Fl.International Reptile Show?

Originally Posted by DAND

Jim,

This thread is obvioiusly about Tony, not cowboyman13 so let's try to keep it on subject.

Just making a comparison, not changing the subject.

All this is really a shame. I remember years ago when I attended my first reptile show. It was in Raleigh NC & it was totally awesome. My husband & I held hands the whole time we were there, to keep from getting separated in the crowd. We were so envious of some of the vendors. We spent the day talking to breeders and had a great time. We signed up to vend the next show. Back then, Tony's shows were great. He had the building packed with vendors & attendees. He was so successful that he must have forgotten that the vendors are what make the show. For the past few years, I've watched his shows get smaller & smaller, even though he kept advertising them as huge. I think that if you want to compete for vendors, you should make sure your show is better than the rest. This keeps people coming back. Deliberately lying & sabotaging the other shows only makes vendors stay away.

Audry,
You bring up a really good point - the shows should be a venue for the breeders and dealers to sell their goods and a place for the attendees to have access to a large number of vendors at one location.

In my opinion, some of the shows have lost sight of this and have tried to produce an event instead. These productions are typically not good for the vendors who are the driving force behind the show.

Unfortunately, while the "Event" approach does put money in the promoters pocket through gate receipts, it does very little for the vendors. A large portion of the attendees end up being the "lets take the family to the zoo" crowd. The vendors end up entertaining the family for the day with little chance of actually selling anything.

I think that any promoter that wants long term success in this business, needs to really examine what they are trying to accomplish and change their recipe accordingly. There is a reason why Wayne Hill and The National Reptile Breeders Expo is at the top of the heap. The show is set up and advertised as a serious show. You will not find flyers for the Breeders Expo on your windshield at K-Mart.

We received a black & white flyer in the mail yesterday announcing an upcoming show. My husband pointed out to me that the flyer never changes. Same stuff, just different dates & location. He said that it was more like a traveling circus than a reptile show. People need a variety. It's like going to the flea market & seeing the same vendors every time. After a while, you get tired of wasting your time, money, & gas. Now there's nothing wrong with seeing the same vendors, but the kiddy sideshows are always the same. People bring their children in thinking that our snakes & lizards are part of the petting zoo. And clowns? Huh. It would be more fitting for him to dress up in a lizard costume. Reptile show or circus?

"Unfortunately, while the "Event" approach does put money in the promoters pocket through gate receipts, it does very little for the vendors. A large portion of the attendees end up being the "lets take the family to the zoo" crowd. The vendors end up entertaining the family for the day with little chance of actually selling anything."

Yes, yes!! I have noticed in those types of events that I spend more time telling people that the corns are not venomous, and yes, they really can breathe in those deli cups, compared to explaining what type of morph they are and which one they should buy! It really does get tiresome. I could re-answer those questions all day long if properly compensated. But revenues have gone down for each show, while expenses have gone up. We have to look at each show with an eye to what the bottom line is likely to be.

The "event" type of show is great family entertainment, and may even educate a few members of the public to where they will consider entering the hobby. But I can't afford to help out for free (or almost free) - there has to be enough financial compensation to make it worthwhile to participate. Or, it has to be so much FUN that I would do it for free, lol!

I know what you mean. There is a lot of hard work involved with breeding. Whether it be snakes, lizards, or something else. It's horrible when you have to sell half your offspring just to make your vendor expenses back. And that's not even compensating ourselves for all the labor & expenses we've put in to our animals.

Personally, I prefer to vend at and attend the hard core herp shows, minus petting zoos, animal farms, parrot shows and such. But that's ME. Now, with my little girl, I'd end upgoing to one of those myself, and wait to go to the "Event" show with my wife and daughter.

There is not only room for both types, I think the hobby benifits form both types. The vendors, of course, sell more, faster, and smoother, at the no-frills shows. They should be the most common ones. They draw mostly hobbyists, who will buy, and are already educated, at least to a degree. They also draw in interested people, who are looking for somethign.

The event shows draw in everyone, including the big spenders and serious hobbyists, but also the curious and the young. I've seen lots of people become introduced to the hobby at Tony and Alex's shows over the past decade. The market in Raleigh has grown considerably, with a lot of thanks to the shows for bringing in new people.

I've been at both types of shows over the years. As a vendor at the event shows, you do a LOT of repeatign the same stupid things, over and OVER and OVER again. I can see how it gets annoying, but don't take it personally - how did YOU learn? They have to ask questions and read up. By talkign to you, they're taking a good step.

I admit, I have a very strong interest in education. I especially enjoy speaking to people who are curious and genuienly interested, no matter how ignorant they are. You get to inform them, that's one of the most enjoyable aspects of the hobby. I'll be setting up a table in Raleigh with only a couple cages to sell - and I dont' even care if I do sell them, I'll be there with my chameleons (some of the most complicated, and difficult to talk about aniamls) just to talk to people about them.

big event shows definatly have their place. You would be mistaken to use big, overblown, "Event" circus shows as a way of criticizing Tony. Instead, it's the execution and the FOCUS of these shows that's been a problem for him. Tony, for a number of reasons (not good ones), convinced himself that the way to draw bigger numbers was to incease the fluff:

They will pay to be at a reptile show on the site of a casino (yeah, I know, I know...), they will rather see snakebabe than Roark, an informational speaker/performer, they will come because of door prizes, they will come because of contests, boat trips and bird shows and costume parties...

Somehow, Tony was able to convince himself that all that was going to bring in more people than having more vendors. If Tony had just not pissed them off, and actually tried to court NEW vendors, he might be in this situation.

That's why tony's circus shows went downhill - because it became a freaking circus with reptiles for sale, rather than a reptile show with circus-stuff for the kids OF reptile keepers.

This may or may not belong here, but since it is about comments made on this topic I felt it belongs here.

Ok, I have been receiving private emails to “stop harassing” people.
I thought this was an open forum where you can freely speak your mind? (Within reason, and I don’t think I have been unreasonable in any post I have made)

When someone gets involved in an on going thread and then decides they don’t want to be involved in it any longer, but in the process makes a few last comments. He/she should be ready to receive a rebuttal or what have you.

I don’t know about anyone else, but when I hear people say they “just don’t care” it bugs me …people should care about this industry if they want to continue to enjoy it freely. Both vendors and non-vendors need to care more about it before there’s nothing left of it.

So excuse the hell out of me if I decide to make a comparison of two people who “just don’t care” It wasn’t an attack, just me speaking my mind.
I’m not going to apologize for any comments I make unless I have the facts wrong. I read and re-read my comments before I post them.

If me comparing two people who “don’t care” is harassment, tell me why there are several threads still ongoing about Tony? Post after post exposing a promoter’s disgraceful ethics in this industry (who obviously doesn’t care about it – just his pocket). And here we have another who doesn’t care, but when I compared the two it was “harassment”! ! !


cowboyman13 if you are going to make comments such as you “just don’t care” then you should be willing to handle any response to it , whether it be good or bad. I know that I leave myself open to whatever may come my way after I make any posts on any forum. If I don’t want to deal with it I don’t get involved at all.

If these forums are going to be biased, and people are going to make comments and then be offended when they read something they don’t like, then I will no participate in this site in any way at all.

That was very well written. I also leave myself open because I post my opinions. I also get harrassed, but after today many will find out some disturbing facts about the promoter we had been discussing. And people who don't care about unethical practices in our business, should stay out of our industry. I do care. And it's not the money, but the love for the reptiles.

Jim & Audry

You guys have done nothing wrong,And from where I am sitting You guys are whats good about this biz.Keep up the good fight!And don't fret the cowboy,He's just not informed.We all open are yaps before accually knowing what its is we are talking about sometimes?