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Can the BOI be improved?

mxracer4life

mxracer4life

"Daniel Boone"
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It seems to me that it would take some of the hassle out of the BOI if it was required to post atleast some proof when posting a Bad Guy thread. Do you agree? How many times has someone posted a "Bad Guy" thread and no proof was posted? How many times did the OP get jumped for not providing proof? I see a lot of back and forth bickering between people when the OP does not post the needed proof. I also feel that if someone is going to post a bad guy thread, there should be proof to back that clame up. It is usually there intention to let others know how there experience was, possible effecting the bad guy in questions future business here on the internet. What if there is no proof? It is too easy to lie on the internet. Here are the things I feel should be required.

1. Copy of available communication (text, email etc)
2. Pictures (if subject requires them)
3. Time line of transaction
 
I do agree somewhat, and I think it's wrong to jump the gun on a person when no real proof has been given. But I also think that there are quite a few bad guy threads that get turned around on the OP, and show them to be someone that many people would rather not do business with.
 
Payara said:
Jeremey
Click to expand...

I've been called worse, it's ok.

Payara said:
How would you suggest enforcing it???
Click to expand...


I haven't decided how it could be enforced. To me, the simple solution would be if there is no proof, or at least not enough proof to continue forward, then delete the thread. If I remember correctly, thats how it is set up now. If someone doesn't follow the current BOI rules there thread is removed right?
 
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Respectfully, another point of view:

Weight the BOI post in your own mind depending on what proof is available. A bare accusation with no more might not be weighted heavily, and an account with emails, timelines, etc might be more persuasive.
A youngster buying a critter from a pet shop or expo that dies the next day might not have a lot of proof beyond his own account and maybe a picture.
But readers might be able to form a valid opinion of whether it is a husbandry issue or a sick critter depending on description of symptoms and timelines.
A bare accusation from someone who you think ought to have more, might turn back on the accuser, and that might be valuable info, letting other parties choose not to do business with him.
Proof is always better and should be encouraged.


mxracer4life said:
or at least not enough proof to continue forward
Click to expand...

I think this puts too much on the mods, to judge how much is enough. No matter what decision is made, one side or the other will disagree.
 
lucille said:
Respectfully, another point of view:

Weight the BOI post for yourself, depending on what proof is available. A bare accusation with no more might not be weighted heavily, and an account with emails, timelines, etc might be more persuasive.
A kid buying a critter from a pet shop or expo that dies the next day might not have a lot of proof beyond his own account and maybe a picture.
But readers might be able to form a valid opinion depending on description of symptoms and timelines.
Proof is always better and should be encouraged. <--- I agree

I think this puts too much on the mods, to judge how much is enough. No matter what decision is made, one side or the other will disagree.
Click to expand...

This is true and I appreciate your point of view, as that is what this thread is about.

There has to be someway to help it become more of what I see the BOI being. A place where someone can go, read over the information given and make there decision from that. Knowing, that the information given has proven one way or another if they should deal with someone or not. Lately, it just seems messy. It has for awhile, and I know there isn't much Rich can do on his side, its on those that are posting/replying to the threads. I believe the BOI could be better, and when it does move forward I think it will help everyone out more. Before I posted this thread, I did talk to Rich. He told me to put something in the feedback forum and see where it goes. Maybe there is something that can be done, maybe there isn't. Its just been on my mind a lot lately to see what could be done.
 
Jeremy. perhaps, given your interest, you might consider the development of a BOI form which would be encouraged but not required, or where unknowns would simply mean blank spaces on the form. It could serve as a guide to those new to the site as to what sorts of documentation might be meaningful in presenting their side.
I agree that a more organized approach might help, but would never want those who are new or young and who bought 'in person' without any writing, to not have a forum to address their issues.
 
Jeremy, I think I see where you going with this, but that does seem like extra moderation to enforce it. The way it is now, it's basically enforced by the readers (Fauna members). If someone comes with no proof and throws out all kinds of accusations--and especially if any end up being proven false--the OP is shown to be the one not to do business with. Sometimes both sides show me that I never want their business.

I once thought it'd be nice if there were a way to change the label (BG, GG, Inq, Info) after a case was made, but I've since decided that I really prefer to make up my own mind by what I read, not just what label is in front of the name. I'm not opposed to what you're suggesting; however, I do feel like it's a pretty good system, as is.
 
lucille said:
Jeremy. perhaps, given your interest, you might consider the development of a BOI form which would be encouraged but not required, or where unknowns would simply mean blank spaces on the form. It could serve as a guide to those new to the site as to what sorts of documentation might be meaningful in presenting their side.
I agree that a more organized approach might help, but would never want those who are new or young and who bought 'in person' without any writing, to not have a forum to address their issues.
Click to expand...

Thats a very good idea. Like a BOI class? A specific forum on BOI edicate?
 
mxracer4life said:
Thats a very good idea. Like a BOI class? A specific forum on BOI edicate?
Click to expand...

More than that. You could make an optional form (with an introductory explanation) which would serve as a guide to those wanting to post, those who wished could use your form, but everyone would get a better idea of what was expected because the form might serve as a template for those who want to talk about their transactions on the BOI.
Frinstance:

GG/BG
One paragraph overview of why the post is being initiated
When did problem (or good qualities, for a GG post) originate
List each issue
Emails in order with responses by other party
Pictures/videos
Acceptable solutions
Informed other party yes/no Date and how other party informed

Jeremy I like the way you analyzed what you thought about the BOI, I think you could develop a good form because you are so organized.
 
This form idea sounds like a great one. And especially for those that are newer to the site, and might be more intimidated to call out someone. Could certainly help anyone that wanted to be sure not to leave out important details.
 
lucille said:
Jeremy I like the way you analyzed what you thought about the BOI, I think you could develop a good form because you are so organized.
Click to expand...

Thank you Lucille. But I am having trouble just coming up with something. I need everyone's help. I love your idea Lucille. But to add something, what if this information appeared as a link that popped up when a new thread was started in the BOI? Not like a pop up, but a link that appears at the top of the messege/reply section each time a reply or new thread in the BOI is created. Giving you the option to choose that link to read over this given information before making a post. If you don't want to read it, or have already, delete it so it doesn't show up under your post. Unless there is a way the link would just disappear after posting?
 
I like the idea of the form. However, based on other things I've read on the forums recently, there are a lot of people that just ignore that stuff and assume that they are above the guidelines and rules that everyone else has to follow. But a form would be a good start.

When you hit the new "boi button", you're taken to a page that explains it. I think it would be helpful to have something similar for making a thread in the boi.
 
OK, so what happens to such threads when someone posts them and does not provide the required "proof"?

Who gets to choose what is proof and what is not?

How would the above person or persons know whether the proof was truthful or forged? ANYTHING can be counterfeited these days, and some people are better than others at it.

Supposed the OP claims the proof is not factual and is in fact contrived simply to appear as the required proof? What then?

Seriously guys, look at the number of threads on the BOI. It would require a full time job for someone to try to authenticate and verify every statement made that is presented as proof of their claims and counterclaims.

Which is why I did not even attempt to go this route from the very beginning. It just is not feasible to do.

So the concept was, and still is, that anyone can really post anything they want to. It is simply up to the readership to make up their own minds about the factual content of what it is they are reading. If someone posts something they claim as proof, it is STILL up to the readers to determine if what they are seeing is genuine or bogus. As some may have noticed, there is quite a severe risk of blowback to anyone who tries to drive a dump truck full of BS past this crowd.

Sorry, but we just cannot filter out the lies, deception, and errors in statements made for you. We cannot even attempt to do that, because in the attempt, there would be an implied verification of everything that is posted here simply because it IS here and we stated that we would verify all proof.

No, we cannot, and will not, even attempt such folly.

As for a form or format to follow, who is going to force people to actually read such a thing? Are we going to just delete all BOI entries that do not comply? Do you think that would fly very well around here?

Yeah, I know some things may sound good on paper, but when you get down to the details of implementing them and the work and resources that would be necessary for such implementation, well, you might find yourself quite relieved that YOU aren't the one who would have to do that work around here. When that thought pops into your mind, THAT is the reason it has not already been implemented.
 
RubberDuckey273 said:
When you hit the new "boi button", you're taken to a page that explains it. I think it would be helpful to have something similar for making a thread in the boi.
Click to expand...

Sounds a lot like the Rules for posting on the BOI thread. It's one of the ones stuck at the top. Wanna count a show of hands to see how many people in this thread have familiarized themselves with the content? (I'll admit it could probably stand to be updated, as some of the rules have changed, but the basics are there)
 
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