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Hey, sargent, forget the indigo and go with a false water cobra. Almost exact same body shape with a great personality and the coolest feeding response you will ever see. They are also the same size as cribos and indigos and(heres why i am recomending them) they are MUCH easier to find.
 
Jeff

Hydrodynastes gigas are indeed incredible animals, much like Drymarchon spp., and it makes one wonder if there could be some ancestral link, convergent / divergent evolutionary process perhaps, between the FWC's, Drys and Elapids.
It has been my experience the feeding response between Drys and FWC’s is the same, though baby FWC’s are generally much easier to get started and while FWC's are more readily available, cheaper too, they are an opisthoglyphic species harboring a venom similar to that of some Crotalidae. My primary concern is how many folks breeding and selling such ship their specimens, as I have seen a few dealers advertising they ship the species overnight, which, as anyone experienced with shipping and labeling regulations surrounding wildlife should know, is illegal. If you acquire FWC’s, I’d be certain the seller ships in the appropriate manner and you become familiar with the captive husbandry and toxicity of the species, especially should you, or a family member, harbor any sensitivity or allergen to insect venoms.
Also, you may wish to check your local regulations, as H. gigas are considered venomous, so any venomous regulations would apply as well. Not to mention, almost all home owners insurance companies will drop you, should they find out you are keeping a venomous specimen, unless you take out a "rider" policy specific to the keeping of such...

Best regards,

Jeff
 
I'm not 100 percent certain but I dont think the gov't sees the FWC the same as say a western diamondback. Its kind of like with tarantulas and scorpions. Yes they are venomous but anyone can buy one(the non lethal ones that is). And since there have been no deaths related to the snake, I would not push for such a ban.

Another plus is that like some other snakes, they are much more inclined to threaten you than actually bite. You know when you tick them off by the hood that gives them their name. really cool snakes and if anyone has any adults or sub adults, please contact me.
 
You may wish to double check this, Matt

There are marked differences between venomous insects and venomous reptiles and Hydrodynastes gigas are indeed recognized as a venomous species by the USF&WS, even many states and municipalities recognize them as such, harboring specific regulations surrounding the captive husbandry of the genus. Of course, there are many insects which harbor venom of greater toxicity, but such are rarely at the forefront of any specific legislative policy, as insect keepers tend to be, and forgive me for saying this, more responsible then many venomous reptile keepers. The number of medically significant envenomations on an annual basis provides strong testimony to this.
Having worked with Hydrodynastes gigas for several years, I can attest that the defensive behavior demonstrated is no bluff, as you will indeed get bitten should you handle one improperly once they behave in a defensive manner or should they confuse the entry of your hand into the enclosure with prey. Of course, feeding them within tubs outside of the enclosure, to reduce the association of enclosure entry with feeding time, and always using the proper tools to remove specimens from the enclosure will go far in preventing such.
I am in no way in favor of a blanket ban regarding venomous specimens, but I have a high regard for the regulations in place surrounding such and feel as though individuals willing to compromise the regulations place those who follow such in jeopardy of losing their right to keep venomous.

Best regards,

Jeff
 
Oh, dont get me wrong, i am absolutely sure that is you keep pestering the FWC, it will bite, but I like the fact that it does have that warning sign, much like a real cobra. And you are absolutely right in that with this snake and its feeding response, some sort of long instrument to remove it from the cage is necessary.

I do have a question. FWC's are quite rare in the U.S. with only a few people really breeding them and yet they stay relatively inexpensive where as indigos and cribos, native to the us(which FWC's are not) are much rarer(sp?). Why is this? I think its because demand for FWC's are pretty low so cost goes down. Shoot, there are much more Panther Chameleons being bred and those go for quite a bit more. Supply and Demand??????
 
Actually, H. gigas do not ALWAYS posture defensively prior to biting, so one must still use caution when handling them, even when they are not acting in a defensive manner and it doesn’t take much “pestering” to rile some specimens. For that matter, I have worked with a few Naja that would not hesitate to strike without acting outwardly defensive. In short, one cannot base the character of a given snake by its genus, spp. or ssp., as each are individuals harboring individualistic characteristics. Heck, I recall Gary Johnson, herp curator at the Louisville Zoo, telling me about a male D. couperi at Zoo Atlanta which was maintained within a “walk in” type naturalistic enclosure, complete with a colony of Gopherus ployphemus and burrows. Apparently, this particular male was quite territorial and would literally race out of any given burrow and defend its territory against any would be trespasser, generally the keepers. Apparently, it got to the point where no one wanted to maintain the exhibit! Now, eastern indigos are normally gentle giants and having worked with them for the better half of 30 years, in both captivity and the wild, I can attest that I have never seen one behave in such a manner in either environment. Personally, I would have second thoughts regarding the entrance of such a large exhibit, knowing there was 8’ of the reptilian version of the pit-bull somewhere in one of many holes just waiting for me! So, once again, animals do not always behave in the manner they are “supposed” to, simply because they are a member of this genus or that. ;0)
As for price, I have noticed a slight increase in the price of H. gigas over the past couple of years or so, but as you have indicated, they shadow in comparison to most available Drymarchon spp., with perhaps the exception of D. m melanurus, which I have found to be quite comparable in the way of price. Of course, supply and demand is always an issue and Drymarchon spp. are generally in greater demand and given H. gigas are venomous, as you have already indicated, often places a damper on the desirability of the species, especially in light of the somewhat recent studies indicating the toxicity and nature of the venom they harbor. When you toss in the number of states and municipalities that harbor regulations surrounding the keeping of venomous reptiles, even opisthoglyphic specimens, the number of folks within the hobby able and willing to keep such specimens simply begins to plummet. It’s unfortunate, as H. gigas generally make fascinating and relatively easy captives…


Best regards,


Jeff
 
epidemic said:
Heck, I recall Gary Johnson, herp curator at the Louisville Zoo, telling me about a male D. couperi at Zoo Atlanta which was maintained within a “walk in” type naturalistic enclosure, complete with a colony of Gopherus ployphemus and burrows. Apparently, this particular male was quite territorial and would literally race out of any given burrow and defend its territory against any would be trespasser, generally the keepers. Apparently, it got to the point where no one wanted to maintain the exhibit!
Click to expand...
I was also told that it tried to eat one of their Gopher Tortoises. I would not want to be the one to pull a very cofused tortoise's head out the mouth of a couperi.
 
Adult Texas Indigos

Does anyone know where I can get some Adult Texas Indigos for a good deal? Does anyone with a pair or trio want to trade anything them for anything? I am not quiet ready to get some (I need to get a cage,and sell some things and finish the semester of school next month). I would consider trading some Silver Marks for some. I have 101 silver marks. I would also consider a trade for some Easterns. Or if there is anything else that you would trade, let me know and I can see if I can work something out. Anyway, thanks.
 
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