To the Texas clan (and everyone else)

Originally Posted by ShannanD25

Wow,
What bothers me is this IS a close knit group yet everyone seemed to turn on one another so quick and the Leo forum people get called names and everything else. What the he!!????When I first started reading the link I was shocked it was even in here and didn't understand why it was called party...luckily i was bored and read the whole thing...Y'all just went for each others' throats way to quick. Considering kids do read these forums, I hope those who got nasty and started calling names realize those same kids could one day be a potential customer and that whether you want to or not, you ARE setting examples these kids may follow. Guess fauna was about due for a big dramatic blow out. Hopefully this is it for the rest of the year?

I wasn't going to say anything else, as I think I said enough in my post in Heck concerning this, but I just wanted to reply to a section of this post which seems to be a common statement from some of the gecko people as to why they "jumped" on Lucille, or agreed with the people who jumped on Lucille. (whether or not they completely read through the thread) that statement being that "it's nothing personal" or we are not "exclusivists" or whatever, it's for the sake of the children.

I read many of the Leo threads because I'm interested in just about all herps, so I have seen some pretty ugly threads here on the Leo forum, for instance a thread of a couple people arguing back and forth that culminated in this

then that means you can be the ONLY asshole? ok... thats cool with me, asshole

another example, in the "I had to open my big mouth" thread, there are a couple of "emoticons" flipping the bird. Yet, other than one person saying

"why don't you take this to chat"

in ONE of the threads, I saw no one admonishing the behavior, nor reminding any one about the children etc.

Now I'm not trying to start a flame war, so I hope no one sees it that way. I'm simply trying to say that the "apparent" double standard, or using the noble reason (and it is a valid one) only to "outsiders" who post, is part of why myself and others got/get the impression that the Leo forum was "elitist" or "exclusivist."
Well, hope this fence remains mended, and hope those who are able to attend the ACTUAL party, not the hell party , have fun. Someone bring some Coke, not Pepsi, on my behalf (p.s. somebody bring me back an alterna, or if no one finds anything, a Leo from a Leo keeper/forum user who attends the party

then that means you can be the ONLY asshole? ok... thats cool with me, asshole

ok i think i said that i take credit
and if you read my post way up above this you will see i was no angel and have said inappropriate things before, if you look at my warning points you can clearly see all of my more colorful posts if you want

another example, in the "I had to open my big mouth" thread, there are a couple of "emoticons" flipping the bird. Yet, other than one person saying
Quote:
"why don't you take this to chat"

you can't flip the bird in chat you havent been able to for a long while now

My take on what John was saying is this.

He is NOT singling out anyone person, Robin, but the entire GROUP of leopard gecko forum members in its entirety.

From what he says it SEEMS that you all, as a group, find it perfectly ACCEPTABLE for one of your own to cuss and swear but HEAVEN FORBID someone else, regardless of whether or not he, meaning me, is a gecko keeper or not as I am NOT a member of your "elitist" group.

It's pretty plain and simple, marcia, that you must have known of Robins pecadillos and sat quietly by, as so many do, and said NOTHING, and, apparently, it was not just marcia alone but the entire group.

THAT is a double standard. Who was thinking of the children the mysteriously ghost over on their parents user names and passwords? Which is, by the way, a TOS violation, and ALSO overlooked by one and all of that group.

This is where the "impression" of and exclusive group is fortified and solidified in the minds, I suspect, of many.

Wes,
I think this exclusivity isn't done on purpose. Alot of folks on the Leo forum are great friends. Naturally, that relationship seems exclusive. I don't see anything wrong with that as these folks are great breeders with amazing experience and can contribute info to this forum and all the novices who ask questions. I think it is great they have bonded so close. This doesn't change the fact that when reading the inital posts on the thread in question really made one wonder what the heck was going on. It was full of nastiness and name calling and had nothing to do with Leos. That is why it was called out. Not everyone takes the time to weed through the first few pages to get to the last few. It was a misunderstanding. And suddenly all this name calling began on a forum that is browsed by youngings. There was no reason for it. I hope this type of blowout doesnt happen again as it really has divided the reptile communtiy here on fauna.

Take care all herpers!
Shannan

With all that has been said about the vulgar language on "Hell"! and pointed out numerous times with others in agreement on this thread!!!!!!! Why do you people keep "quoting it" "bringing it back up" and "displaying it" for ALL to see.
I don't get it!

He is NOT singling out anyone person, Robin, but the entire GROUP of leopard gecko forum members in its entirety.

From what he says it SEEMS that you all, as a group, find it perfectly ACCEPTABLE for one of your own to cuss and swear but HEAVEN FORBID someone else, regardless of whether or not he, meaning me, is a gecko keeper or not as I am NOT a member of your "elitist" group.

jeeze, i mean i do love and care for my geckos and take pride in them but my first love is boas. i tried to get the boa forum going way back but i couldnt stimulate jack, so i quit trying... so i am going to skip away and go play with my boas... they bite harder than anyone can dish out here but i still love them =) least i know what to expect, eh?

Originally Posted by wilomn

My take on what John was saying is this.

He is NOT singling out anyone person, Robin, but the entire GROUP of leopard gecko forum members in its entirety.

From what he says it SEEMS that you all, as a group, find it perfectly ACCEPTABLE for one of your own to cuss and swear but HEAVEN FORBID someone else, regardless of whether or not he, meaning me, is a gecko keeper or not as I am NOT a member of your "elitist" group.

It's pretty plain and simple, marcia, that you must have known of Robins pecadillos and sat quietly by, as so many do, and said NOTHING, and, apparently, it was not just marcia alone but the entire group.

THAT is a double standard. Who was thinking of the children the mysteriously ghost over on their parents user names and passwords? Which is, by the way, a TOS violation, and ALSO overlooked by one and all of that group.

This is where the "impression" of and exclusive group is fortified and solidified in the minds, I suspect, of many.

Wes, to be honest, you're probably right. I think I give my friends here more slack, although I've been known to blow a gasket over conduct once and awhile. (right guys?)

Here's why I reacted so strongly - because your name was in it. I've read your posts, witnessed your reactions and your language. I didn't want my son to read your stuff nor do I want him to go to the Hell forum. Nor did I think it was good for the younger people on this forum to read that sort of stuff. Our kids might hear just as bad of stuff on the school bus, but we don't have to let them see it on the internet, where we have control. And we have had more than our share of debates on this topic, on and off this forum.

That being said - it really is none of my business of what you say or do. I don't know you except from your writings and have little need to strike any relationship with you. I was hoping to keep the Leo forum a nice place where kids could come, but I have come to grips that this is not my job, nor does anyone seem to care. So have at it bud.

Shannon, you may have missed it before but NO ONE is in disagreement with you here.

The simple fact that there is one standard for "the great friends" who are frequent contributors to the leo forum and ANOTHER standard for those of us who are NOT "great friends" with them, is not cool.

I do NOT condone my particular method in the leo forum, it would not be appropiate and it has been discussed and explained, in a adequate manner I believe, that the posting of the THREAD itself and NOT the PARTICULAR post individually, was an error made in innocenense; merely an attempt at inclusion for everyone in something that looks to be a pretty good time.

I had NO clue that this double standard existed, I am NOT surprised, as those who OFTEN yell loudest about the affront someone has given them are in themselves guilty of the same. That, however, is YET another topic and, should further discourse be wished, should have a thread of its own.

What it really seems to be coming down to, is some folks here don't like some other folks, or folk as it were, because they/I/we do not conform to standards that are arbitrary to begin with.

Ya can't have it both ways folks.

Originally Posted by Monte

Wes, to be honest, you're probably right. I think I give my friends here more slack, although I've been known to blow a gasket over conduct once and awhile. (right guys?)

Here's why I reacted so strongly - because your name was in it. I've read your posts, witnessed your reactions and your language.

That being said - it really is none of my business of what you say or do. I don't know you except from your writings and have little need to strike any relationship with you. I was hoping to keep the Leo forum a nice place where kids could come, but I have come to grips that this is not my job, nor does anyone seem to care. So have at it bud.

I have NO desire to change any forum into a place that is NOT child friendly and had I been asked prior to the posting of the thread, which I was not and why should I be anyway -yet another topic for yet another thread- I would have cautioned ANYONE asking such question to tread carefully as I am well read and not always well recieved. As I've intimated before, I'm a good guy to have backing you up, no one to my knowledge, has ever said,"thanks but not thanks Wilomn, your reputation has preceeded you and I don't want your help," but I have heard of a few that were glad I stepped in.

Monte, it is not your JOB, but it is no BAD thing to speak up for what you want and believe. Is that not, in effect, exactly what I do? How could I say it's ok for me but not for you? Of course, were I to do that, I reckon I would bet automatic inclusion in some "groups'' that, upon consideration and reflection, I would just as soon not be grandfatherd into.

THIS is not a urinating war (child friendly vernacular, I hope) but a discussion of the very things that are felt but NOT discussed out in the open as a rule, most likely because no one is innocent and no one wants to come out and say so.

One rule to guide them and in the darkness bind them, or words to that effect.

What's good for me is good for you and vice versa.