knoxpython
New member
I am posting this because I want all of the members of this forum to be aware of doing business with Andy Jones, aka The Pied Python out of Texas. After seeing his ad on this site for a pair of Captive Bred Timor pythons that he was willing to trade I was intrigued. I contacted him, searched the forum for any red flags, and agreed to trade a 2012 ivory ball python male and a 2010 pastel female ball for his supposedly captive bred timor pythons. I asked him what they were eating, about their health, and if they were indeed captive bred animals. He stated that they were problem free, captive bred animals with no mites and no disease. He said they were thriving and had been in his collection for over a year. I agreed on the trade and we agreed to ship on the same day (9/11 for 9/12 delivery.) I shipped thru Reptiles Express, sent his confirmation of shipping orders and he shipped directly with Fedex and sent me the same.
Fast forward to this morning and I received an e-mail from Fedex and Reptiles Express saying my package was undeliverable. I contacted Debbie who got in touch with them directly and they stated the address was bogus. I tried calling Andy to no avail and waited, hoping my shipment would arrive and I had not been scammed. Along comes 10:20 and I receive my Timor pythons from Fedex. I opened the box and found snake #1 to be a mite ridden mess of a Timor with cloudy eyes and fine scars all over the body. I then opened sack two and found snake #2 to be literally overrun with mites so bad that they were crawling all over my arms, each arm having around 50 mites. This snake was also scarred and had a blunt tail tip. I was extremely disappointed in the animals because they were crawling with mites so bad that the animals were constantly moving around in the bags. The shipping container even had mites coming out of it!!!
I then received a call from Debbie at Reptiles Express at 11:10 stating that Fedex could not get ahold of the recipient asking what I wanted to do. I told her to ship them back to me on my own dime because I could not afford for my snakes to ride around all day in a hot Fedex truck trying to find Andy. He obviously was not to be trusted and I did not want my snakes to go to an individual who obviously does not care about his animals and their well being.
He was also not returning calls from myself or Fedex. I then sent him the following e-mail:
Scott Bryan [email protected]
11:29 AM (2 hours ago)
to Andy
Andy,
I am composing this email to you because I am angry and wanted this conversation in writing. Needless to say I have received the Timors, opened the box, and was OVERWHELMED by the number of mites on these animals. I immediately took pictures as evidence of this and will gladly send them to you if you so desire. They are also scarred up and look NOTHING like a captive bred animal which was what was promised in the ad and our previous conversations. I cannot believe that you would ship animals in this condition AND advertise them as captive bred. These are animals which will require an immediate trip to the vet to be treated for parasites and this is NOT something I wanted in my collection. As I explained to you earlier in our conversations, I have a small colony of morph ball pythons, morph blood pythons, and carpet pythons that all have been in my possession for many years and were obtained as captive bred from various dealers. I would NEVER have agreed to this trade and sent you CAPTIVE BRED expensive animals for a couple of parasitized, wild caught timor pythons.
Another issue with this trade is that I have received notification from Fedex that you were unable for receipt of the ivory ball and pastel ball python I sent you. After talking to the rep on the phone for over 30 minutes, the address you sent me:
Andy Jones
c/o TMS Delivery
11140 Hwy. 64 E
Tyler, Texas 75605
appears to be a bogus address and now I have to deal with the fact that my disease and mite free captive bred animals are sitting in Texas in the heat. I am paying to have these animals returned to me. I care about my animals and take pride in sending them to people who I feel will take care of them, not someone who will let them deteriorate to the condition of the Timors you sent me.
I do NOT plan on stealing the Timors from you, I am not like that. I also will not put out any more of my money into this trade with you so you will be responsible for paying any return shipping. I also want you to reimburse me for the shipping on my snakes, if they alive back to me alive. If they do not, I want the FULL retail amount sent my way within 5 days.
You are welcome to call me and discuss this, right now I am going to take the timors to my parents house and get them the hell away from my stock before they drop snake mites everywhere. You have my number, 865-679-9534. Feel free to e-mail me back as well.
Scott Bryan
STP Reptiles
At 12:45 I receive a call from Andy threatening to "get the law after me" because he is retired law enforcement. He then states that I am committing shipping fraud. I explain to him that I want nothing to do with the Timors and that I had to make the call to have my snakes returned to me because he was unable to pick them up and no-one could get ahold of him this morning after multiple attempts. He accuses me of stopping shipment of my snakes to him, I explain that is not true. I ask him about the mites, scars, and general condition of the Timors and he accuses me of "putting mites on his animals." I then talk to him and explain that my animals are still out there, riding around in the Texas heat, and that I had to make the call to ship them back to me on my own dime because he was nowhere to be found. He tells me that he will not pay for return shipping of his animals and that if I do not he will "call the law." I explain my terms to him, tell him that he is the one who was not forthright in this trade, and that I will not ship back to him unless he pays me for my shipping and his return shipping. I also explain to him that he was the one who lied about his animals, he is the one who shipped mites to me, and he is the one who will foot the bill for my shipping, period. I think that is more than fair, he tried to rip me off, lied to me, and was caught with his pants down so to say. I followed up our telephone conversation with the following email:
Scott Bryan [email protected]
1:13 PM (1 hour ago)
to Andy
Andy,
Since we just talked I wanted to put everything in writing concerning our trade and what I expect from you. Since you are the one that misrepresented the animals in our trade and lied about the origin and parasites on the animals you are the one who is going to pay for the return shipping AND my shipping expenses on this trade. I do not appreciate you accusing me of putting mites on the animals and trying to steal from you. I also do not appreciate you threatening me with the law because you are a retired law enforcement official. I, like you claim to be, am an experienced individual in the reptile hobby and can easily spot mites on animals. You should have too, and you should never ship an animal to another hobbyist in the condition you shipped those animals to me. I also would NEVER have sent my animals on a trip to TEXAS and back, paying shipping both ways if it was going to a bogus address. Don't accuse me of shipping theft, I have proof and receipts that I shipped animals to you and I have proof that I am not the one who put a recall on the animals. I was notified this morning that Fedex had attempted delivery to the address you sent me and the address was invalid. I also copied that address in the original e-mail to you. For whatever reason, Fedex attempted to deliver these animals and the address is bogus, according to them. When I was notified of this, I tried to contact you to no avail and THEN made the decision to have the animals shipped back to me, on my own dime. I am thankful that you never received them because your facility is obviously crawling with mites and that is not something I would wish on my animals, or any animals for that matter.
Since you are obviously not to be trusted, the following will happen. I will wait for my animals return delivery tomorrow morning. If they are alive, I will send you a bill for the shipping both ways. I expect you to pay that and I will wait until I get a check that cashes for that amount before I return your animals. If they are dead, I will expect you to pay me the value of those animals in full which is $1400.00 plus whatever the shipping is determined to be. After one of those two scenarios happens, I will wait for you to send me a shipping label and I will happily ship you your wild caught, parasitized animals back.
Just to reiterate, I am not a thief and I did not stop shipment on my snakes in this deal. You are the one who misrepresented the animals in this trade, you are the one who will pay for my shipping expenses in this deal. You are also the one who will pay me in full for the value of my animals if they arrive dead tomorrow. You can threaten me all you want, but in return, if my animals arrive dead tomorrow and you refuse payment for them YOU will be the one who is in legal trouble.
I have absolutely zero desire to keep these timors in this shape. I am actually heading out this afternoon to pick up some mite spray because you obviously have no clue as to what a mite looks like or how to treat for them. I actually care for animals and these are uncomfortable, ill snakes that are in need of relief.
I am going to forward you pictures of the mites on the snakes, and on me as I opened the package this morning. I am also going to forward you the notification of failed delivery I received from Fedex this morning. These will prove that I did not stop shipment on these animals, and that they arrived in bad condition.
I only hope that when you receive the animals back that you take it upon yourself to treat them for mites again. If you object to me treating them for mites, please let me know asap and I will hold off. I consider these timors yours because of this trade gone bad. This is your fault. I am not a thief so do not accuse me of trying to steal your animals.
Sincerely,
Scott Bryan
I wanted everyone to be aware and NOT do business with this individual, he is a scammer and a rip off artist!!!
I will attempt to post pictures of the "captive bred timors" I was sent this morning. I also want everyone to know, again, that I am NOT trying to steal these animals from him but I am NOT paying for return shipping to this jerk.
I just hope that my snakes arrive back to me alive tomorrow morning.
Sincerely,
Scott Bryan
[email protected]
Fast forward to this morning and I received an e-mail from Fedex and Reptiles Express saying my package was undeliverable. I contacted Debbie who got in touch with them directly and they stated the address was bogus. I tried calling Andy to no avail and waited, hoping my shipment would arrive and I had not been scammed. Along comes 10:20 and I receive my Timor pythons from Fedex. I opened the box and found snake #1 to be a mite ridden mess of a Timor with cloudy eyes and fine scars all over the body. I then opened sack two and found snake #2 to be literally overrun with mites so bad that they were crawling all over my arms, each arm having around 50 mites. This snake was also scarred and had a blunt tail tip. I was extremely disappointed in the animals because they were crawling with mites so bad that the animals were constantly moving around in the bags. The shipping container even had mites coming out of it!!!
I then received a call from Debbie at Reptiles Express at 11:10 stating that Fedex could not get ahold of the recipient asking what I wanted to do. I told her to ship them back to me on my own dime because I could not afford for my snakes to ride around all day in a hot Fedex truck trying to find Andy. He obviously was not to be trusted and I did not want my snakes to go to an individual who obviously does not care about his animals and their well being.
He was also not returning calls from myself or Fedex. I then sent him the following e-mail:
Scott Bryan [email protected]
11:29 AM (2 hours ago)
to Andy
Andy,
I am composing this email to you because I am angry and wanted this conversation in writing. Needless to say I have received the Timors, opened the box, and was OVERWHELMED by the number of mites on these animals. I immediately took pictures as evidence of this and will gladly send them to you if you so desire. They are also scarred up and look NOTHING like a captive bred animal which was what was promised in the ad and our previous conversations. I cannot believe that you would ship animals in this condition AND advertise them as captive bred. These are animals which will require an immediate trip to the vet to be treated for parasites and this is NOT something I wanted in my collection. As I explained to you earlier in our conversations, I have a small colony of morph ball pythons, morph blood pythons, and carpet pythons that all have been in my possession for many years and were obtained as captive bred from various dealers. I would NEVER have agreed to this trade and sent you CAPTIVE BRED expensive animals for a couple of parasitized, wild caught timor pythons.
Another issue with this trade is that I have received notification from Fedex that you were unable for receipt of the ivory ball and pastel ball python I sent you. After talking to the rep on the phone for over 30 minutes, the address you sent me:
Andy Jones
c/o TMS Delivery
11140 Hwy. 64 E
Tyler, Texas 75605
appears to be a bogus address and now I have to deal with the fact that my disease and mite free captive bred animals are sitting in Texas in the heat. I am paying to have these animals returned to me. I care about my animals and take pride in sending them to people who I feel will take care of them, not someone who will let them deteriorate to the condition of the Timors you sent me.
I do NOT plan on stealing the Timors from you, I am not like that. I also will not put out any more of my money into this trade with you so you will be responsible for paying any return shipping. I also want you to reimburse me for the shipping on my snakes, if they alive back to me alive. If they do not, I want the FULL retail amount sent my way within 5 days.
You are welcome to call me and discuss this, right now I am going to take the timors to my parents house and get them the hell away from my stock before they drop snake mites everywhere. You have my number, 865-679-9534. Feel free to e-mail me back as well.
Scott Bryan
STP Reptiles
At 12:45 I receive a call from Andy threatening to "get the law after me" because he is retired law enforcement. He then states that I am committing shipping fraud. I explain to him that I want nothing to do with the Timors and that I had to make the call to have my snakes returned to me because he was unable to pick them up and no-one could get ahold of him this morning after multiple attempts. He accuses me of stopping shipment of my snakes to him, I explain that is not true. I ask him about the mites, scars, and general condition of the Timors and he accuses me of "putting mites on his animals." I then talk to him and explain that my animals are still out there, riding around in the Texas heat, and that I had to make the call to ship them back to me on my own dime because he was nowhere to be found. He tells me that he will not pay for return shipping of his animals and that if I do not he will "call the law." I explain my terms to him, tell him that he is the one who was not forthright in this trade, and that I will not ship back to him unless he pays me for my shipping and his return shipping. I also explain to him that he was the one who lied about his animals, he is the one who shipped mites to me, and he is the one who will foot the bill for my shipping, period. I think that is more than fair, he tried to rip me off, lied to me, and was caught with his pants down so to say. I followed up our telephone conversation with the following email:
Scott Bryan [email protected]
1:13 PM (1 hour ago)
to Andy
Andy,
Since we just talked I wanted to put everything in writing concerning our trade and what I expect from you. Since you are the one that misrepresented the animals in our trade and lied about the origin and parasites on the animals you are the one who is going to pay for the return shipping AND my shipping expenses on this trade. I do not appreciate you accusing me of putting mites on the animals and trying to steal from you. I also do not appreciate you threatening me with the law because you are a retired law enforcement official. I, like you claim to be, am an experienced individual in the reptile hobby and can easily spot mites on animals. You should have too, and you should never ship an animal to another hobbyist in the condition you shipped those animals to me. I also would NEVER have sent my animals on a trip to TEXAS and back, paying shipping both ways if it was going to a bogus address. Don't accuse me of shipping theft, I have proof and receipts that I shipped animals to you and I have proof that I am not the one who put a recall on the animals. I was notified this morning that Fedex had attempted delivery to the address you sent me and the address was invalid. I also copied that address in the original e-mail to you. For whatever reason, Fedex attempted to deliver these animals and the address is bogus, according to them. When I was notified of this, I tried to contact you to no avail and THEN made the decision to have the animals shipped back to me, on my own dime. I am thankful that you never received them because your facility is obviously crawling with mites and that is not something I would wish on my animals, or any animals for that matter.
Since you are obviously not to be trusted, the following will happen. I will wait for my animals return delivery tomorrow morning. If they are alive, I will send you a bill for the shipping both ways. I expect you to pay that and I will wait until I get a check that cashes for that amount before I return your animals. If they are dead, I will expect you to pay me the value of those animals in full which is $1400.00 plus whatever the shipping is determined to be. After one of those two scenarios happens, I will wait for you to send me a shipping label and I will happily ship you your wild caught, parasitized animals back.
Just to reiterate, I am not a thief and I did not stop shipment on my snakes in this deal. You are the one who misrepresented the animals in this trade, you are the one who will pay for my shipping expenses in this deal. You are also the one who will pay me in full for the value of my animals if they arrive dead tomorrow. You can threaten me all you want, but in return, if my animals arrive dead tomorrow and you refuse payment for them YOU will be the one who is in legal trouble.
I have absolutely zero desire to keep these timors in this shape. I am actually heading out this afternoon to pick up some mite spray because you obviously have no clue as to what a mite looks like or how to treat for them. I actually care for animals and these are uncomfortable, ill snakes that are in need of relief.
I am going to forward you pictures of the mites on the snakes, and on me as I opened the package this morning. I am also going to forward you the notification of failed delivery I received from Fedex this morning. These will prove that I did not stop shipment on these animals, and that they arrived in bad condition.
I only hope that when you receive the animals back that you take it upon yourself to treat them for mites again. If you object to me treating them for mites, please let me know asap and I will hold off. I consider these timors yours because of this trade gone bad. This is your fault. I am not a thief so do not accuse me of trying to steal your animals.
Sincerely,
Scott Bryan
I wanted everyone to be aware and NOT do business with this individual, he is a scammer and a rip off artist!!!
I will attempt to post pictures of the "captive bred timors" I was sent this morning. I also want everyone to know, again, that I am NOT trying to steal these animals from him but I am NOT paying for return shipping to this jerk.
I just hope that my snakes arrive back to me alive tomorrow morning.
Sincerely,
Scott Bryan
[email protected]
