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Enlighten me about lessers

Would you say that was a lesser if I told you I produced her, and held her back?
 
thanks for the info, links and pictures (really enjoying the pictures!)

Lesser's get lighter as they age or do they stay pretty much the same as their baby colors?

My initial though is that butter and lesser are the same morph just established through different lines since it lays on the same allele however the mojave also making a BEL with a lesser or butter is then throwing me off. I assume butter/lesser x mojave you would get BELs, lessers/butters *and* mojaves? Is that right?

Or is it possible mojave is the same gene as well? Lessers/butters are for fading color and mojaves are the big round alien heads... correct? so they are different?

Also, what traits do you look for in an 'ideal' lesser?
 
AbsoluteApril said:
Or is it possible mojave is the same gene as well? Lessers/butters are for fading color and mojaves are the big round alien heads... correct?
Click to expand...
Some of the mojave and lesser combinations look very similar...but not all.
For example, a mojave phantom is definitely much different looking than a lesser phantom.
purple passion (mojave phantom)
017.jpg


karma (lesser phantom)
001.jpg



Also, what traits do you look for in an 'ideal' lesser?
Click to expand...
No :censored: spots


edit - pics from WOBP
 
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AbsoluteApril said:
mojaves are the big round alien heads... correct?
Click to expand...

Mine (MINE!!) takes offense to that statement.
attachment.php


This girl is less offended, because she does have some of the spotting, but she doesn't believe that she has big round alien heads (and she would prefer that people don't focus on the ones she does have)
attachment.php
 
Most mojaves do have alien heads and ugly spots...I'm just much more partial to the ones that show a reduction of those features, and hope to gradually produce more of the type that I like.
This is all about me, after all - at least as far as my breeding projects are concerned.
 
OMG Harald that first mojo in your last post made me drool. When she goes, I wanna have her babies. Literally. No I'm serious....LOL
 
If they look like her, they'll be staying for my own use, lol...any mojaves from her litter that hit the market will be the ones that didn't make the team.
 
I barely have enough love for my own snakes, Mark...
but, mixing pastel and keeping "no spots" is worth some admiration.
 
snakesRkewl said:
Your welcome Mike,
My personal opinion is they are different lines of the same snake, compatible in every way, but look slightly different :shrug01:
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link!

Well, that pretty much clinches it for me. Yeah, there's still a chance they're different morphs (if the Platty gene interacts similarly with any gene on the same allele as the Butter/Lesser, for example), but it looks to me like they're just different lines of the same morph.

AbsoluteApril said:
Lesser's get lighter as they age or do they stay pretty much the same as their baby colors?
Click to expand...

I think it just depends. Mine started out very yellow and faded so they're now more of a bronze/beige/green.

My initial though is that butter and lesser are the same morph just established through different lines since it lays on the same allele however the mojave also making a BEL with a lesser or butter is then throwing me off. I assume butter/lesser x mojave you would get BELs, lessers/butters *and* mojaves? Is that right?

Or is it possible mojave is the same gene as well? Lessers/butters are for fading color and mojaves are the big round alien heads... correct? so they are different?
Click to expand...

Since the Butter gene appears to interact with the Platty gene the same way Lessers do, then yeah, I think they're different lines of the same morph.

Just because it's on the same allele doesn't mean it's a different line of the same morph. Mojaves, as you mentioned, are not the same morph at all. Neither are the other BEL-complex morphs (Mocha, Russo). Same allele but not the same gene.
 
R. Eventide said:
Thanks for the link!

Well, that pretty much clinches it for me. Yeah, there's still a chance they're different morphs (if the Platty gene interacts similarly with any gene on the same allele as the Butter/Lesser, for example), but it looks to me like they're just different lines of the same morph.
Click to expand...

See, the thing for me that says that they're the same thing. Take a bunch of butters and a bunch of lessers - put them all together and ask people to separate them correctly. I may be wrong, but I don't believe anyone can be 100% confident that they can pull any snake out of a bucket of lessers and butters and definitively say what they pulled was a lesser or butter.

Or, breed a Butter/Lesser BEL and then decide which babies are lessers and which are butters.
 
rabernet said:
Or, breed a Butter/Lesser BEL and then decide which babies are lessers and which are butters.
Click to expand...
We should be doing that soon enough if the male lesser/butter BEL gets a little more size on him.
I'm not so sure this will solve anything though, the butter we used is obviously different than the lesser used in the breeding, they look very different from each other.
 
AbsoluteApril said:
no one wants to point out what they think makes 'an ideal lesser' (besides no spots)?
Click to expand...
The first lesser female I posted is pretty close to my ideal - I purchased her because of her pattern. I like her overall look, but her color could be a bit better.

It's kind of disappointing that the first mojave female I posted is under-appreciated by the masses...good thing she is staying here. Funny thing is, it seems a number of people like her better when they think she's a lesser - morph snobbery?? Have mojaves become the redheaded stepchildren of the BP world? (no secret I like redheads, so I don't care). Personally, if she were a lesser, I couldn't get her out the door fast enough (SPOTS). She may not be close to the ideal mojave - so I can understand the weak response - but I still like her...and hope that she'll help bring me that much closer to some really awesome looking mojaves in the future.
 
hhmoore said:
The first lesser female I posted is pretty close to my ideal - I purchased her because of her pattern. I like her overall look, but her color could be a bit better.

It's kind of disappointing that the first mojave female I posted is under-appreciated by the masses...good thing she is staying here. Funny thing is, it seems a number of people like her better when they think she's a lesser - morph snobbery?? Have mojaves become the redheaded stepchildren of the BP world? (no secret I like redheads, so I don't care). Personally, if she were a lesser, I couldn't get her out the door fast enough (SPOTS). She may not be close to the ideal mojave - so I can understand the weak response - but I still like her...and hope that she'll help bring me that much closer to some really awesome looking mojaves in the future.
Click to expand...
I actually like her better knowing that she's a mojave:)
 
hhmoore said:
If they look like her, they'll be staying for my own use, lol...any mojaves from her litter that hit the market will be the ones that didn't make the team.
Click to expand...

No thats just selfish! hahahaha Just kidding. That mojo is SMOKIN!!!! Did you produce her (it is a girl, correct?)... if not where did you get her? What do her parents look like?
 
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