Bad Guy jordan russell..broker ..flipper,gone bad

[David Scarboro]

Ed, I see it a bit differently. I see Jordan bending over backwards to make a bad situation, which he himself did not even create, much better. Tibor impresses me as a grumpy old man who wants it his way or no way. I have suggested to Jordan that he stick to the original deal. Since the animals that Tibor OK'd to trade have not sold, he should get them, if Jordan still has them. Otherwise I guess he gets what Jordan has to give. It's ed up all over, but I've seen Tibor do nothing into even meeting Jordan half way. For we who know Jordan and have done business with him, his name is sound and still an upstanding man.

Ken, you need to take the blinders off and look at the deal. You have placed all the blame on Tibor and that is totally incorrect. I realize he is your friend but white is white and black is black. Jordan admitted earlier that he owed the money, but you want to sweep that away. No winners here, but Jordan doesn't come out squeaky clean. What did he lose in the deal? Tibor has certainly lost by dealing with him.

 

[Ken Foose]

Ken, you need to take the blinders off and look at the deal. You have placed all the blame on Tibor and that is totally incorrect. I realize he is your friend but white is white and black is black. Jordan admitted earlier that he owed the money, but you want to sweep that away. No winners here, but Jordan doesn't come out squeaky clean. What did he lose in the deal? Tibor has certainly lost by dealing with him.

I stand by my above statements. I also accept that in this case, our views differ. I have read the entire thread, both of them, from the very beginning. My conclusions have not changed.

 

[hhmoore]

Bottom line - don't put animals on consignment if you aren't prepared to wait for the money. Tibor did not SELL the animals to Jordan. It appeared he realized that in the beginning; but it (somewhat understandably) seems to have gotten lost in the animal shuffle, and with the passage of time. This whole thing was complicated by Tibor agreeing to let Jordan accept a trade for snakes that he (Tibor) didn't actually want. Now, (at least some of) the original animals are gone, the trade animals aren't wanted, the substitutions are unacceptable, and the money isn't there...then there's the matter of the cages
Prices have dropped, so there is no way for Tibor's valuation of the animals to be met (and it was already high, as evidenced by the fact that they wouldn't sell; and Tibor would not agree to reducing the price). While I can fully relate to Tibor's position, it does appear that Jordan is doing what he can to resolve this.
Sad that yet another friendship has been destroyed by business.

 

[Ken Foose]

Bottom line - don't put animals on consignment if you aren't prepared to wait for the money. Tibor did not SELL the animals to Jordan. It appeared he realized that in the beginning; but it (somewhat understandably) seems to have gotten lost in the animal shuffle, and with the passage of time. This whole thing was complicated by Tibor agreeing to let Jordan accept a trade for snakes that he (Tibor) didn't actually want. Now, (at least some of) the original animals are gone, the trade animals aren't wanted, the substitutions are unacceptable, and the money isn't there...then there's the matter of the cages
Prices have dropped, so there is no way for Tibor's valuation of the animals to be met (and it was already high, as evidenced by the fact that they wouldn't sell; and Tibor would not agree to reducing the price). While I can fully relate to Tibor's position, it does appear that Jordan is doing what he can to resolve this.
Sad that yet another friendship has been destroyed by business.

 

[Paul Kent]

Bottom line - don't put animals on consignment if you aren't prepared to wait for the money. Tibor did not SELL the animals to Jordan. It appeared he realized that in the beginning; but it (somewhat understandably) seems to have gotten lost in the animal shuffle, and with the passage of time. This whole thing was complicated by Tibor agreeing to let Jordan accept a trade for snakes that he (Tibor) didn't actually want. Now, (at least some of) the original animals are gone, the trade animals aren't wanted, the substitutions are unacceptable, and the money isn't there...then there's the matter of the cages
Prices have dropped, so there is no way for Tibor's valuation of the animals to be met (and it was already high, as evidenced by the fact that they wouldn't sell; and Tibor would not agree to reducing the price). While I can fully relate to Tibor's position, it does appear that Jordan is doing what he can to resolve this.
Sad that yet another friendship has been destroyed by business.

There arent a lot of people in the world that can turn 11 pages of dribble in to something that makes absolute sense.

Nice to see reasonable thoughts again

 

[David Reid]

Yeah, I agree with Harald. As far as I know, Jordan never purchased the animals from Tibor to resell. Tibor willingly handed them over to Jordan to try and sell. Jordan has contacts, maybe more time to invest in the marketing of the animals, maybe Tibor is just not good with people? For Jordan, he gets a small cut of the sales price. Jordan only makes money if the animals sell, I would think Jordan would have loved to sell each and every snake, and make him and Tibor happy. If the snakes did not sell, and Tibor did not want/take/ask for them back, and instead agreed to trade some of them, the animals are Tibors, minus food, heating, etc. It sounds to me like Tibor did not want anything back but cash, and was willing to put this off and put this off until Jordan was finally willing to settle up in cash, to get Tibor off his back. I do not know this as fact, just seems plausible knowing Jordan as an easy going, mellow guy. If Tibor really wanted his snakes, or the traded animals back, he could have easily gotten them. Maybe he just wanted someone else to do all the shipping (who would not want someone else to do their shipping for them and the dirty work for him, while he sits back with no cages to clean, no waters to change, no food to buy, no feeding to do......


Dave

 

[yeloowtang]

long read but i will have to side with Harald and the likes..
Tibor should get what ever snakes have been traded against the original ones and that's all there is to it...
Jordan , in no way owes him cash for consignment animals, in fact, Tibor should owe him money for the care he has given the snakes all this time..

If Jordan has the proper trail of the traded animals, these should simply be handed over to tibor and he can do his own selling..not let him chose animals of higher value, but the ones that have been traded.

this is all ridicules how one guy passes over animals on consignment, they don't sell, he agrees on a trade in hopes that the other animals will sell faster, they don't, refuses them back and then wants Jordan to pay him for the snakes !!!!!! makes no sense at all, then add the fact he wants the original animals that have been rightfully traded with his accord and tries to use lawyer tactics by having him say he doesn't have the original animals ??? whoooo !! that's a cheap shot...

I wish i lived closer to Jordan, I would be happy to help him pack up Tibors animals and drive them over to end this ridicules claim..

 

[David Scarboro]

I wish i lived closer to Jordan, I would be happy to help him pack up Tibors animals and drive them over to end this ridicules claim..

That is all well and good Stephanie, but Jordan told Tibor that he would pay him money a number of times including this thread. Then he lawyered up and changed his tune when he didn't have the money. When I tell someone I am going to do something. I do it. Plain and simple. If you are willing to wiggle enough, you can find your own personal high ground almost anywhere. I'm not saying Tibor is blameless in this sordid affair, he's not. Both Jordan and Tibor have shown a propensity to wiggle here.

 

[yeloowtang]

It:s Stephane

and i know he said that, but he did so to get him off his back and end this deal once and for all.. he also wanted to give him his snakes back but the guy refused..

ask yourself this question..

if i give you 5000$ worth in snakes to sell in consignment, sell a few and get back $$ for them, then the others don't sell and you suggest trading them off for something else that might sell better.. I agree to the trade.. then they don't sell after a while and i start hounding you for my $$$
would you give me back the snakes traded we agreed on or pay me the value of the snakes ???? when you decide to just give me the snakes , i say NO i want $$ and start bad guy treads to ruin your rep unless i get $$$ back ???

what would you do, cave in and agree to pay $$ or hold your ground ??

the mistake here was not having a contract stating details... unless Jordan agreed to buy the snakes off him instead of the consignment deal they had/have
then the fact of the matter is, Jordan should only give animals traded for the original ones back to Tibor witch he himself agreed on the trade..

no matter if Jordan said he owed him that amount, it's clear he owes him that value in animals, he took them in for resale, they didn't sell and the OP wants $$ now..
he can go pick up his snakes as was offered and be done with it

in my view, there isn't 50000 different ways to see this..

 

[MADOGRE]

I don't think any one is saying this is all on Jordan, he is a very good guy IMO and had done a lot for the reptile community and has my utmost respect for that.

Some of you need to step back and forget who they are and look at it for what it is. Jordan agreed to sell XXX snakes for Tibor, some sold and Tibor was paid, the left over where not selling so they agreed to do a trade for snakes that would sell. Jordan being the seller it would only make since this was his idea, Tibor agreed because Jordan is a seller/dealer and knows more about the market, but when they did not sell he is left high and dry for 200-400 days(not sure how long it was after the trade).

So now we are at this post, Jordan posted he would pay him $$+ cages to make this good, but then the Jordan band wagon filled the pages with"You don't owe him" "I would not pay him" "I'd dump them at his door" BS and now he does not want to pay.

I think your doing your friend Jordan a disfavor, its only making him look bad to the out side world, this forum reaches far beyond this site, and i have already seen people talking about it other places.

For every ones benefit I would get this matter cleared up and finished ASAP, we all know your reputation matters a lot in this community and the online world, once you lose it, its very hard to get it back.

 

[yeloowtang]

I think your doing your friend Jordan a disfavor, its only making him look bad to the out side world, this forum reaches far beyond this site, and i have already seen people talking about it other places.

For the reccord, I live in Canada far away from either one of them and in no way do I Know Jordan or Tibor.
nor can i claim one guy is better than the other, mistakes have been made and if this post shows something, it clearly shows that even when dealing with a friend, a contract should be in place..

after reading the whole story, it's clear to me that the snakes should be given back to the OP, now if Jordan decided to pay him instead, that's his business but he explained that in order to do that he would have to sell off animals before he can do that.. The OP has two choices, wait for the animals to sell or take his inventory back and sell it himself...

I agree with you that reputations are important and hard to fix once damaged, BUT I don't think Jordan would have dificulties selling stock !! Tibor however ????

 

[Ed Clark]

Jordan is a seller/dealer and knows more about the market, but when they did not sell he is left high and dry for 200-400 days(not sure how long it was after the trade).

So now we are at this post, Jordan posted he would pay him $$+ cages to make this good

Agreed!

Jordan clearly demonstrated his lack of knowledge of the reptile market by trading for reptiles that would sell faster then did not.

He then lied to Tibor about paying him $$$.

 

[David Scarboro]

It:s Stephane and i know he said that, but he did so to get him off his back and end this deal once and for all.. he also wanted to give him his snakes back but the guy refused..

No matter why the reason, he said it. I consider that his word. Then he changed his mind. That sets a precedent, and does somewhat devalue his word. For the record I am not naming Jordan as a bad guy. No scammers or thieves here, just a deal gone bad. I do take exception to his friends coming here and turning a blind eye to the facts. Jordan, as well as Tibor have responsibility here.

 

[yeloowtang]

I will have to agree with you about all points ,that his word to pay back as he said should be kept,but he explained that to do so would take time since the OP refused his snakes in return and he would have to move inventory to do so.Why Jordan change his mind ??? Ops attitude, support, ???
why the OP doesn't just take his snakes back and be done with it ?? even when offered up to 1000$ more in value !!!

I still beleive that the inventory should have been returned the momment the OP got tired of waiting..this was the deal agreed on.. you sell my snakes for me, they didn't sell so take your snakes back (even the traded ones he agreed to)

you are right that both sides have a play in this but reading all this , no matter who is right or wrong .. a good lesson is to be learned from this.. i know i will be more carefull in the future about dealings..

 

[TIBOR PAPP]

well jordan showed up after 400 plus days ..and left very quick..would not show me the boas that i gave him..brought me a pair of white rosy boas..that i did not want... cash or my boas...he totally screwed me ..and going to profit from me next..what a thief...I'm telling you all he's scum!

 

[David Scarboro]

well jordan showed up after 400 plus days ..and left very quick..would not show me the boas that i gave him..brought me a pair of white rosy boas..that i did not want... cash or my boas...he totally screwed me ..and going to profit from me next..what a thief...I'm telling you all he's scum!

Tibor, Please, calmly list everything that he brought with him.

 

[Utta]

well jordan showed up after 400 plus days ..and left very quick..would not show me the boas that i gave him..brought me a pair of white rosy boas..that i did not want... cash or my boas...he totally screwed me ..and going to profit from me next..what a thief...I'm telling you all he's scum!

HE...

DOES...

NOT...

HAVE...

THEM...

ANY...

MORE...

Can I say it more slowly for you to understand?

What part of that do you not understand?

You don't want the rosy boa's that YOU agreed to for the trade? Then WHY did you agree to the trade?

 

[TIBOR PAPP]

Tibor, Please, calmly list everything that he brought with him.

he brought me the 4 stack of ap cages..and a styrafoam box was taped up with an ice pac..they left real quick..the box once opened all that was there was a pair of inmature white rosy boas.

 

[TIBOR PAPP]

HE...

DOES...

NOT...

HAVE...

THEM...

ANY...

MORE...

Can I say it more slowly for you to understand?

What part of that do you not understand?

You don't want the rosy boa's that YOU agreed to for the trade? Then WHY did you agree to the trade?

I never agreed to trade ..my boas back or the cash!

 

[TIBOR PAPP]

heres how it came drop.. off on the street and in a big hurry...

this is it.