New member scams

Harald or any mod,

Is there a way to block new members from creating classified ads within 30 or 60 days of becoming a member so as to help maybe alleviate some of the new member classified scams??? I've noticed that these scammers create their account and within a few days or a week have taken someones money.

Or maybe have them blocked for 30-60 unless they want to pay to post their add????

There's got to be something to help alleviate the problem and keep folks from losing their money.

Has this been a problem? I don't use the classifieds to sell but if I knew I couldn't post my animals right away after registering I probably wouldn't bother registering (That is not taking into consideration the other benefits of the site) and If I was a scammer I'd just wait the 30-60 days and then start posting. I don't see what making people wait would help. I don't think making them wait 30-60 days will suddenly turn them into honest people. If they want to scam they will still scam just 2 months later and it hurts the honest people.

Just my opinion.

Originally Posted by TailsWithScales

Harald or any mod,

Is there a way to block new members from creating classified ads within 30 or 60 days of becoming a member so as to help maybe alleviate some of the new member classified scams??? I've noticed that these scammers create their account and within a few days or a week have taken someones money.

Or maybe have them blocked for 30-60 unless they want to pay to post their add????

There's got to be something to help alleviate the problem and keep folks from losing their money.

This site does more then most to help alleviate the problems, but nothing will ever be enough ...welcome to the Internet. What this site, nor any other site, can NOT do is protect someone from themselves. Ultimately its up to the buyer to use common sense. Run an inquiry thread in the BOI, or RUN LIKE HELL when you see one, two, three, etc... red flags in an ad. Even if everything seems kosher...BUT your gut tells you otherwise, then move on to the next ad. Of course none of that will ever guarantee you 100% from being scammed, but it is what it is.

As far as what you're suggesting...(as an example I'll use that BOI thread that spawned your post)...had that scammer waited the 30 or 60 days to post that ad...do you honestly believe the results would be any different? I don't.

The only thing this "probationary" period will accomplish, is to hurt this site. Considering that this site does a lot to protect its members, if it does suffer then that will just open up more avenues for scammers to take advantage of. I'm positive that everyone (except scammers) would love for there to be other fail-safes, however they have to be realistic to be effective. Don't get me wrong, I like that you posted this and hope this will lead to some new ideas on how to make it harder for scammers to play their games.

Nothing I can do can FORCE people to not make unwise decisions.....

I had started to address this in the other thread, but it really didn't belong on the BOI.

Variations of this idea have been presented in the past, and the basic fault is that it detracts significantly from the desirability of this site to new members; so the negative impact far outweighs the potential benefit. I don't like that it is easy for somebody to access the classifieds and try to scam our members (including me), but imposing restrictions such as extended time or post requirements would simply lead to people going elsewhere.

Paid classifieds actually cut back significantly on the scammer activity, not just because of the required payment, but the process made it more difficult to set up an account under a false name. That system wasn't perfect, but we didn't have to constantly be on the watch to try to catch the next incarnation of known scammers. Obviously, with the more devious methods utilized by one of the recent problem children, the required payment wouldn't be a hindrance, since the account could be set up to match the cracked PayPal info.

I'd love to have an arsenal of ways to thwart scammer activity, and keep them off this site; but we can't drive away all the other new members in the process. Besides, a dedicated scammer will find a way. Six months ago, how many of us would have thought about people purchasing access to established (positively rated) Ebay accounts , or cracked PayPal accounts. The methods used are getting better, so we have to be more careful...but how many times to we hear about people sending payment without getting, and verifiying, basic information (full name, address, and phone). References are often a joke, but you should check them - nobody is going to give you the name of somebody that will say they are a low life POS...but they might give you a name you recognize that has never dealt with them. If all the references are local, they could just as easily be buddies/partners/aliases.

It's a tough time on both sides: as a buyer, I'm less likely to give a new name a chance - preferring to stick with people I know I can trust...but we're all new sometime, someplace. Not having a recognized name, reputation, or list of solid references doesn't mean somebody doesn't have what they are advertising, or take great care of their animals.

(I've been rambling....you get the idea)

I guess a lot of it just is my directing some serious frustration into an attempt to help because it just seems to have happened a lot more frequently. I'm not oblivious to the HUGE benefits of this site and have personally used the classifieds myself many times in the past.

I know it would be potential turn offs for new members. I had thought of that but there are times that drive to help (especially after being a victim of scamming) is far greater then the possibility of sounding like a dork for mentioning the other thoughts in my brain. And yes I know a lot is just buyer common sense.

Thanks for listening though.

Christine, I directed the discussion here because a lot of people share your frustration. While that particular suggestion isn't really feasible, sometimes the ensuing dialogue can bring good ideas to light. If not, hopefully people will at least get the message that they have to be more careful, and actually take measures to avoid getting ripped off.

Very good points made for both sides on the topic. I myself am new to this site, but not new to selling online. People dead set on stealing will find a way and that is just the sad true. In the beginning I found selling online very hard. I had to grind it out and build up a reputation even bend over backwards to fix a small thing here and there because I did not want to ruin my rep. That took a few years but it was worth it. Now I can lean on those 100's of good reviews and that has helped my transition into reptiles. And the people that mentioned this are right, if this site had restricted me from posting in the FS section right away I am pretty sure I would have left the site never to return. But since that did not happen I have really started to like this site and appreciate the things that are being done for us.

Bottom line I guess is there is a lot a buyer can do to protect themselves. Even if a seller comes across as nice and honest I still use my credit card through paypal the first time I buy from them. This gives me a double layer of protection. Paypal as most of you know I am sure, has a crap buyer protection policy. There are so many holes in that policy I am not even sure why they have it. SOMETIMES I have been backed up by paypal but you really have to have all your ducks in a row for that to happen. I have won claims in my favor before but then paypal told me they were unable to recover the funds from the seller. Well DUH they stole it from me.

This is where my credit card comes in. In the cases where paypal falls though on me my credit card company has not faltered. *Yet. I am not saying it can’t happen, but I am more protected then I was if I did not use it.

If that first purchase goes smoothly and I get what I expected I begin to relax a little on future transactions with that person. I know I rambled a little here but I felt like sharing.

Originally Posted by Talkenlate04

This is where my credit card comes in. In the cases where paypal falls though on me my credit card company has not faltered.

I think (I'm not 100% sure though) that if you get scammed and Paypal fails to do anything about it, it wont help you any even if your CC was the source of your Paypal funds. If you accept PayPal's TOS, you are in effect waiving your rights to credit card consumer protection laws.

I believe this to be the case, but again, I'm not positive.

What i'll do is if I see something in my area tha looks suspicious,i'll ask to come see the advertised merchandise. It makes it harder for some1 to scam if they think that someone "in the area" is wanting to see they're stuff.Not saying that's the end-all answer to scammers. I called a guy out a couple weeks back that had ads for ball pythons & beardeds.He listed himself as in NYC. I asked where he was in NYC & if I could see what he has.Needless to say he never responded,then changed his add once everyone started to call him out(he even emailed people pics of a Canadian co.'s beardie!) . Just a few days ago this winner then pm'd someone asking if they wanted to buy a pied,I believe.
I am overly paranoid when it comes to purchases on a computer of any kind.So as a general rule of thumb,I only do business with verifiable,reputable & reliable breeders. Granted the pricing might be a little more,but, in the long run its worth it.I realized this after I had made my first online animal purchase.

Uh oh... I caught the rambling bug too!
Sorry all.