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General BS forum I guess anything is fair game in here. Just watch the subject matter doesn't get carried away too much.

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Old 11-13-2005, 02:59 PM   #11
kiote9
Maggie, I, too, would want you to be there when I had a dog put down. Knowing another person cares so deeply for the life of the animal leaving is very comforting.

Last year I had to have my friend Ron's lab put down while Ron was on vacation. The dog, Ben, had organ failure and was on IV's and round the clock care. Ron had an annual family vacation to go on and was not in a position to refuse to go, so he asked me to take care of Ben's needs.

Ron had been gone three days when the vets office called to say Ben had taken a turn for the worse and was suffering. The vet tech sat and held his head while he was given the injection and we all sat and petted him till we were sure he was gone. ALL of us cried and hugged because Ben was a special guy, a fantastic dog and a great friend. We cried for Ron's loss as well. He didn't even know his best friend was gone. Having caring vet staff makes a HUGE difference. We knew they cared and we all shared the pain.

A properly given injection is blessing in a situation such as this, but for road hit animals I wish it was legal to carry a pistol and just put them out right there as I have watched them suffer and it is a great wrongness.
 
Old 11-13-2005, 11:51 PM   #12
A_Kendergirl
I understand the feeling on both sides, and I don't think either choice is easy.

I recall several years ago (I was about 17), the cable guy was standing on our patio talking to my mom and me. As we were talking a rabbit came running full tilt around the pond behind the house - straight into the cable man's leg. We could tell straight away that the rabbit had snapped it's neck. As it was staring at us in wide-eyed horror, it was apparent that it was the end. My mom said "Poor thing, the best thing to do would be to ring it's neck." (We don't have guns). I agreed, and we look up to the cable guy - who was looking at us like we had turned into horrible green ogres right before his eyes. He started blubbering about taking it to a vet - they could make it better. So, to spare the guy, we agreed (knowing otherwise). We took the rabbit to the vet, who promptly put it to sleep. I don't think I could have finished it myself - but I bet my mom could.

It's funny - I know I couldn't shoot it, or ring it's neck ... but I could use a CO2 chamber with no problems. I won't even kill bugs - I don't have the stomach for it (other than 'skeeters). But on the other side of the coin, I commit mass insecticide every night to feed my geckos without thought. LOL ... I can't figure out my own logic ... but there you have it. I guess it's like hunting. I'm very much against hunting for sport, but if comes to a choice between hunting and starving I say "Go get it", and I'll help you skin.

On the other side of the issue, we had to put down Eric's dog a few months ago. It was truly horrible, and the memory still brings tears to my eyes (even more so now, because my cat of 17 years is heading down that inevitable path). Lex had a degenerative muscle and connective tissue disease. We watched him waste away for more than 7 years. Near the end, his joints became so relaxed that his heels would touch the ground as he walked. It was painful for him, but he was still a happy guy. The last few days he was with us, the pain became too much for him. His eyes glazed, he didn't want to eat or drink, he would lay there looking awful. He would try to sit up and be happy, but it was too much effort. We could see it was time. Eric's mom didn't want to do it, but we forced the issue...he had all the suffering he could take. We (Me, Eric, and his parents) were all sitting around Lex, trying not to cry. We said our goodbyes, and then tried to con him into getting up and going to the car. Eric said "Let's go check the mail!!" which always send Lex running out the door, and he just gave us a look that said he wasn't being fooled. We tried to get him to stand by bribing him with a cookie, and that didn't work either. So, we decided that it was too painful for him to even stand now, so we would carry him (he was a Sheppard mix). When Eric went to scoop him up, he RAN away. A dog that didn't have the strength to sit, was suddenly running as if he knew what was about to come (and I think he did). When we took him in, the vet explained what was happening, what the shots were for. She said the first shot would put him to sleep, and the second one would stop his heart. They gave him the first shot, and said they would be back in 5 mins. His eyes got droopy, and he started to lay his head down...and just before his head hit the table, he shook it off. He lifted his head back up, and looked out the window. We could see he wanted to be outside. He never looked elsewhere - just out the window. When the vet came back in, they were surprised he was still awake. The check his responses, and he had no pain sensations. They had to make him lay his head down, and still he kept looking out that little window. It didn't take much time for the second shot to take effect, but it was so hard to be there and watch. We all cried for a good long time. I'm glad I was there - after about 5 mins, I felt better because I knew he wasn't in pain anymore. Unfortunately, we were there for the after effect of death (those who feed live food items will know what I'm talking about). That was unpleasant.

Of all the pets I've had throughout my lifetime, this was the first one we had to make the choice to bring in. When I was younger, they just wouldn't be around suddenly. When I got older, they were either adopted out before their time (we moved frequently - military), or they died suddenly. I seriously dread having to make the same choice. I would MUCH rather find them dead suddenly, then to have it drag out and have to make that choice again. But, if the situation calls for it, I will do it again because I believe it's the right thing to do.

I don't care if you're shooting them with a gun or a needle - it's an awful choice to have to make.
 
Old 11-14-2005, 12:13 AM   #13
techgirl
speaking as a tech, i agree that the situation and the outcome were best for your friend's husky. i work with strickly emergencies, so a good portion of the cases we see may end with the recommendation of euthanasia. we do our best to make the situation as comfortable for the people as we do for the poor animals. if they wish to be with them while it's done, we will give a sedative first so that there is no struggling, crying, or fighting for the animal. only has the rare case has come through the door where the animal was so bad that the option for the people to be there was not offered or told not recommended because of the stress it places on the animal. we will let them say good-bye before we do it and allow them to see them once it's done. i have been on both ends of the spectrum(i euthanized my own dog myself when she was in kidney failure) and agree that when the situation calls, the proper thing must be done for the animal's sake as well as for the people involved.
 
Old 11-14-2005, 02:59 AM   #14
Junkyard
Thank you for the responses. I fully believe the dog was in a situation that being shot was the best idea, he was in the most horrid state after being hit by the truck. The person I was talking to is a vet tech and cannot see the side of the situation we were on. This person has lived in a large city their entire life, never to move out and be a part of the country. Having vets within 5 miles of each other they just do not see how hard it can be to contact one out in the country. Speaking to them I felt as though I was speaking to a wall no matter how hard I tried. This person also know very well that I put down mice on a regular basis to feed my snakes, but they are not concerned about the rodents being whacked. Oh well, can't win them all. Thank you again for the responses.
 
Old 11-14-2005, 04:08 PM   #15
South Dixie Dragons
well I am another Vet Tech going to speak out..

Clay, something did in fact go very wrong when your dog was euthanized. Even thought you stated she was a young dog, that did not mean that her vein could have collapsed or the vet did not even hit the vein. Under normal circumstances, the animal is usually gone by the time you finish giving the injection..
Chows are notorious for their ill tempered behavior. Now I know their are some great Chow Chows out there, but they are few and far between. I do not blame you for not wanting him around your child and to be able to adopt an animals like that would be near impossible. I recall being hunted down as a child by my neighbors Chow..he did not even like the kids in his own family!

I think what was done with the Husky was the right thing to do given the circumstances. If I was faced with the same situation, I would have done the same thing, in fact, I have been in that situation and HAVE done the same with one of my own animals...

Like I stated earlier, I am a tech and it is the worst part of our jobs. I never like doing it but I have been able to become somewhat numb to it due to the fact that most of the animals NEED their suffering ended, and their end is in sight already. The ones that send me out of the room crying my eyes out are the elderly folks (especially men) who have to have their dog put to sleep, and you know that dog is the only thing they have, their family member...That I just can't take...
 
Old 11-14-2005, 04:34 PM   #16
Golden Gate Geckos
I had to have Max, my 17 year-old Miniature Schnauzer euthanized a couple of years ago, and it was very peaceful for him and was done with extreme compassion by his long-time vet. Everyone at the vet's office cried along with me. I do not regret having to put him down because I loved him and didn't want him to suffer anymore.

I also had to shoot one of my pygmy goats many years ago. He had gotten into the shed and swallowed a deep sea multi-hook that was still on the fishing pole. I had NEVER heard anything more horrific than his bellowing cries, or saw anything more traumatic than all the blood coming out of him... everywhere.

It was a Sunday and I was alone, so I called the mobile vet to come out, but he was 40 miles away on another emergency and couldn't get to my place for at least several more hours. The vet asked me how much I paid for the goat, and I told him $35. He then said, "Do you have any idea how much I am going to have to charge you to come all the way out there?" He then asked if I had a gun, and I told him I had a Winchester. He suggested I use it. I couldn't bear to watch my goat in such agony, so I shot him in the head.

I have never picked up a gun since. I still have nightmares over it.
 
Old 11-14-2005, 04:45 PM   #17
Hurley
On the tranquilizer aspect, if it was Acepromazine (which is the most commonly given), she may very well have had bad veins due to the drop in blood pressure Ace can cause. I personally hate using Ace prior to a euthanasia unless it is RIGHT before (as in given IV) to let a very anxious dog relax, then follow with the euthanasia solution.

I will also say that the most difficult euthanasias to perform smoothly are otherwise healthy young aggressive dogs. They have such a high endorphin level coming in that they will overpower many sedatives. It's a hard situation and an emotionally charged one, to be sure. Please don't let one bad experience scare you from humane euthanasia altogether. When performed properly and when things go well, it's very fast, painless, and if anything they get a euphoric feeling from the barbiturates. Unfortunately, not every euthanasia goes smoothly, I wish it did. Again, so sorry to hear about your experience.

I think the kindest thing anyone can do is let an owner know what to expect and things that can happen after the mind is gone (from euthanasia). Things like "agonal breathing", which is a reflex by the body in response to them stopping breathing. The diaphragm spasms and neck muscles contract to open the mouth to force air in the lungs. When they make those "gasps", they are not aware, they are no longer with us, it's just a reflex (but yes, understandably hard to watch, especially if you aren't prepared for it to happen). Not all dogs do this, but some do (especially the more debilitated ones, in my experience). The animal most likely won't close its eyes, which is very hard for some people. They may urinate or defecate as muscles relax. As muscles run out of oxygen, sometimes you'll see tiny twitches in reaction (again, not always, but you can.) These are all things that I feel owners should understand before being present for the euthanasia. It can be much more difficult for the owners than the animal, but somehow it's not so hard to see if you expect it. Other owners may simple decide that they don't want to be present and prefer to remember them as they were. It's a very personal choice.
 
Old 11-14-2005, 05:44 PM   #18
Matt Haines
I've had to put a couple of animals out of their misery. It is definitely not an easy task to shoot an animal, especially your own. I do feel however that under the circumstances, and without being in proximity of a vet for proper euthanasia, that it is humane and the animal is grateful for the ending of it's suffering. I also hope that no ones has to have an experience of saving an animal from it's pain with a knife. It is a much more emotionally painful and uneasy task to undertake.
 

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