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any advice or tips for a potential hot keeper

M_MULLINS

M_MULLINS

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as the title suggests i want to eventually own a venomous snake. im practicing right now with a very nasty honduran milksnake & havent gotten bit yet. i plan on doing this for another year or two before i actually get a hot. im still trying to decide what species i want to get & was hoping you guys could give me some advice as to which species to get. i want something thats not gonna get more than 4ft-4 1/2ft and isnt deadly venemous, i want something thats gonna be a little forgiving wen i make a mistake. id like to figure out which species im gonna get now so that i can do all the research i can on it now so when i get it i already know what to expect. thanks for reading
 
I'd suggest figuring out what you want to work with, then basing your "practice" accordingly.
Working with a nasty honduran (sorry, that is almost too funny to type) will be essentially useless if you decide on an arboreal viper, rattlesnake, cobra, Bitis, etc. It probably won't even give you much in the way of hook working experience.

I'd also suggest finding an experienced keeper to work with - you can practice all you want; but, unless you have somebody to point out what you are doing wrong, you won't know until you get bitten.
 
I read on another thread a copperhead or pygmy rattle snake would by good starters but I'm leaning towards the copperhead. I just ordered a snake hook it should be here by Monday. A guy I get a bunch of my snakes from has copperheads & rattlers & said he'd help me but he just got out of the snake business. He's the one that I got the honduran from. I've been trying to find someone close to teach me but haven't had any luck yet.
 
I know my thoughts on this matter aren't necessarily the ones most will express, but it doesn't really change just because the topic shifts to hots. Pick your snakes based on what interests you, not on what somebody else suggests.
There's not really much sense in getting a copperhead as a "starter", if your real interest lies with cobras, rattlesnakes, arboreals, whatever. Yes - a copperhead is an easy venomous species to keep, and the bite is not likely to be fatal......but that doesn't help you build experience toward keeping other species.
Unfortunately, there are relatively few nonvenomous snakes that serve as good trainers. The most important thing for you, as one who intends to start working with hots, is to become very aware of what you are doing. There are so many things that we do routinely that can result in a bite, and it is of major importance to break those bad habits. I saw a great post a number of years ago regarding this - I'll try to dig it up and repost it.
 
that would be great if you could. i eventually wanna get into rattlesnakes & possibly coral snakes. the reason for getting a copperhead as a first hot is because they dont strike as fast as a rattlesnake & their venom isnt as potent. i dont want to just jump into rattlesnakes & find that their too much to handle. i wanna take steps towards owning rattlesnakes. i did the same thing with non-venomous snakes i started out with docile species like balls & corns & worked my way up towards more aggressive snakes like emerald tree boas & chondros.
 
You want a hot thats is going to be forgiving if you make a mistake? Well, there isnt one.
Believe me, I was in your shoes about a year ago. To help "train" to get a hot I was handling the nastiest blood python that I could find. I thought I was ready, so I then got my first venemous snake, which was a southern copperhead. Though they are not as fast as rattlers, they are still extrememly fast, and will tag you at every chance that they get. And the bite can become fatal.
Just remember, there are no venemous snakes with "training wheels", and at any second they can and will try to bite you. It sure is a rush to handle a hot though. lol
 
i know that no hot is forgiving, what i ment by a copperhead being forgiving was that while they can be deadly rattlesnake venom is much more toxic. i also dont want to get an exotic hot because the antivenom for most if not all exotics are in florida which is quite aways from ohio. copperheads are also found in ohio so when i do get tagged the antivenom would get to me alot faster. ive been giving this some thought for about a year now, i dont wanna rush into it & get in over my head.
 
M_MULLINS said:
that would be great if you could. i eventually wanna get into rattlesnakes & possibly coral snakes. the reason for getting a copperhead as a first hot is because they dont strike as fast as a rattlesnake & their venom isnt as potent. i dont want to just jump into rattlesnakes & find that their too much to handle. i wanna take steps towards owning rattlesnakes. i did the same thing with non-venomous snakes i started out with docile species like balls & corns & worked my way up towards more aggressive snakes like emerald tree boas & chondros.
Click to expand...

This was exactly the point I was trying to make earlier - working with a copperhead won't get you ready for a rattlesnake. I've made this comment (in this, or similar form) several times, but nothing acts like a pi$$ed off rattlesnake on a hook...except a pi$$ed off rattlesnake on a hook. You can keep a copperhead for 5 uneventful years, and all it will do is lull you into a false sense of security. As soon as your first rattlesnake throws itself off the hook, you'll say Oh :censored:, and wonder what you got yourself into. Then you'll do what you have to do. You'll probably have some close calls - hopefully be lucky - and learn from your mistakes.
As I said, the best training is to recognize the bad habits, and see how many potential bite situations there really are...and avoid them, of course.


Coral snakes are harder to keep, but easier to work (IMO) than copperheads or rattlesnakes. There are far fewer successful keepers of corals. You may want to consider that part if you are seriously leaning in that direction.




The piece I referred to earlier was on a now defunct forum. I'm not positive, but I think it may have been posted here. My initial searches didn't find it, so when I have time I'll have to comb the thread list (thinking it was in 2005 or 2006, but I could be wrong).
 
Ok thanks for the info. Ill probably just go ahead & get a rattlesnake then. I want to get a copperhead still because I love the color & pattern on them. What species of rattler would you suggest I get? I want something that'snot gonna get more than 4ft.
 
What species of rattler would you suggest I get?
Click to expand...
If you were close enough, I'd reach out and smack you, lol. If you'd been paying attention, you'd know that my response is What kind of rattlesnake do you like?
 
Matt

If it is going to be another year or two before you get a hot, no need to order the hook now.
I echo what Harald is saying, find out what YOU want to work with, then proceed.

Once you choose the snake you want someday to own, take time for the safety stuff: Where will it be housed? Will the room be locked? Will the cage be locked? Do you have kids in the house? What will you do if a buddy comes over and wants to handle your snake?

Check out your local hospital and make sure they have the antivenin for your type of snake. If you do get a bite, time can be of the essence.
 
Lol sorry man. I'm probably gonna get a pygmy because of the size. Where would be a good place to buy them? The closest reptile show doesn't sell venomous snakes.
 
I've already thought about all that stuff. It will be housed in the basement in a seperate room from my other snakes. The room itself won't be locked but the basement door will be along with the cage. I do have kids which is why the basement door & the cage will be locked. If a buddy comes over & wants to handle it my answer will be F*** NO!!, & if they want me to get it out so they can see it its not gonna happen. If they want to see it they can look at it through the glass. I haven't got a chance to call around to find a hospital that carries antivenom but when I do find one I'm gonna put the number on the tank so that when I do get bit I can call so everything should be set up by the time I get to the hospital.
 
lucille said:
Matt

If it is going to be another year or two before you get a hot, no need to order the hook now.
Click to expand...
I'm inclined to disagree, Lucille. "NOW" isn't a requirement; but if he's interested in working with hots, he should become proficient with the tools & relearn everything from a "hands off" perspective. Even though nothing acts like a pi$$ed off rattlesnake on a hook, he should definitely get used to using hooks for routine chores - moving snakes and cage items, opening and closing cage doors, etc. If he isn't comfortable doing the mundane stuff with a hook, he's got no business putting a rattlensake on the other end of one. For the sake of safety, using hooks should be second nature by the time the venomous snake comes.

Hooks are a matter of taste, though if you are starting out, you quickly get used to what you have. Midwest makes some incredible hooks that are very lightweight. I learned with hooks made by a friend (from the shafts of old golf clubs)...they're bulky in comparison to a lot of the stuff out there, but I've been using them for nearly 20 yrs. I played around with some of the fancy stuff a few years ago, while contemplating a purchase - real nice, but they just didn't feel right to me. I stuck with my old ones.
If you have the opportunity - go to a show and try out some of the hooks that are available. Find a couple that feel good to you (I also suggest having a couple on hand - possibly in slightly different lengths, or with different shaped hooks. I'd stick with comparable items, though, so they have a similar feel). You might want to think about getting a tong, as well - I don't like them for manipulating snakes; but they're great for removing water bowls, hides, or other cage items.
18 inch hemostats are another item I'd recommend. They come in 24", but none of the ones I've seen in that size range have grooved jaws; which means that you won't have the same grip. Dropping things sucks.
 
I was looking at a site lastnight that was from another post that sold tongs & hooks. I was originally planning on getting both so that I could move the snake & if it somehow got off the hook I could grab it with the tongs but, decided not to use the tongs for that because I don't want to grab the snake too fast & injure it.
 
If you've got any venomous snakes native to your general area, the local hospitals should have (or be able to quickly access) the appropriate antivenom - as long as you are sticking with copperheads and/or US rattlesnakes.

I had typed out a post about shipping, but I'm not sure what happened (I might have closed it out instead of submitting it, when I went to eat dinner).
If you aren't buying local, be prepared for shipping costs. Delta is the only option for venomous, and DASH is preferred over cargo (DASH puts the snake on a definite schedule, so you know when it will be there. Cargo/freight goes when they have space. It's usually fairly timely, but - when that was a common option - I had a couple experiences with 2 to 3 day delays, which should be deemed unacceptable under current standards). Figure around $100-125 for DASH, plus a $25 box charge from most venomous shippers (for the specially constructed, and required, box)
 
Ok ill just find somebody local to buy them from. The guy I get most of my snakes from can get them but he quit the snake business to take a break for a little. He was gonna teach me how to handle them with hooks but with him getting out of the business I'm gonna have to wait until he either gets back into it or I can find somebody else to teach me.
 
I agree 100% with what was said regaurding learning with an keeping what you are interested in. In my case it is arboreals, so I really had no interest in any of the native hots. Besides having to care for an animal you don't really want, one species really doesn't prepare you for another, they all will have their differences. On top of that, a bite from ANY viper can be potentially fatal.
Your gonna want 2 hooks at least. I prefer different leghths, and I never handle without a hook in each hand. I have a set of tongs, but I only use them to remove water dishes, ect. One thing that hasn't been mentioned that I would highly recomend is a set of tubes. When the time comes, and it will, that you have to restrain the animal for whatever reason, it's far safer for the pointy end to be in a plastic tube as opposed to your hand.
 
Twice you have mentioned "when" I get bit. That in itself is a little troubling.
Getting bit almost always involves YOU making a mistake and should not be considered an inevitable outcome. If you have already resigned yourself to being bitten mentally, the physical trauma is likely not too far ahead.
I aplaud you for taking it slow and steady as well as doing some basic research, however I would urge you to not resign yourself to eventually being bitton but rather concentrate all your efforts on understanding, practicing, and enforcing safe husbandry procedures.
Best of luck with your endeavors
 
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