raymond melrose bad guy

I made a deal with Raymond Melrose from Florida for a SUPER PURPLE Suriname. I told him I'd put money in the bank the next day and paypal it to him. Later that night he sold it out from under me to a guy locally to him for more money and offered me a less attractive snake. Does anybody have principles anymore? That is all.

Well,
He shouldn't be labelled as bad guy. He didn't rip you off. You didn't send him the money. He didn't receive your money. You just told him that you're going to put money in the bank the next day and Paypal him. What happens if you change your mind. Besides, it would be more convenience for him and better for the animal if he can sell it locally, and don't have to go through shipping. Unless he receive your money, and ship you a different, less attractive snake, you jump the gun here. Just my 2 cents.

Couple things here, Brandon:

First, you need to post your full name on each and every post here on the BOI. I you don't your postings can (will) be deleted, both good and bad.

Second, as a general rule, I look at it as "No money, no deal!" So, since you had not yet sent the money to this guy, he really had no ethical responsibility to hold it for you. Since he had no such responsibility, and he had received another bid on it, which was higher than yours, he probably should have contacted you first. Who knows, maybe you would have matched the offer, and he could have still sold it to you?!?!?

Finally, because there was no deal, you were not ripped off, and your only real complaint is that he was not courteous enough to give you a chance to meet the bid, I would suggest that a "BAD GUY" post may be to severe for the situation. Perhaps a thread in the General Business Discussion forum would be more appropriate? That way, you can make your point about courtesy without staining the reputation of a man who did you no real harm.

Better luck on your next deal!

The one thing that I am unclear on is whether or not Mr Melrose commited to holding the snake. If he explicitly promised to hold it, then sold it to another customer, then I would say question the ethics involved.

Brandon Fischer, sorry.
I never said I was ripped off, but what happened to me was unethical. I had emailed Raymond saying I would buy it. He said, great, it's yours, and gave me his email address to paypal $$ to him. When I woke up the next morning he had emailed me saying he sold it to somebody else. I think that is just wrong and that's why I started this thread. As far as the 'no money, no deal' goes, in my opinion, that is greed speaking. I sell things online from time to time and I have a 24 hour good faith policy. Maybe I'm just a gentleman. *shrugs. How I see it is that somebody emailed him after I commited myself to it, he said, sorry, sale pending. The other person said I'll give you more for it. He figuratively said "f**k Brandon'' and sold it to somebody else before I even woke up. This wasn't an auction! If this were E-bay the bidding would have been closed! It's sad to see greed in such a peaceful hobby.

I have to side with Brandon on this one.

Something similar happened to me very recently, but not in relation to buying herps. I contacted someone via email about buying an item from him. He responded around 10am with his phone number, but said not to bother calling the rest of the day because he would be out all day. I emailed him back that afternoon saying I definitely wanted that item and would try to call the following day.

When I awoke the next morning, I had an email in my inbox saying he had sold the item to someone else.

It's a matter of perspective, I guess. Sure, he didn't have the money in hand, and certainly he had probably had his share of people that did not come through in the past. But dang it, there should be such a thing as common courtesy. He could have told the other guy he had a pending sale and would like to check that first before going any further. The fact that he specifically told me not to bother trying to contact him resulted in my not being able to complete the sale in a timely fashion, not through any delay or stalling on my part.

This sort of thing just generates bad blood. I don't care if the guy was offering $20 bills for $10, he will never get my business. If someone does not consider their word to be their bond, then I am certain that other aspects of the way they do business would be just as unsatisfactory to me.

So Brandon, maybe this was best for you. Just ignore anything else the guy offers for sale. If enough people do that, he will either change the way he does business or be out of business.

Being offered more money for an item that has already been committed, and reneging on the prior sale because of it, is a huge breach of ethics. Certainly I would never trust the guy's word again.

Not that I do tons of deals online, but in the past six months I've had four deals basically end up like what happen here. I emailed the person with the Ad(s) made an offer to purchase, offer was accepted. Only to be told later that the animal(s) were sold locality. And this is after I've gone to the Post Office and had money orders made out to the Sellers. One was actually mailed, and returned un-opened.
I didn't post any "Bad Guy" inquires, but boy I wanted to.
Also, just to be honest, I've had ads posted myself, with people making me offers to purchase. I've held the animal(s) waiting for payment that never came. So my point? I think we need to come up with some kind of guide lines that will benefit both buyers and sellers. I don't wish to hold animals pending payment that never comes, but then again, I don't want to send payment for animals I will never get.
What, if any policies do the larger Internet dealers go by on someone wishing to purchase? Do you give them twenty four hours to pay via PayPal? Seven days to send a money order or Check? Maybe we can follow your lead?

After that clarification, I gotta agree with Brandon. If an animal/item is promised to a customer, it shouldn't be sold out from underneath them before they have a chance to fulfill their end of the deal.

"He said, great, it's yours..."

If that is what he said, then honor demands that he keep his word. It is a question of a man (or woman) being honest.

When I said that my policy is basically, "No money, no deal," I meant that I do not say, "Great, it's yours" until the money (at least a deposit) is in my hand. If that makes me mercenary, well I guess I may be. However, I've just had too many people say, "Hold it for me and I'll get the PayPal to you tomorrow!" only to never hear from them again. So, I'll hold an animal for you, but only after some consideration (money) has made it my way.

Given the givens here, though, Brandon I'd have to say that you were wronged by this individual's lack of ethics. I will sell a snake if a higher offer comes in before I get a deposit from someone, but I will go back to the first "bidder" to see if he wants to match that higher offer. But, I never say "it's yours" until it's sold, and it isn't sold until I get some money. At least, that's my general practice, I might ease up with someone I know really well, but not a stranger.

Although the seller MAY be wrong, does he deserve the label BAD GUY?