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Bad Guy pat kline (Luxurious leopards)

pigslayer

pigslayer

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i just did a trade with pat kline,i sent 40 babies with me getting 3 double het radars and a halloween mask x emerine x boldstripe baby.ok he had to have the babies in time to take to the myrtle beach show so i sent them even though it was hot out,and they arrived ok and he said everyone was fine when they arrived.he couldnt ship the same week as me cause he was going to the show so we settled on the following monday or tuesday.i believe it was monday night he said he didnt want to ship because of high temps so he put it off till the next monday which was 2 days ago.they arrived yesterday like this 2 of the 3 het radars

skinny het radar #1.jpg

skinny het radar #2.jpg

come to find out 1 of these laid eggs a few days earlier,i asked for pics before we did this trade and this is his response


what might you have to trade for baby lot,send me some pics of them,and we can go from there,really interested in the het radars(babies or adults)and do you have any g project baby males?
you can send the pics by phone or to my email [email protected]

We have 4 het RADAR proven gals ($175 each trade value). I would take shots but they are normal looking. As far as Gproject, we do have males/females but they are cash only no trades as of yet on them. Let me know what you think
pat

he didnt want to ship because not because of temps but he wanted those eggs.
here is our conversation on facebook after they arrived

YesterdaySent from ChatPat Kline
all arrived good?

YesterdaySent from ChatJeremy Gambrel
did u get my text

YesterdaySent from ChatPat Kline
not much signal here at work

YesterdaySent from ChatJeremy Gambrel
ok all arrived two of the het radars are scary skinny,the emerine cross looks good and there was no granite aft

YesterdaySent from ChatPat Kline
one het laid just 5 days ago, so i would expect her to need some weight. but i didnt think any are scary looking
i totally forgot the granite i appologize

YesterdaySent from ChatPat Kline
one het laid just 5 days ago, so i would expect her to need some weight. but i didnt think any are scary looking
i totally forgot the granite i appologize

YesterdaySent from ChatJeremy Gambrel
anytime ones tail gets to the size of a pencil i start to worry

YesterdaySent from ChatPat Kline
those were not the size of a pencil

YesterdaySent from ChatJeremy Gambrel
one of them is very close

YesterdaySent from ChatPat Kline
they were excellent breeders

YesterdaySent from ChatJeremy Gambrel
ok im cool with them as long as they make it,what are we going to do about the granite,can u give me site credit for that

pats response
Ya ill throw $50 your way
they love supers and crickets, im sure with good feeding they will be good
pat was going to send me a granite aft for not being able to ship when said he was going to guess what no granite and he wants to give me credit of 50 dollars wow right granites for 50 bucks
i tried to squash this with pat askn for cash for the two het radars and the granite he declined i was askn him for 150 a piece on the het radars which trade value was 175 and 50 for granite,he declined wanting to send some babies back for the two scary skinny ones,i dont want anything else that comes outta his place
 
i said i was cool with them and got home from work and picked these two up and all i felt was ribs super skinny
 
First off I never declined to you sending those 2 back you were unhappy for and giving you the value in babies back(shipping some babies back). You also have not added that you knew they stopped layign only 1 1/2 to 2 months ago, but they already are eating like champs for you(per your word) These gals originated from AMgeckos, laid 8 clutches each, and proved out multiple times in their breedings. You tried to blackmail me into sending you cash so you wouldnt come here, but im sorry i do not work that way. I also offered you pics, but you never asked after I offered.
As far as the granite goes, that was a courtesy of me since you were impatient on shipping. You wanted me to ship on a 92-94 degree day, and only after offering you a granite did you accept the small wait. Yes I did forget and appologized, heck ill still send it if you want. People make mistakes and forget things.
so after trying numerous options to making you satisfied you declined, what would you like me to do. There are numerous videos of my collection, and i dare you to find a gecko in the vids that are sickly looking.
 
Not taking sides here but that gecko doesn't look anywhere near "scary skinny". It's not the obese sausage most adult leos are but it's certainly not missing any meals.
 
And for the record I dont really care about the 2 eggs she laid. Heck you can have them when they hatch if you want. I have placed many options on the table jeremy, what would you like to do. Im trying to make you satified with the trade, but you just are being difficult to work with here.
 
Alex G said:
Not taking sides here but that gecko doesn't look anywhere near "scary skinny". It's not the obese sausage most adult leos are but it's certainly not missing any meals.
Click to expand...

I have to agree. Yes, they could put on some more weight, but they're not that skinny at all.
 
I wanted to add that I did a trade with Pat. Everything went well and there were no problems.

I would not ship on any day where the high temp is 90+.
 
They just look a little thin from breeding. Feed them supers for a couple of weeks and those tails will plump back up quickly.

When you don't get photos and current weights it's hard to know exactly what to expect. That's why it's always best to get those.

I agree with Kristi regarding shipping.
 
Better information would have been key on the weights of those geckos. As for the granite 50 dollars is not acceptable when they go for well over that. Is the granite a proven genetic by any chance or is it just a pattern thing? I think a better deal needs to be met to get this set right.
 
hoppingherps said:
Better information would have been key on the weights of those geckos. As for the granite 50 dollars is not acceptable when they go for well over that. Is the granite a proven genetic by any chance or is it just a pattern thing? I think a better deal needs to be met to get this set right.
Click to expand...

The monetary value of the granite is not a issue here. The granite was a gift for jeremy to accept not shipping in extreme heat. So basically I offered it to him to not push for me to ship in 94 degree weather. Do granite go for more then that, yes. This was a juvenile, and no im not giving some full price for a gecko i mistakenly forgot just to keep the other geckos safe.

Jeremy was aware they needed a bit more weight, in fact we chatted about them on the phone and he was just concerned with breeding them in the fall. Bottom line these geckos were just shipped this thread is a bit premature. I placed alot of options on jeremys lap and he basically spit in my face for them all and only wanted cash. I really dont see how im the "bad guy" here.

PS-jeremy I know your reading this. Please stop with your sarcastic text messages. If you cannot deal with issues like a professional, then we are not willing to comprimise in making you happy with your order.
 
snared99 said:
The monetary value of the granite is not a issue here. The granite was a gift for jeremy to accept not shipping in extreme heat. So basically I offered it to him to not push for me to ship in 94 degree weather.
Click to expand...

Are you paying for the shipping on The Granite?
 
Serafim said:
Are you paying for the shipping on The Granite?
Click to expand...

The granite was to be shipped with the order, but i forgot to add her. Jeremy wants cash for everything so at the moment there is no shipping. Plus why would I now send someone a gift for coming on here and bashing me before getting a chance to make it right? Even though I do not beleive those animals are as bad as he claims.
 
snared99 said:
The granite was to be shipped with the order, but i forgot to add her. Jeremy wants cash for everything so at the moment there is no shipping. Plus why would I now send someone a gift for coming on here and bashing me before getting a chance to make it right? Even though I do not beleive those animals are as bad as he claims.
Click to expand...
I did not read it as him bashing you.. I do think the thread was a bit premature.. But regardless of what has been posted you did offer the gecko and have made that clear to the readers. You should honor the gift...
 
The offer stands if he wants the granite I will gladly send it, but he has made it clear through texts he wants no animals. So there will most likley be no solution.
 
I think Pat is in the clear here, and as of yet, Jeremy's posting of this thread is entirely unwarranted. I have 4 incoming shipments of ball pythons delayed this past month due to the heat on both sides of the transaction. I also believe that if Pat is willing to rectify the granite by sending it to Jeremy, at no additional cost since he forgot it in the first place, all is good on his end. The geckos don't appear(to my limited knowledge) to be overly thin.

I find it rather appalling that Jeremy thinks it reasonable to want to keep the ones he claims to be "scary skinny" AND be entitled to a partial refund of ONLY $150 each(hope I read that part right). That's just scammer-ish, IMO. Jeremy, you should be more appreciative that Pat wouldn't send out your geckos in extreme heat. And if he is willing to send you the granite(on his dime), you should take it or leave it, end of story. A credit on his site seems to be a fair offer as well, but any monetary exchange is not called for.
 
I can see how Jeremy would be peeved to say the least. He did his due diligence, sent out his end of the trade on Pat’s schedule, waited patiently for his turn, and then got the short end of the stick. He didn't even get his free gift as promised.

He asked for pictures, but Pat declined saying “I would take shots but they are normal looking.” Who cares if they are are “normal” the customer wanted to see them. This to me implies Pat was hiding something. Either he didn’t want Jeremy to see that they were gravid and that he was planning on keeping the eggs, or he didn’t want Jeremy to see that they weren’t at an attractive weight. It’s a bit suspect. Not that the leos are on death’s door, but I would be upset too if I were in Jeremy’s position.

Moving on, I think that Pat owes Jeremy the granite AFT or a fair market value for it as credit. Since no money was involved in this trade, it really shouldn’t come in as factor after the fact. But since it was Pat’s error forgetting the animal in the original package, he should have to eat the cost of shipping. That’s just my opinion though. If Jeremy doesn’t want anything to do with Pat then the deal is done as it is now and the two can go their separate ways.
 
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