Bought animal on here, later found out it is severely impacted.

[tctpa523]

I recently purchased a tortoise from a seller on this group. The gentleman was very helpful during the transaction, and I was initially very happy with the animal. About a month went by and I noticed that he was not thriving. I took him to my vet, who is a reptile specialist, and he ran the entire spectrum of tests only to discover that the animal was severely impacted. Apparently he was housed in sand at some point during his time before he came into my possession, and he has basically now a giant glob of concrete in his digestive tract. My vet told me this was due to eating sand over time, and having it build up in his intestines. I have also been told that we have about a 50/50 chance of the tortoise not dying. I really do not know what I should do in this situation. Obviously I told the vet to start treating the animal, but I paid top dollar when I purchased him. Since then I have put almost an additional $500 into him in veterinary bills, I am now facing at a minimum another $500 in treatment, and if we are not able to get this blockage to work its way through, a surgery it will cost at the very least three to five thousand dollars. Not to mention at the end of all this, the animal may or may not still be able to breed, which was the reason that I paid top dollar for him. At this point I am just looking for any suggestion on how I should handle this. I believe that the seller had no idea that this problem existed, but at the end of the day the damage was done to the animal before it came into my possession. What should I say to the seller? Should I ask for a refund and offer to return the animal? I have already spent nearly as much as I paid for the animal in vet bills. And I still very much need this little guy, because he is the key to my breeding project at the moment. I would greatly appreciate any feedback from anyone who has gone through a similar situation. Thank you very much for your time.

 

[Occidentalis]

Have you contacted the original seller?

Was the tortoise eating and passing food well when you received it, and now, after a month, is not? It seems strange that such a serious impaction would not be clear immediately. In your care, was it ever on soil, sand or gravel?

Unfortunately this is often the way this hobby goes. I don't think I'd personally expect a refund this late in the game.

 

[tctpa523]

Thank you for the input. He was and still is currently eating. But this problem has gone on so long the vet told me that the bottom half of his GI tract has shut down and the top half of his GI tract is working overdrive trying to dislodge the clog. He is in a massive outdoor enclosure with me, so it is possible that he could have added to the problem here. But my vet said that there's no way it could have accumulated as much as it has in the time since I bought the animal. I have not yet contacted the original seller, I don't even know if I'm going to. I don't even know what I would ask him to do if I did contact him. This is just kind of a bad situation, and like you said it's sort of the nature of the beast. Thank you for taking the time to answer my question.

 

[Occidentalis]

Thank you for the input. He was and still is currently eating. But this problem has gone on so long the vet told me that the bottom half of his GI tract has shut down and the top half of his GI tract is working overdrive trying to dislodge the clog. He is in a massive outdoor enclosure with me, so it is possible that he could have added to the problem here. But my vet said that there's no way it could have accumulated as much as it has in the time since I bought the animal. I have not yet contacted the original seller, I don't even know if I'm going to. I don't even know what I would ask him to do if I did contact him. This is just kind of a bad situation, and like you said it's sort of the nature of the beast. Thank you for taking the time to answer my question.

A month is a lot of time to eat junk, outside is a good place to do it. If I were the seller I don't know that I could help you in this case, unless I had noticed problems with the turtle myself (but then again I wouldn't be selling it if I did). It's a tough spot to be in.

Is the turtle not pooping but still eating?

 

[Magic]

That situation sucks, especially if you're talking a regulated species.


However, I can offer some insight, although it's not what you want to hear.

If the original seller sold him to you as a breeder, you may have recourse. If the tort was represented as a breeder, with a price tag of that of a breeding specimen, it wouldn't be difficult to get a judgement in your favor of returning the tort and getting a refund. You may not be awarded the vet costs, however, because you elected to have those tests ran. You may be awarded vet costs if any life saving procedures were done, but it sounds as if they were just evaluations??

If you just bought the tort from the seller as a tort (no words about it being a proven breeder, will mature to a great breeder, etc)and you were thinking in the back of your mind about being able to breed it, and the seller expressed no guarantee to it's ability to reproduce, then you bought a lemon and essentially a pet. It would be nigh on impossible to prove the seller had knowledge of the impaction and WILLFULLY sold you a lemon. And proving he knew about the impaction would be the only way you'd be awarded the money you've already invested.

The seller may or may not be a schmuck, I guess there's not enough details to determine that.

You could always just contact him, provide him vet proof of the impaction, and ask him how he would remedy this icky situation. You'll get a way better vibe by his answer.

 

[Lucille]

A month is a lot of time to eat junk, outside is a good place to do it.

provide him vet proof of the impaction

Recovery may not be that easy.

There is an impaction. There is a month this critter lived outside at the buyer's house.
It is possible some of the impaction occurred during that month.
See comparative negligence in tort law (pardon the pun).

 

[Occidentalis]

It is possible some of the impaction occurred during that month.

I would argue that all of the impaction could have occurred during that month. But mine is not an expert opinion.

 

[Lucille]

I would argue that all of the impaction could have occurred during that month. But mine is not an expert opinion.

But my vet said that there's no way it could have accumulated as much as it has in the time since I bought the animal.

Still, even partial fault may be a bar to some recovery, depends on particulars and jurisdiction.

 

[tctpa523]

Thanks for your time. I appreciate the advice.

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

Thomas, what kind of tortoise is it and how big is it? I assume from context that it is a male.

 

[Herps Alive!]

Somewhat confused here. Why would anyone not contact the seller just to check in and see what he could add or help with? Why come here first?

 

[Magic]

Keith,

Sometimes transactions dealing with a rare specimen or large amounts of money (and I'm not saying that the tort in question was a several thousand dollar specimen--I simply don't know that, merely stating my experience) benefit from asking others in the industry "Hey, what do you guys think?".

Others' input may add valuable insight on transaction dealings. One of the reasons why our BOI here works so well.

 

[Herps Alive!]

So I buy a used Lamborghini and have issues with it. Call other Lambo owners rather than the dealership? Hear what you are saying but there's a certain logic defying factor to me.

 

[Magic]

So I buy a used Lamborghini and have issues with it. Call other Lambo owners rather than the dealership? Hear what you are saying but there's a certain logic defying factor to me.

Hey all you other 2012 Lambo owners! Are your headlamp lenses crazing and spidering already too? Mine are cloudy and yellowing. I think I'm gonna call the dealership and complain, as I really don't think my lenses should be this bad in only two years. I've had it parked in the sun, but not everyday, and it's not like I live in the desert. I paid a lot of money for this car, and don't think I'm overreacting. Could I get some of my money back because I need to replace my headlamps? What would you guys do?? I don't like having my car's headlamp lenses looking like a cubic zirconia knockoff.

Now, I'm not saying that imaginary story up above is what's going on with the OP, but it's not illogical to post here before going straight to the seller. Matter of factly, sometimes it takes an outsider to tell you that you're asking for too much or not enough.

 

[hhmoore]

Since its been nearly a month, how about a status update?

 

[tctpa523]

He is an 8 inch cherry head. my vet has been helping me treat him and he is doing much better. I believe most of the blockage has passed through. He gave him some sort of intestinal lubricant in a few days later he passed waste that resembled wallpaper paste. I never did contact the seller. Everyone here made a good point, enough time has passed that the likelihood of him doing anything about the situation was probably negligible. I also don't think he had any idea that this animal has a problem when it was sold to me. I want to thank you all for your comments and advice on this thread. The animal has seemed to improve steadily over the last couple weeks. He now eats like a pig and has been trying to figure a way to claw his way out of is quarantine set up. I think in another week or two he may be ready to go back in the group that he was designated for.

 

[Herps Alive!]

Hey all you other 2012 Lambo owners! Are your headlamp lenses crazing and spidering already too? Mine are cloudy and yellowing. I think I'm gonna call the dealership and complain, as I really don't think my lenses should be this bad in only two years. I've had it parked in the sun, but not everyday, and it's not like I live in the desert. I paid a lot of money for this car, and don't think I'm overreacting. Could I get some of my money back because I need to replace my headlamps? What would you guys do?? I don't like having my car's headlamp lenses looking like a cubic zirconia knockoff.

Now, I'm not saying that imaginary story up above is what's going on with the OP, but it's not illogical to post here before going straight to the seller. Matter of factly, sometimes it takes an outsider to tell you that you're asking for too much or not enough.

Touche' Magic . But this is more major than yellowing lenses. This is a transmission slipping. Wouldn't you contact the dealer to see about a recall notice. Certainly good to get more info but to not contact the original source AT ALL seems odd. Even if its just headlight lenses.

 

[tctpa523]

Keith,

Sometimes transactions dealing with a rare specimen or large amounts of money (and I'm not saying that the tort in question was a several thousand dollar specimen--I simply don't know that, merely stating my experience) benefit from asking others in the industry "Hey, what do you guys think?".

Others' input may add valuable insight on transaction dealings. One of the reasons why our BOI here works so well.

This was pretty much my thought process. I had taken an extended break from and sort of buying or selling of reptiles, and have just been caring for my own group for the last 10 years. When this animal started piling up large veterinary bills I guess I just wanted to get the feedback from people who have potentially dealt with the situation like this before and see if I did have any recourse. After reading the answers submitted by everyone kind enough to post on this thread I decided to just suck it up and make sure that the animal was going to be healthy first and foremost. It has been made clear to me was enough time had passed that there was probably not very much positive that could come from confronting the seller.

 

[tctpa523]

Keith,

Sometimes transactions dealing with a rare specimen or large amounts of money (and I'm not saying that the tort in question was a several thousand dollar specimen--I simply don't know that, merely stating my experience) benefit from asking others in the industry "Hey, what do you guys think?".

Others' input may add valuable insight on transaction dealings. One of the reasons why our BOI here works so well.

This was pretty much my thought process. I had taken an extended break from any sort of buying or selling of reptiles, and have just been caring for my own group for the last 10 years. When this animal started piling up large veterinary bills I guess I just wanted to get the feedback from people who have potentially dealt with the situation like this before and see if I did have any recourse. After reading the answers submitted by everyone kind enough to post on this thread I decided to just suck it up and make sure that the animal was going to be healthy first and foremost. It has been made clear to me was enough time had passed that there was probably not very much positive that could come from confronting the seller.

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

Glad to read he is doing better. Did the vet give him lactulose? That can help. Higher magnesium can also be of some assistance. If he eats Mazuri, making a mash of Mazuri using real fruit juice (apple would be fine) as the softening agent instead of water and some Magnesium that is not an oxide (from a capsule meant for people) may help in getting the peristalsis going in a bit more "rowdy" a fashion, helping him clear residual deposits.