Restrictive return policies

Originally Posted by Dennis Hultman

So was this business plan developed since last October?






Elitist sounding much? That's kind of a rather amusing comment to pose to Rich?

A friend insisted I post them here to see how they'd do.
The entire experience just re-enforced my belief to not sell online.

If bothering to attempt to address ignorant, rude, misguided, comments makes me sound elitist.... Then I must be elitist.

What does attacking the quality of a collection you've never seen, or the integrity of a man you've never met make you?

Did I assume/comment that anyone who sells here overproduces commodity animals?

Did I say anything negative about another poster's ethics or the quality of the animals they produce.

Did I criticize the way anyone else is doing business?

I guess suggesting that a prospective buyer invest a little time and money and money on traveling to a few expos, or visiting a few breeders before they buy an animal might not fit into the business model of some of the posters.

Or maybe I should list the name of the fauna seller who sent a good friend over a dozen very high priced corn snakes that arrived half dead, about a year ago? Or better yet possibly the name of the poster who vouched for the seller.

And for the record...
I know who Rich is, I've bought animals from him in the past.
That's why I was a little taken back by his comment.

Originally Posted by asixtwo

What does attacking the quality of a collection you've never seen, or the integrity of a man you've never met make you?

I haven't stated anything about the quality of your animals. Nothing.

Did I assume/comment that anyone who sells here overproduces commodity animals?

Yes you did.

It's obvious that some people here are simply concerned with selling their animals.

Or maybe I should list the name of the fauna seller who sent a good friend over a dozen very high priced corn snakes that arrived half dead, about a year ago? Or better yet possibly the name of the poster who vouched for the seller.

Your friend should if the situation wasn't corrected. We aren't about concealing things. That is what the BOI is for. We want to know who to deal with. It's a disservice in my opinion to the rest of the community not to tell when someone has been cheated. But why would you want to target someone who stated someone was good to deal with? I'm sure they probably would like to know too.

Look, anybody could join and post a classified. There are risks. Everyone has the ability to minimize those risks by researching who you are buying from.

And yes, bad people can be among us and have a good track record of selling until something goes wrong. It happens all the time. There are also many great people that go above and beyond. It's like any other hobby. Sometimes people suck.


Your free to minimize your risks however you see fit. I still believe it does a disservice telling new people who sign-up to use this site not to buy online. It does a disservice to many good people out there that utilize this site and others.

And Frankly, it's bad form to be running around a website telling people not to use the service that it provides. What business owner would put up with that?

I mean really, if I was on your site telling people not to buy from you, I wouldn't expect you to put up with me for long.

This site belongs to Rich, it's his property and investment and you are basically telling people not to utilize his service. I wouldn't look upon that very favorable if I were him. Why would I let somebody use my service to tell others not to use my service?

IMO a business without an active online presence of some sort may survive while the Boomer generation is still alive.

In a few decades I think it's extremely unlikely. Gen X finds everything by going online to look first. It may be a few blocks away or they may drive past a business every day- but if they don't see it online when they go to look for whatever it is they're looking for... it doesn't exist. Gen Y is even more to the extreme in terms of immersion in the "virtual" rather than "real" world.

People can evolve or not evolve their business strategies in relation to changes in their potential customer bases accordingly. Whether or not they choose to is completely their own business and tied to their own personal goals.

If I were close to retirement age, wasn't intrested in passing along or selling a business to someone else, was content with the current status and income from my business, and not interested in expanding my clientele and business model into new territory, I probably wouldn't bother online, either.

Originally Posted by Dennis Hultman

I still believe it does a disservice telling new people who sign-up to use this site not to buy online.

I never said not to buy online, I said not to shop online.

I BUY from people I know all the time.
They might send me an email, or point me to an ad online, and if I like the animal, I'll strike a deal and arrange for transportation.

I have no problem buying animals reputable dealers, but I'd still be leery about buying/trading with a hobby breeder 1000 miles away.

I'm not saying you shouldn't BUY online from people you know and trust. All I'm saying is, get to know who you're doing business with before you buy from them.

After all, this a live animal we're talking about.... not an ipod!

Maybe what I should have said is....
Do your research before you buy. Don't assume anything about anybody.

I fell badly that the original posted got scammed, but am I the only person who thinks she could/should have seen this coming and not made the deal in the first place? Wouldn't just a bit more research have made a difference? Wasn't the "word" at the Ohio show to stay away from that one particular vender?

As for my opinion.... it is different, I'll give you that.
Isn't the entire point of a forum to offer up varying viewpoints?

As for the shipping thing.....
I've had animals left to die on my front porch, or on the floor in an unheated warehouse because the UPS driver refused to put a box marked "live reptile" in their truck.

I actually watched one warehouse employee kick my box through the warehouse because "SHE" wasn't going to pick up the box.

How do you think I feel when I need to call a seller and tell him/her that the animal they shipped was killed in transit? Let alone ask for a refund.

I'm amazed at how many people will spend thousands on a ball python, then balk at the cost of Delta Dash over fedex!

My preference is to deliver at a show, or have someone come to my facility, so I can examine the animal with the new owner at the time of the transfer.

Originally Posted by asixtwo

I said not to shop online....

point me to an ad online, and if I like the animal, I'll strike a deal

..........

Originally Posted by asixtwo

Maybe what I should have said is....
Do your research before you buy. Don't assume anything about anybody.

I fell badly that the original posted got scammed, but am I the only person who thinks she could/should have seen this coming and not made the deal in the first place? Wouldn't just a bit more research have made a difference?

I agree with bulk of your post. Its just not how I understood your original post.

Originally Posted by asixtwo

I never said not to buy online, I said not to shop online.

Because...?

I'm not saying you shouldn't BUY online from people you know and trust. All I'm saying is, get to know who you're doing business with before you buy from them.

After all, this a live animal we're talking about.... not an ipod!

Maybe what I should have said is....
Do your research before you buy. Don't assume anything about anybody.

I agree- which ironically enough actually is part of the reason I PREFER to buy online most of the time. My point is that this can be accomplished through building relationships within the context of the various online communities as well as taking advantage of the relatively few face-to-face opportunites that may present themselves depending on your relative location.

My preference is to deliver at a show, or have someone come to my facility, so I can examine the animal with the new owner at the time of the transfer.

I wish that were more of an option, myself. I guess you have the luxury of either having enough breeders local to you or the ability to fly all over the country yourself to accomplish this?

The way that Lucille clipped my text must have been an accident.
Here is the original text....

I BUY from people I know all the time.
They might send me an email, or point me to an ad online, and if I like the animal, I'll strike a deal and arrange for transportation.


Her post....
Originally Posted by asixtwo View Post
I said not to shop online....

point me to an ad online, and if I like the animal, I'll strike a deal

No. That was her way of pointing out a contradiction.