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View Poll Results: Are you going to take the COVID vaccine?
Yes 16 53.33%
No 7 23.33%
Depends on what happens to early beta testers 4 13.33%
I don't know 3 10.00%
Voters: 30. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-15-2021, 12:44 AM   #21
WebSlave
Interesting....

Quote:
240 Israelis found with COVID after vaccination, underscoring need for vigilance

Pfizer's shot only begins having an effect 8-10 days after first injection, and only reaches full potential after the second dose

By TOI staff 1 January 2021, 4:20 am

Among the nearly one million Israelis vaccinated against coronavirus so far, some 240 Israelis have been diagnosed with the virus days after getting the shot, Channel 13 News reported Thursday.

The figure underscores the need for individuals to continue to protect themselves for weeks after being inoculated, as the body takes time to develop effective antibodies against the SARS-CoV-2 virus, which causes COVID-19.

The Pfizer vaccine is not made with the coronavirus itself, meaning that there is no chance anyone could catch it from the shots. Instead, the vaccine contains a piece of genetic code that trains the immune system to recognize the spiked protein on the surface of the virus and create antibodies to attack if it encounters the real thing.

But this process takes time, and studies of the vaccine so far have shown immunity to the virus rises only some 8-10 days after the first injection — and then only to around 50 percent effectiveness.

This is why the second dose of the vaccine, given 21 days after the first, is critical: It strengthens the immune system’s response to the virus, bringing it to 95% effectiveness and ensuring that immunity lasts. This level of immunity is only reached about a week after the second dose — or 28 days after the first.

Anyone who is infected a few days before getting the vaccine’s first dose or in the weeks before full effectiveness is reached is still in danger of developing symptoms. (Even when the vaccine reaches its top potential, there remains a 5% chance of this.)

Another matter to note is that studies have not yet determined whether the vaccine allows a person to carry the disease and spread it, without getting sick: It is possible that while one’s body would be largely protected from the virus after vaccination, mucous layers in the nasal passages, beyond the reach of antibodies, could still harbor multiplying virus particles.

While these would not harm the carrier — as any virus that enters deeper into the body would swiftly be destroyed by the trained immune system — they could still be expelled through the nose and mouth and infect others.

The vast majority of Israelis who have received the vaccine have reported no issues since getting the shot. Around one in a thousand people have reported suffering mild side effects, with only a few dozen seeking medical attention following the shot, figures published Wednesday showed.

The most common side effects reported were weakness, dizziness and fever, with 319 combined cases, the ministry said. Five also reported suffering diarrhea. Another 293 people reported localized symptoms where the injection was administered such as pain, restriction of movement, swelling and redness.

Fourteen people said they had allergic reactions such as itching and swelling of the tongue and throat.

Additionally, 26 people suffered what the ministry described as “neurological symptoms,” with 19 complaining of a tingly sensation in their arm.

The ministry noted that only 51 people (0.008%) of those who reported suffering any side effects said they sought medical attention for their symptoms.

According to the Kan public broadcaster, there have been four cases where people in Israel have died shortly after receiving the vaccination, but three of the four were deemed by the Health Ministry, as well as by both family members and doctors, to have been unrelated to the shots. The fourth case, an 88-year-old man who had serious preexisting health problems, is currently being investigated.
Source: https://www.timesofisrael.com/240-is...-r9eFAdahAVfHE
 
Old 01-15-2021, 01:07 AM   #22
WebSlave
Oh yeah, a thought just crossed my mind. If you play the stock market, buy stock in the companies that manufacture syringes.
 
Old 01-15-2021, 02:01 AM   #23
WebSlave
Well worth watching. Addresses concerns with delaying the second dose of the vaccine as well as the considered plan of partial doses instead of full doses to get more mileage out of the available stocks of vaccine.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7xsOsrDmPQ
 
Old 01-15-2021, 11:50 PM   #24
sschind
Quote:
Originally Posted by WebSlave View Post
This doesn't really surprise me. After all, if 1 dose was effective why would you need a second dose. I'd be interested to see how many, if any, of these infected could trace where they were infected. I'm guessing if they were diagnosed within days, which to me means less than a week, they either already had the virus when they got the vaccination or completely disregarded all preventative measures once they got it.
 
Old 01-16-2021, 12:50 AM   #25
WebSlave
Quote:
Originally Posted by sschind View Post
This doesn't really surprise me. After all, if 1 dose was effective why would you need a second dose. I'd be interested to see how many, if any, of these infected could trace where they were infected. I'm guessing if they were diagnosed within days, which to me means less than a week, they either already had the virus when they got the vaccination or completely disregarded all preventative measures once they got it.
I think that it is really more airborne than people are letting on, and that is how people have been caught unaware by becoming infected. How long will the virus remain suspended in the air, and how far can it travel before becoming inert? When they say that the new British and the South African mutations are dramatically more infections than previous strains, I am taking that to mean that it is that much more likely that low exposures will cause more rapid and more extensive symptomatic infections. The more virus you have that can quickly attach to receptors in cells, the more likely it is that your immune system will get caught with it's pants down before it can start mounting a defense. And I am taking that to mean that there will be less asymptomatic infections and more serious consequences to all infected. This may be what happened with the 1918 pandemic when the second wave struck. IMHO, any way. I'm not a doctor nor researcher in such things, and haven't stayed at a Holiday Inn Express in a very long time. But I am usually pretty good at putting two and two together most times.

But yeah, in my mind this vaccination stuff could actually make people who were vaccinated more dangerous to the unvaccinated because the vaccinated might become rather cavalier about continuing to use the previous methods of avoiding infection prior to getting the vaccine. They could be thinking they are now immune, so damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead! So they might have contracted the virus and unknowingly be infectious to others. Just not showing symptoms because the vaccine is helping to prevent the symptoms from developing, but NOT them being an infectious carrier of the virus.

Not to sound anti-social or anything, but personally I think I would try hard to avoid contact with people vaccinated as best I could. But honestly, that wouldn't be any more or less than Connie and I are already doing. I'm beginning to get comfortable with my "hermit in the woods" semi-isolation, I guess. Sure wish we could go to a gunshow and spend that $1200 government "COVID relief" check we just got.

BTW, in one of the sources I have been reading, someone with what appears to have some real in-depth knowledge about this stuff commented that his fear was that quite a few unqualified people might be utilized to administer the vaccine shots, simply because of the numbers being so great that qualified people would be extremely overwhelmed trying to keep up with the workload. OK, so you have 100,000,000 doses to be administered, and the clock is ticking. Who all is going to do the needle jabbing? Good 'ole Billy Bob at the Oil Changes, Cell Phone Repairs, & Vaccine Shots while you wait?

Anyway, he said that administering the vaccine into a vein instead of muscle tissue could be quite dangerous. Anyone have any ideas on why that might be? Hmm, yeah, I guess I could ask him about that next time I log onto that particular site....
 
Old 01-16-2021, 09:52 AM   #26
sschind
Maybe they should give out little "I've just been vaccinated" stickers like the "I voted" stickers so we could identify them

Its too bad we can't self administer the vaccines. That way they could send it out with our relief checks.

Speaking of which, Connie doesn't mind you spending her $600.00 at a gun show?

I'm pretty sure I'm far down on the vaccination list, even though I was an essential employee at a lottery ticket dispensery, so by the time it comes to my turn there should be at least some real world data and personal accounts. Not that any of it will be accurate or relevant but at least some feedback.
 
Old 01-16-2021, 10:13 AM   #27
nickolasanastasiou
The likelihood of putting it in a vein is low based on intramuscular site choices. Only certain people who are trained (and licensed) to give injections would be providing the administration. Unlicensed administration is not legal. The bigger administration concern to me would be people failing to penetrate the muscle. Many members of the population are...fluffy. Then there are some older folks who are skin-on-skeleton thin from sarcopenia. It will depend on the needle length selected, the person receiving the dose, and the technique of the person administering the dose. I have performed a lot of injections. It is not that (or even remotely) difficult, but some people will administer better than others and some recipients will have better tissue quality and composition at sites than others. It is simply so, so it is not a variable I can use for any predictive purpose. An IM shot is ideal, but a poorly delivered shot might not be completely useless. It will depend somewhat on metabolic activity of the cells, and the types of cells, which are receiving the mRNA. IM (intramuscular) administration is the goal, still.

Besides training the immune system and improving its library, which I am a fan of in general, the point is to shift probabilities in our favor (which it does). It is not a guarantee just as no other medication comes with a guarantee. A guarantee would require magic and it would appear our species is lacking in talent for magic (or at least I am).
 
Old 01-16-2021, 02:08 PM   #28
WebSlave
Quote:
Originally Posted by sschind View Post
Speaking of which, Connie doesn't mind you spending her $600.00 at a gun show?
You obviously don't know Connie.

She likes guns too. She will actually mark pages in the NRA magazines we get to note guns that caught her eye. And I can't count the number of times we were at a gun show and I was trying to decide between two guns and Connie would just say "Buy both of them! What's the problem with that?"

Actually we don't have a "his" and "hers" money arrangement. It's "our" money. And neither one of us will deny the other something they want.

Truth be known, I almost have to wrestle Connie to the floor to get her to take money to buy something. She is a one in a million (maybe even totally unique), no doubt.
 
Old 01-17-2021, 09:14 AM   #29
sschind
Quote:
Originally Posted by WebSlave View Post
You obviously don't know Connie.

She likes guns too. She will actually mark pages in the NRA magazines we get to note guns that caught her eye. And I can't count the number of times we were at a gun show and I was trying to decide between two guns and Connie would just say "Buy both of them! What's the problem with that?"

Actually we don't have a "his" and "hers" money arrangement. It's "our" money. And neither one of us will deny the other something they want.

Truth be known, I almost have to wrestle Connie to the floor to get her to take money to buy something. She is a one in a million (maybe even totally unique), no doubt.
Sounds like you got a great one. I kinda figured that but I wanted to throw it in anyway
 
Old 01-29-2021, 07:48 AM   #30
nickolasanastasiou
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickolasanastasiou View Post
I received the first dose of the Moderna version. It was uneventful. Looking forward to getting the second dose administered later this month.
I received the second dose on Wednesday. Tenderness at the site developed over ~6-8 hours and had vanished before 24 hours. At around 24 hours, I developed a temperature of 101.8F along with the slightest hint of aching muscles. I let that be for around 6 hours. Since I had to work that night, I took one 500mg tablet of acetaminophen that quickly brought my temperature to 98.8F and I have stayed around that since. Reactions will vary, but that was mine. All in all, no big deal relative to the benefit obtained.
 

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