Bad Guy Chad Lewis Suttmiller not worthy of your altruism or time.

[QTFR]

This is a note about Chad Lewis Suttmiller of Deltona, FL. I will offer a series of facts as well as several opinions about him. I had someone recommend Chad Lewis Suttmiller as a reputable breeder of Phelsuma species, and it was based on that recommendation that I breeding loaned him 2.2 Phelsuma flavigularis, that I had as surplus and was not interested in selling. At the time we agreed to the breeding loan he promised to work with the animals for a period of time, and to return the adults and a fair share of the neonates to me at the end of the breeding loan. I gave him 3 years to work with them, and then asked for their return and a fair share of the offspring. He agreed to this, and set October of 2014 as when he would return the animals. When I contacted him via email (then phone and snail mail letter), to confirm a date for their return, he suddenly went dark on me, and would not return any communication. At the same time he was ignoring my communication, he was offering the animals for sale for $1,000 a piece. I have had lots of great experiences with people in the hobby, and this experience is somewhat of an outlier for me, but I would not want someone else to fall into the same situation. As I started checking around, with mutual acquaintances in the Phelsuma hobby, about Chad I ran into several other folks who had experienced a similar situation, so I think this may be his modus operandi and represent a track record of deception versus a ‘one off event’. A background check on him revealed a fairly modest annual income, and so this may be an instance of someone who aspires to keep animals whose value is greater than they can afford. In my experience with him (and in my opinon), I have found him to be a person of really low ethical character, and not someone worthy of the good karma that comes from those in the hobby who operate altruistically. I feel an obligation to notify other members of the hobby so they can avoid a similar negative activity and similar ‘parasitic behavior’. I have saved all my correspondence with him via email, so have a backup of everything discussed in this note. Do not deal with Chad Lewis Suttmiller he is not worthy of your time or good intentions.

Thank you, Nathan Manwaring

 

[wyldwurm]

Please post those emails and any proof you may have. If you are going to post facts, back them up

 

[QTFR]

Chad Suttmiller - Emails back and forth regarding Phelsuma flavigularis

Here is the back and forth, between Chad Suttmiller (Chad Lewis Suttmiller) of Deltona, Florida and myself. You can see that I kept this very positive (and professional), and gave every opportunity for him to call me back or email me back. Basically this guy got 4 animals worth at least $4,000 on a breeding loan, as a result of the altruism of someone (heck I even paid to ship them), and decided to keep them versus honoring his commitment. No one in the hobby should interact with this person.


On 9/11/2014 5:32 PM, Cordylus wrote:
>
>
> Chad,
>
> Keep hoping to hear from you. If the animals have died, were traded or you no longer have them, then let me know and you can pay me for them (or if you just want to keep them). $500 each would be a fair price, in Europe these go for more than that.
>
> I am sure you are a busy person, I know that I am as well (I have 3 small kids ages 7,4 and 18 months) as well as a demanding job, but this really has become kind of a faith diminishing experience for me. I sent these animals to you in good faith, and had your assurance that we had a collaborative agreement on them. As recently as this summer you pledged to send them back in September. The hobby both in the US and Europe really only functions when people keep their word, and a good reputation really can open or close a lot of doors with fellow hobbyists.
>
> I remain hopeful that you will honor your commitment to me, and that it is some kind of atypical turmoil or extenuating circumstances that has prevented you from communicating back with me on a timely basis.
>
> I will probably be down in your area in the next few weeks, and would love to get the chance to talk with you and see your collection, and get a chance to meet you live.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Nathan
>
>
> On 7/8/2014 2:48 AM, Big Junk wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Buddy I work and travel quite a bit I'm not avoiding you I am extremely busy ..Its 238 in the am and this is when I have my free time crazy enough.. Lets keep the threatening tones to a minimum there's entirely to much of that stuff floating around especially in this hobby...As far as wrapping things up there is never any guarantee how successful a project can be I'm at there pace they are not at mine.I never force any breeding etc unless the animals are in great health and compatible . Ive had reasonable success with one pair the other not so much neonates are finicky in my opinion for a phelsuma..I can send you 2.2 in September plus neonates roughly 4 months ...
>>>>> I will contact you soon
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> On Jul 7, 2014 7:28 PM, "Cordylus" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>
>>>>> Called again and left a message. I would appreciate a call back - 615 XXX XXXX,
>>>>>
>>>>> Let's get this wrapped up, I think there are two options here.
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. Send the animals back, or send sexable young animals.
>>>>> 2. Let's agree on a price per animal, and you can send that payment to me.
>>>>>
>>>>> This shouldn't be that tough, and I would like to wrap it up and move on.
>>>>>
>>>>> I travel with some frequency for work to that area of Florida and have a good friend that lives close to you, so I/he could pick up the animals if that is a barrier here.
>>>>>
>>>>> Let's touch base, get this solved and move on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Nathan
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 7/3/2014 5:41 PM, Nathan Manwaring wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No super hurry, let's connect after 4rth of July. Thanks for the note. I think you have small kids like I do, so is not always easy to get time for a phone conversation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Nathan
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7/3/2014 4:43 PM, Big Junk wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sorry when I'm on jobsite I use company phone so I had left mine in room...
>>>>>>> On Jul 3, 2014 8:11 AM, "Nathan Manwaring" <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tried calling the number below, give me a call when you get a chance. 615 XXX XXXX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nathan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Shoot me a phone #Fwd: Checking in with you.
>>>>>>> Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2014 20:41:42 -0400
>>>>>>> From: Big Junk <[email protected]>
>>>>>>> To: cordylus@XXXXX,com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 386-801-7582 in the evenings
>>>>>>> On Jun 24, 2014 8:12 PM, <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Shoot me a phone #, and good times to call.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nathan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: chad suttmiller <[email protected]>
>>>>>>>> Date: June 21, 2014 at 2:11:00 PM EDT
>>>>>>>> To: <[email protected]>
>>>>>>>> Subject: RE: Checking in with you...on P. flavigularis and P. breviceps.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Use this email [email protected]
>>>>>>>> All is well
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Date: Fri, 13 Jun 2014 20:43:17 -0400
>>>>>>>> From: [email protected]
>>>>>>>> To: [email protected]
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: Checking in with you...on P. flavigularis and P. breviceps.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I thought I would check in to see if maybe things had cleared up from your Family Crisis, I wanted to touch base on the P. flavigularis. It has been 3 years of breeding loan, and it sounds like you have had some breeding success with the P. flavigularis, so I would be interested in getting some sexable subadults or the adult breeders back.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nathan
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 4/21/2014 12:36 AM, chad suttmiller wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've had a tragic family event occur recently so my reply will be apologeticly quick all is well I've had to get a few more breviceps to help curb aggression.
>>>>>>>> Flavigularus are now in stride after a bout of duds..I work with all phelsuma except a few larger type.
>>>>>>>> I will get back soon
>>>>>>>> Chad
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2014 13:32:10 -0400
>>>>>>>> From: [email protected]
>>>>>>>> To: [email protected]
>>>>>>>> Subject: Checking in with you...on P. flavigularis and P. breviceps.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thought I would do a check in to see how the male P. breviceps and breeding group of 4 P. flavigularis are doing. Any breeding, last year it sounded like you had good P. flavigularis eggs. Any breviceps success?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What else are you working with?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hope all is well,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nathan

 

[QTFR]

Nothing from Chad Suttmiller

I have never heard back from Chad Suttmiller in regard to this issue so he maintains his status as a 'low life' in my eyes. I posted this on the Facebook Phelsuma Fanatics Page, and multiple other participants had, had similar experiences with Chad so be sure to stay clear of him.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/215804861878715/search/?query=suttmiller

 

[nickolasanastasiou]

Who is the someone who recommended him? On what basis did he or she recommend him?

 

[snakesareawesome]

Dang that's one busy guy! He's been tied up for a year and a half.

 

[hhmoore]

As I started checking around, with mutual acquaintances in the Phelsuma hobby, about Chad I ran into several other folks who had experienced a similar situation.

Anonymous third party information is not acceptable on the BOI. While it may be arguable whether your statement fits our description of quotation, it is obvious from your statement that that this information was provided by somebody else - regardless of whether it was your acquaintances or other injured parties. If you don't want to reveal the source of the information, please do not post it on the BOI.

 

[markpulawski]

Nathan I am sorry to hear of your negative experiences with Chad and though I will admit he is one tough cookie to get ahold of at times he and I have done several trades, all of which have provided me with exceptional animals. All of my transactions with Chad have been in person, meeting somewhere in between as we both live in Florida, I have received a breeding pair of borbonica Entang Mater, klemmeri and cepediana, and every animal was better than described.
There are not enough people breeding rare day gecko's, it is unfortunate that you have had this experience with him and I truly hope you and he get this resolved in the near future.

 

[QTFR]

Chad Lewis Suttmiller has a history of dishonesty. Your experience is an outlier.

Mark,

I am glad that you survived your interactions with Chad Lewis Suttmiller without losing any animals or wasting an inordinate amount of time. Chad has all my information, and could certainly easily make this right. I offered to let him pay me a fairly cheap price for the animals. It is hard to imagine that anyone would be so busy that they are unable to write an email over the course of several years or pick up the phone. On the Phelsuma Phanatics Facebook page several participants had similar experiences where Chad had animals and did not make good on a trade or 'sold' an animal that was on breeding loan to him. I think that Chad is a person of limited financial means, and so he has augmented his collection, by preying upon the good will, and generosity of fellow hobbyists. Most people in the hobby are honest and good people, but Chad obviously doesn't feel that social norms and ethics apply to him. He could easily make this right, but his lack of attempt to do so, and his failure to attempt to redeem his good will show that he is not worthy of trust, or interaction in the hobby. I hope that he will continue to be 'shunned' by the hobby.

 

[QTFR]

Facebook Thread where others shared their bad experiences with Chad Suttmiller.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/215804861878715/permalink/686724408120089/

 

[bcr229]

https://www.facebook.com/groups/215804861878715/permalink/686724408120089/

Only group members can see the thread. Also Facebook groups and posts are not permanent. Can you take screen shots and attach them here? That way they will remain even if the posts or group are deleted.

 

[AbsoluteApril]

Nathan has been advised to ask the people from that FB group with the claims against Chad to come post their story here.

 

[snowgyre]

Here's the capture from the Facebook page linked above.

 

[QTFR]

Additional Information.

There was a suggestion to cut and paste the photo of the Facebook thread in case the link ceases to function.

 

[markzillen]

Have you heard any more from Chad? Is he still in the Hobby? I heard a mention of a Chad on one of the Phelsuma forums and wondered if it is this Chad?

 

[QTFR]

Chad Lewis Suttmiller still MIA

I haven't heard anything back from him. I am sure I never will, he is sadly representative of the bad element in the hobby.