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Bad Guy Backwater Reptiles

J

Jessica29

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Just wanted to inform anyone looking to buy a reptile NOT to buy from backwater reptiles. I ordered a baby red blood python from them and have three major problems with what I received.

1. Shipping conditions were unexceptable. The container was to big for the box so it was tilted to where the snake couldn't even move. There was also NO cool pack even though temps in my area were over 110 degrees.

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2. Upon examination of the blood python we noticed alot of tiny bumps all over we body, indicating she was infested with mites.

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3. After a couple days we noticed her resting with her mouth open. When we picked her up to examine her further she had bubbles coming out of he mouth, indicating a respiratory infection. Her temps are fine on my end with the hot spot at about 88 and the cool side about 78. This does not happen overnight. Sorry about the quality of this pic, but hopefully you can see it.

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4. When we originally emailed tem regarding the bumps, they said they thought it could be food moving its way down (which obviously was not what I was talking about). They then said it may be water blisters, implying they would still send out a sick snake. Humidity is around 67%.

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I'm assuming that the Backwater Reptiles your speaking has the fauna account name "BackwaterReptiles" Samuel Sundberg of Sacramento, CA, USA. http://www.backwaterreptiles.com/ since the text message is signed Sam & the fax numbers match but I didn't see any post under that account so I'm guessing the purchase was done somewhere else? Could you please provide the dates of delivery & contact? Has Mr. Sundberg been advised of this post? I'm sure everyone would like to hear his side of the sorry as well. I particularly would like to hear more from him about how of the many methods available in fixing a mite problem, placing a toxic flea collar in with any reptile is the best solution..
 
I ordered straight from that website you linked. I ordered June 28 and the animal was shipped July 1, delivered July 2. I've received repays through email mostly through Sam, and one from Abby. I did mention that I should have looked them up on BOI, where they then told me that most of te reviews on them is from an "unethical competitor." I havnt received another reply yet regarding the RI. I don't beleive I have yet informed them about this BOI.

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Not to take sides here but did you ask for a refund including shipping? If YES and they declined, I think this is a warranty bad guy thread. If NO, I think you jumped the gun. Mistakes do happen. It makes a difference as to whether they were willing to correct the situation or just shut you down and run away with your money.

I see where they offered to reimburse the cost of treatment/supplies for the mites but just trying to get the whole picture here.
 
All they said is I could ship it back and they would refund my money. They did not say they would pay for shipping. I still find it rediculous that they would ship in such bad conditions, along with mites AND an RI.
 
I find the condition of the animal they shipped as well as their methods rather appaling indeed, but you should ask if they will refund the cost of the animal including shipping both ways. I'm curious as to their response.

I've considered purchasing from them on various occasions but the BOI is such a useful tool for providing insight before any bad deals might happen.
 
Even if they would refund for shipping as well, I do not have te means to send her back. I would never ship an animal in these temperatures without a cool pack or anything (which I do not have and they did not send the animal with). I'm not even sure that she would make it with the added stress of shipping, mites, and RI. I'd rather keep her and treat her myself then have her die. This thread was just to show people te conditions they are willing to send their animals in. Whether they try to fix it or not, to me, justify a nothing.
 
Sorry to hear about the bad conditions of your blood. This is simply unexceptionable and you are owed a refund. With that said I do think you need to get the temperature on your cool side up a few degrees. A low of around 82 to 85 is much safer and if indeed it is a RI higher temps are essential to help the snake fight it off. Somewhere in the range of 86 to 89 for the time being with a hot of 95 is a acceptable range. I wish you the best of luck with and hope he pulls through.
 
Sanguine84 said:
Not to take sides here but did you ask for a refund including shipping? If YES and they declined, I think this is a warranty bad guy thread. If NO, I think you jumped the gun. Mistakes do happen. It makes a difference as to whether they were willing to correct the situation or just shut you down and run away with your money.

I see where they offered to reimburse the cost of treatment/supplies for the mites but just trying to get the whole picture here.
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"Mistakes do happen" but I have to disagree with you because believe if everything we heard to date is correct, then this bad guy thread is 100% warranted. Poor packaging without anything to regulate the temperature isn't a mistake when you operate out of the same state your shipping the animal to. I believe in quarantining all new snakes entering a collection & understand sellers sometimes resell quickly but from the looks of them pictures & that animals skin this isn't a new case of mites, it's an infestation. The RI could have easily been induced from these parasites or even stress. Then on top of everything the seller provides poor information on resolving issues that should of been addressed well before even selling an animal. I'm still waiting to hear the other side of the story from Backwater reptiles but I doubt anyone can claim they would enjoy the experience the Opt received doing business with this company as she states it happened.
 
It's abundantly obvious that backwater reptiles is a flipper. They move the product. They carry wild caught animals and probably offer 50-100 different species at a time. There is no way they know proper husbandry of that many species let alone quarantine them. I would be surprised if they even ship all the animals from their own facility instead of forwarding the shipping info to their own suppliers.

They'll never have my business, I'm just saying that they should be given an opportunity to make Jessica financially whole again before throwing up a bad guy BOI. I would want that opportunity and I'm sure others would too. If its not resolved with 100% satisfaction then post.
 
Sanguine84 said:
It's abundantly obvious that backwater reptiles is a flipper. They move the product. They carry wild caught animals and probably offer 50-100 different species at a time. There is no way they know proper husbandry of that many species let alone quarantine them. I would be surprised if they even ship all the animals from their own facility instead of forwarding the shipping info to their own suppliers.

They'll never have my business, I'm just saying that they should be given an opportunity to make Jessica financially whole again before throwing up a bad guy BOI. I would want that opportunity and I'm sure others would too. If its not resolved with 100% satisfaction then post.
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I'm not familiar with there product & only can comment on what was presented in this thread which is enough to me. I understand what your saying & your entitled to you opinion just as much as I me. The fact that someone could not only ship an animal without the required care, knowing the temperature but would even send such an animal in that shape qualifies them as a bad guy to me not matter what the refund, if there is one. To me 100% satisfaction would involve not having to do a refund or return. Maybe I'm a to personally affected but I just believe it should be more about the animals & not the business.
 
Point taken, sir. I guess the main bullet point I'm trying to provide is that, with a little research and preparation a situation like this can be wholly avoided. I am aware not everyone is a member of the fauna classifieds not does everyone understand te importance of buying from a species specific breeder.

Backwater reptiles is essentially a large box store without the store. I expect these sorts of mishaps and mistreatments of animals (I do NOT condone it however).

I'm sorry this happened both for the customer and the animal in question. It's never easy seeing an animal suffer, but I strongly urge you (Jessica) to demand a full refund including shipping both ways and do not keep the animal as that only encourages them to keep doing this to others.
 
Sending an animal infested with mites (then playing it off as wood mites), harboring a RI and suggesting hanging a tick/flea collar in the enclosure to get rid of said mites is unacceptable. It does not matter if they are wholesalers or private breeders. Refunded or not, these practices are not acceptable and people should be made aware of them.
 
Sanguine84 said:
not does everyone understand te importance of buying from a species specific breeder.
.
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I have seen 'Bad Guy' threads about various breeders here. I think that a successful outcome has more to do with the seller's ethics rather than whether he/she is the breeder.
People sell parts of their collections and animals they have previously purchased all the time, successfully and with 'Good Guy' threads to show for it.

It is just not OK to send out sick, mite infested critters. No matter who you are.
 
Lucille said:
I have seen 'Bad Guy' threads about various breeders here. I think that a successful outcome has more to do with the seller's ethics rather than whether he/she is the breeder.
People sell parts of their collections and animals they have previously purchased all the time, successfully and with 'Good Guy' threads to show for it.

It is just not OK to send out sick, mite infested critters. No matter who you are.
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I wasn't saying it's "OK" to do so. Let me clarify my position.

After reading all the Good Guy and Bad Guy threads that have popped up over the last year or better, I've seen a pattern develop. Wholesalers and flippers tend to have poor business practices and ethics whereas private breeders who focus on a specific or several specific species have a much better rate of successful sales and happy clients.

I redact my previous statement about prematurely starting a Bad Guy BOI thread on backwater as I just looked back at the 2-3 others on them that prevented me from doing business with them and it was exactly this sort of thing for which the threads were written.

Still, hit them where it hurts. Demand a FULL 100% refund on shipping and all.
 
In no way am I taking the sellers side, but have you seen any live mites? It looks to me to be a typical wild caught blood that most likely had a blister issue that caused small sores when it shed last. I would say never by a blood of all species of pythons from a wholesaler. They buy them dirt cheap and cram them in dirty cages together. Bloods do not take this well. I would get it straight to the vet and checked for parasites and get on top of that RI as fast as you can. Young bloods can go down hill very fast. I hope you can get the situation fixed. I would not wait for the seller though as I have my doubts they will come up with a solution that you will be happy with.
 
As bad as this whole mess one, they at least fixed the problem. I asked them if they would be paying her vet bills, and of course they said they couldn't. They offered to send me a shipping label to send her back on them. Or that I could keep the snake and get a refund for her (not shipping). As much as I know many will disagree and think that I am condoning what they did, I chose to keep her and get refunded. I've already spent money treating her mites and she has a vet appointment Friday. I don't think she would survive being shipped again. So the refund will go towards her vet bills. I appreciate them working with me, but will still never be ordering from them, and feel this BOI is still necessary.
 
Jessica29 said:
As bad as this whole mess one, they at least fixed the problem. I asked them if they would be paying her vet bills, and of course they said they couldn't. They offered to send me a shipping label to send her back on them. Or that I could keep the snake and get a refund for her (not shipping). As much as I know many will disagree and think that I am condoning what they did, I chose to keep her and get refunded. I've already spent money treating her mites and she has a vet appointment Friday. I don't think she would survive being shipped again. So the refund will go towards her vet bills. I appreciate them working with me, but will still never be ordering from them, and feel this BOI is still necessary.
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I totally think this thread was an appropriate BOI. And I am glad you are keeping her and getting her the care she needs.
 
I have dealt with backwater and have nothing but excellent experiences. The price and service they offer is great. Abbey is wonderfull to deal with.
I agree with the above poster, this snake did not have mites. Probably after its next shed the bumps (or blisters) maybe caused from water will go away.

I am sorry you received a snake that you have issues with but, lets look at the facts. You received a complete refund and you get to keep the snake. In addition they offered you a complete refund and to pay shipping back. What more can they do? Yes avoiding the problem to begin with would have been ideal but, at this point you are way ahead of the game and not once did you say " I appreciate Backwater taking care of the problem" Or "hey things started off rocky but, I received a full refund and I get to keep the animal." It seems as you feel you are still owed something. Anyway, I am not trying to start a war of words but, you win. You are ahead of the game and they made the situation right. A lot of other companies would not have (One in particular comes to mind but, I wont mention it..)
If it were me I would want the animal back to do my own inspection and vet check before a refund was given.
Mistakes happen, and they sell quite a lot of animals so something is bound to go wrong every now and then. This industry just by the nature of shipping live animals is going to have more issues than others..... What makes a company reliable and honorable is standing behind it and trying to make it right which they have.
Anyway, I am glad you received the refund and I do hope the snake pulls through..
 
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