Louisiana herpers need your help!!!

The Louisiana State Senate is poised to vote for HB1468 which will ban the owning of any non-native reptile in Louisiana without a permit from the LA Dept of Wildlife & Fisheries.
The web address is www.legis.state.la.us

We need some help to stop this from becoming a law!
If anyone has experience fighting these sorts of things we would greatly appreciate any input.
Myself and many other have been on the phone all day contacting senators. I put a call into PIJAC as well!
We just got wind of it today which makes it harder to get to people before the vote takes place.
It has already passed the house and is scheduled for the senate to vote on it early next week!

If you are from Louisiana please contact your
Senator at (225) 342-2040 and also contact
Senator Melinda SCHWEGMANN (who is the woman who added reptiles to the bill in the first place) at (225) 342-6945 or (504) 286-0717 and voice your opinion.

Our rights are being taken away from us, then sold back at a profit to the goverment! O.K. I am off the soap box. Any help would be great!


Thanks !
] Nicole Elliser
K&N Reptiles

Yeah Nicole, it is happening all over the country because we are not a big money contribitor to political campaigns, it will keep happening. If you can get together some money and talk to an attorney right away, you may be able to buy some time by forcing the gathering of more information or trying to delay a vote pending more testimony and statements but it is not likely to work. You really needed time to prepare for hearings before the vote was called for. One thing that you can do is use your business license, tax ID #, any permits or licenses you have from the DNR or other government agency as a way of proving you were a pre-existing entity to "grandfather" you from being affected by the law. Next I would try to get them to at the very least allow some kind of permit/application/license process for people to have animals outside the confines of the law. Start a signature drive. Get as many names as you can. Call the politicians at every level in your area and make appointments to talk to them about it. Be sure they are aware that people who vote will vote against them. That is always the key. If you can, in the future, make consistent, even if they are not large, contributions to somebodies campaign, they will see your name as a regular giver and listen to what you have to say much more readily and be much more helpful to you. Even a couple hundred dollars here and there, just to get name recognition is a huge help.

My friend Brett Nelson from Indiana is both a herper and an attorney who is taking reptile related cases. He runs adds in reptiles magazine with his firms contact info. Evan Stahl

The bill has passed the house unanimously and is on to the senate. here is a link to the individual senators in case you would like to email them:http://senate.legis.state.la.us/senators/Default.asp
some pet shop owners i know are trying to organize petitions as a good portion of thier business is reptilian. I have not been able to find out when the bill is to go before the senate as of yet. It was introduced by a democrat and the senate is split, so the vote could be close, partisan as the south is. any advice from others who have defeated such bills is greatly welcome thanx

glenn dougherty

I dealt with several pieces of legislation on the state level here as well as went to court against the city that I live in. It is too late to beat it. It is half way there and there is no concern whatsoever in any state governing body about the people who would keep reptiles. They know that it is a very small demographic that has no formal organisation and little funding. They have researchers for that. PIJAC very rarely even bothers to fight reptile laws as they get the bulk of their monies from dog/cat/fish business' and need to worry about those much larger groups. You need to focus now more on dealing with the reality. You guys would have had at least 6-12 months and more likely much more to stop it but you have to be on the mailing lists/notification lists for them to tell you when they are hearing on it. The boat, sadly, has sailed. Now, try to get support. That is all you can do. Once you have a base of support then you can try to have it ammended. It is very difficult but possible to get that amount of support. Herp societies, colleges and universities, any body that has a large membership that may be sympathetic to your cause. There should not be a problem forcing a conditional situation as I stated above with permits or something else. That may be your only cause. Everyone who reads these boards should see something coming their way. Don't wait until this happens to you before you start asking questions. Evan Stahl

One other option, is wait until it becomes law and then intentional violate it, force them to bring you to court and then beat them at their own game and at their expense. You can go after selective enforcement issues, unenforceable law issues, overly generalized legislation, etc, etc.

Like Evan said, almost every state in the Union is or will be looking at changing laws on how we are "allowed" to keep, collect and/or breed reptiles and amphibians in captivity.
In 1998, the State of Indiana attempted to pass some real strict laws on what we could maintain in captivity and what we were allowed and not allowed to breed. With the help of a small core group, we formed ICORAL (Indiana council on Reptile and Amphibian Laws) and raised $10,000 to hire an attorney to fight against these strict and damaging laws. Unbeknownist to us, the state had undercover fish and wildlife agents pose as herpers and attend all of these meetings. They were abreast of every thing we were trying to do. In fact , as these laws were making there way thru the system, the state did a Raid and arrested 33 people with all kinds of charges. All said and done, the state pretty much won hands down. We are no longer allowed to keep and breed any speices of herp that "could" be native to the state. No longer allowed to keep and breed venomous, no crocodilians over a certain size limit, etc etc.
Now, there are permits in place, and the last time I have checked with the DNR only one person attempted to get one for his cottonmouth. I was told that they do not allow vision or Neodasha cages to house venomous. No one wants all of their neibors to know what they have (part of the permit is you have to have each person sign off on the fourm, telling them you are keeping venomous on your property). The list goes on about what you have to do and how you have to do it.
Pretty much , the hobby is dead or/and dieing in this state.
I am not allowed to say where I got this informaiton, but I was told that 1.) Local States are being persaded to change/enforce stiffer laws pertaining to their wildlife from the federal level, and 2.) that fishing and hunting is at a all time low, and that the state wildlife agencies are attempting to make more laws to combat this down turn (i.e. job secruity).
Since, 1998, Ohio, Alabama, Oregon, and a few other states have either changed or in the progress of changing their laws on keeping/collecting/maintaining herps.
I wish you luck, but know , that you will be fighting up a very steep hill. Most herpers think that if the state isn't banding, what they are currenlty working with, then it is not their concern, but I'm here to tell you from experince, that when one law is passed, others will follow........

Do you know anything else about this Ohio legislation? I haven't heard about it. As far as I know there are still no statewide laws, just a pretty simple permit system for native herps.

Erin Benner

The restrictions in Ohio include required permits for keeping and breeding anything native to the state. So even if you have captive bred eastern garters, spotted turtles, black ratsnakes, anything, you have to go through the system and get documentation. It is just the start. Ohio was always one of the least restricted states in the country. Now they are going towards more restrictions. For exact specifics, you would need to consult the State of Ohio's fish and wildlife department. Evan Stahl

And Ron, don't forget about the raid in Chicago and increased restriction out west.

Since we are talking Ohio.....
Did you know that it is illegal for anyone who is not from Ohio to hunt/collect in that state? Only people from Ohio can collect a turtle, frog, snake, etc. Not even with a hunting or fishing license can you pick up a toad!! This strikes me as being very wrong. I can buy a license and fish or kill a deer or rabbit, but I will be arrested if I find a nice spotted salamander and bring it home.
United States?? Where one has rights?? Hmmmm....

I can understand a state restricting the collection of native reptiles in a "conservation effort", but what is the point in regulating the ownership of non-native herps?

I just don't see the need for someone to be hassled with a permit if they want to keep a leopard gecko, etc...

Can someone explain to me the state's interest in such a bill?

Money.

Money for permits. A reason for the departments to ask for a larger budget (enforcement and administration).

Most government employees do not understand that money has to come from somewhere (your and my pockets). So they can enlarge their small area of power by expanding their staff. Unlike the average working Joe or small business owner they just fill out a budget form and MAGIC there is now new funds. The ones in the legislature are the ones that have to generate the funds. They do this by passing laws that require fines ... err I mean permits or fees for the working class to do the things we enjoy.