree of success, but I would love to take this on to a national level campaign!

I would make one suggestion though. Let's just say that we won't ship animals above a set length (4 ft, if that's what works), instead of using the term "baby." There is no damage that could ever be done to someone by a 4 ft. breeding cornsnake, but it is not a baby. Let's be completely above board on this, and I think we'll get farther.

I agree a 4ft cornsnake would be fine. I think you are right a good 4 ft limit would likely do the trick.

One would hope with a bit of time and no incidents, that they may even be persuaded to ship "realistic" sized snake shipments.

I did have a person mention maybe going with a box size limit rather then a snake size limit (i.e. no snakes can be shipped that would not fit in a 12" x 15" x 12" box *just and example*). However the only problem I could see with this, is that a person who may be selling wholesale orders, surch as entire litters, or mixed lots, ect, may not be able to fit an entire shipment.

Im still waiting on a return email from my rep, and with the holiday season upon us, I dont expect anything to come about in the near future on this. So I will update everyone as I learn more.

Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles

I think that to would spur some people into PACKING a larger snake into a smaller box if it were only size limitations of a box to ship by.Actually i think a bteer way to approach them and i know some will complain would be to counter ship before you blast me this would assure two a few things FOR US!!![list=1][*]That an agreed upon size limitation would be upheld[*]No one could ruin it for everyone if they shipped a larger then allowed snake and it was opened to find a 10'+ snake [*]Let the UPS people know that we are not trying to put one over on them[/list=1]

It would be nice if drivers could "field verify" the shipping but somehow i dont see UPS letting there employees makethat call as im sure theres many that are terrified of snakes and wouldnt even think of looking at one to see if it was " the right size " to put on there truck lol