Bad Guy Ty park/ ty lizards FL

[tim brophy]

Too many people here enjoy this drama so much they will never offer suggestions for resolution! Amazing. Whatever happens here, the only people who will be effected are Ty and Michelle. Not any body else. It will not have the slightest effect on your lives. Only Michelle and Ty. Offer resolution ideas, don't just rehash this tired old thread, detail by detail.

 

[ElliotNess]

Ed I understand what you are saying as I read that, but she is a resident of mass, even with the raffle being out of mass, regs still govern her in her state. Also, didn't not dismiss her case just ststing what I have found and how i interpreted the statute.

Again you should take a step back and post FACTS with your guesses.

Here is the FACT - easily found from http://www.mass.gov/ago/doing-busin...y/guidance-on-raffles/faqs-about-raffles.html

THE LAW ONLY APPLIES TO RAFFLES HELD IN MASS.

 

[DavidBeard]

I'm still waiting on the proof or even HINT of proof that Ty Park is a non-profit entity......this Corny Andrew guy just keeps sticking his foot in his mouth and isn't even trying to take it out before he speaks again.

 

[Chris Kennard]

Too many people here enjoy this drama so much they will never offer suggestions for resolution! Amazing. Whatever happens here, the only people who will be effected are Ty and Michelle. Not any body else. It will not have the slightest effect on your lives. Only Michelle and Ty. Offer resolution ideas, don't just rehash this tired old thread, detail by detail.

I have two suggestions for resolution. Ty gives her an albino blue produced by him, or coughs up the three grand he owes her. Problem solved.

 

[thomas davis]

Too many people here enjoy this drama so much they will never offer suggestions for resolution! Amazing. Whatever happens here, the only people who will be effected are Ty and Michelle. Not any body else. It will not have the slightest effect on your lives. Only Michelle and Ty. Offer resolution ideas, don't just rehash this tired old thread, detail by detail.

wow really? the resolution is for ty park to send her her prize per HIS terms!
its really just that simple it comes down to honoring ones word either send her her lizard or cash

 

[DavidBeard]

Too many people here enjoy this drama so much they will never offer suggestions for resolution! Amazing. Whatever happens here, the only people who will be effected are Ty and Michelle. Not any body else. It will not have the slightest effect on your lives. Only Michelle and Ty. Offer resolution ideas, don't just rehash this tired old thread, detail by detail.

Have YOU contributed anything other than complaints about others posting? lol....Seems a tad hypocritical/ironic. Don't want to read the thread? Simple solution.

 

[RobertHume]

I don't believe Ty Park is an evil/unethical tegu farmer cackling away on his Scrooge McDuck money out to screw the next charity raffle winner. He got annoyed by Michelle's attitude and I understand perfectly where he is coming from.

I believe Michelle deserved to get the tegu she technically won. I wish you the best, but I wouldn't be surprised if you lost either. You've stalked and gathered quite a bit of "information" from Ty's facebook in order to dampen his reputation. And now he's suing you for it. You may have the favor of some "people" (a rather charitable term by the way) who are constantly abusing the BOI for not what it was unintended, but rather as an emotional outlet for some blatant issues and toxicity in their lives (ie. DavidBeard), but this is America where a juridical system is in place so we'll have to let the court decide.

Have YOU contributed anything other than complaints about others posting? lol....Seems a tad hypocritical/ironic.

Hypocritical and ironic indeed. Try seeking some sunlight.

 

[caffeinecynic]

Exactly. I do not think either party handled this situation correctly, Ty was the one who needed to perform, and Michelle disrespected him by calling him out, and she even got Ty to offer up a prize he wanted to keep, but left an option open for her to get nothing.

...

AllisonLeigh, how would you feel about someone who called you dishonest or shady?

Clipped out parts of this post to reply to these. I realize this wasn't aimed at me, but I want to address it since AllisonLeigh was actually agreeing with me.

Here is my perspective: I think Michelle's wording of things, throughout this thread, have been brusque, even tactless at times (no offense, Michelle) and I can absolutely see how it could rub someone wrong. Based on her communication with him, I can completely see why Ty would not want to do business with her and as a businessman, that is 100% his right.

HOWEVER...

And this is where my perspective changes.

When you go out and make a public spectacle like his raffle, you are obligated to be better than those with whom you are working. You are obligated to set the example.

There is a phrase in customer service, "The customer is always right." And the truth is, no, they're not, but when you're dealing with the customer, you should always treat them as if they are. That may mean as soon as you hang up the phone with them, you call them every kind of name you can think of, but you have to have the decorum to smile and play nice while dealing with them. That professionalism goes a long way.

It seems as though, because this was a raffle, Ty didn't see fit to treat Michelle with that kind of professionalism. I completely get where he'd be insulted, I would be in his position, but she did win fair and square, and the faster, more painless solution would be to give her one of the two prizes and then block her and have her out of his hair. I don't think anyone blames Ty for disliking Michelle, he has every right to do so. The problem is that you can't let a knee jerk bad emotional reaction destroy your professionalism.

To answer the question you posed to AllisonLeigh: In Ty's shoes, I would've sent her the money, not the lizard, because he had her PayPal address from the IRCF. I would've said "I don't wish to deal with you any longer, you are becoming confrontational and this is unprofessional for both of us. Here is the money from the prize agreement, please do not enter any more raffles of mine in the future," and then I would've blocked her upon confirmed receipt.

Probably not what she WANTED, since she's made it clear she wanted the tegu, but at least then she got something, no one could accuse me of being dishonest, and I wouldn't have to deal with her at all. Instant end of transaction that doesn't paint me as the difficult party.

Just my opinion I know it differs from yours, but I hope you can understand some of where I'm coming from here!

Again: Sorry Michelle - I'm not trying to attack your character here, you seem like a nice woman, it's just that I can completely see his side on that front because of how you worded things, intentional or not. Two sides to every story.

 

[juliasara]

As you seem to believe that he did promise lineage, could you point me to where it shows he does in this thread? This is a long thread and I am perfectly willing to admit that I could have missed something, but I would like to make my own conclusions about it. The text that says if I don't produce any is a little ambiguous to me as getting them from a friend could be considered producing them. Producing does not necessarily mean birthing from his own stock.

So you wouldn't be angry if you bought an animal from me that I had told you I produced but in actuality I purchased from another breeder? If someone sold me an animal they claimed to have produced only to find out later on they purchased it from some unknown breeder I would be livid. IMO saying you produced an animal that you purchased from someone else is 1000% a lie. I'm pretty positive if someone did that to you you'd be right here on the BOI posting about how your were lied to. So what makes it ok for ty parks to do that to someone else?

 

[juliasara]

Plus when you go out and buy something you don't tell people I just produced this, most people would say I acquired this, or purchased this. I've never in my life heard someone use the word produce when referring to something they purchased. Corney, you can attempt to twist ty's words to benefit him but next time you might want to look up the definition of the words before.

 

[Casey Hulse]

Corney, you can attempt to twist ty's words to benefit him but next time you might want to look up the definition of the words before.

I think most people know that "produced" has more than one meaning, and insulting someones comprehension is petty.
In a legal sense it does matter what his definition was when he "produced" the terms (maybe he copied them from another raffle site) of the raffle, but he could argue all day long that, 1, he did produce albinos or that he meant produce, like "have in hand".
Someone asked about sending her the money instead of buying her tegu, I would think he could purchase a $3000 tegu in a lot of several for .50-.75 cents on the dollar.

So when did it become required for a person to be respectful in order to be awarded a prize that they were entitled to receive?

I did not say it was required,but being disrespectful to someone who thought they were doing a great thing, (who by the way is supposed to provide you with something) would clearly not be my recommendation...??

It was my impression at the very beginning, that Michelle was very excited about having won the cash, that is why she asked for it several times.

 

[AllisonLeigh]

I'm sorry, I just don't see where Michelle was anything out of the norm. If you guys consider Michelle difficult, you must have had some amazing luck with customers as over the years and years I've dealt with vendors and customers Michelle doesn't come off as a "problem customer" to me at all. She asked a lot of questions, I've answered literally 1000s of pm's from the same "window looking" customer, who didn't even end up buying anything and I still don't see that as the customer being difficult. I don't see why people are so offended by her behavior! A lot of women can't help but apologise for asking questions (during my negotiating training it was something that was brought up time and time again for us to fight to avoid). Michelle asked questions and didn't apologise for asking them, that seems to be what everyone is so offended by?

As far as I'm concerned, Ty not liking Michelle's tone should have as much bearing on this case as Michelle not liking Ty's shoes would. ie. It doesn't matter.

It's not like Ty's messages to her are flowery and sweet and she's aggressive back! He's short, and curt, and doesn't seem to think she's worth his time. So why are we so focused on the fact that Michelle questioning him on something? How often do newbies get chastised on this forum for NOT asking pertinent questions when buying an animal??

My suggestion for resolution is that Ty give Michelle the 3000$ she is owed as per the raffle terms. He missed the deadline for delivery, and has brought his honesty into question when he posted that he could have just given her one he didn't produce and not said anything. I would love to see both parties walk away from this without a bunch of heartache, but I think the continual blaming of Michelle's behavior is coming off (I really hate to say it but...) sexist. I've attempted to avoid the feeling every time it snuck in, but this needing Michelle to be sugary sweet sounds like 1950s house wife crap. Michelle had questions, she asked them... why is everyone so worked up over that?

 

[Robert Walker]

What can be done so that Ty and Michelle are closer to a decent agreement?...Going forward, what are some proposals that might satisfy both Ty and Michelle?

Do we have any indication that either party would even listen to, let alone entertain, one of our ideas/solutions?

Does anyone know or able to ask Michelle if she is open to ending this outside of court realizing she will need to meet somewhere in the middle?
Does anyone know or able to ask Ty if he is open to ending this outside of court realizing he will need to meet somewhere in the middle?? (Casey or Ming, are you able to ask him?)

Here is an example of what the "middle" could look like. The middle means not getting all of what you want or think you are entitled to :
Ty sends Michelle $1,500.00 (a figure that satisfies neither party). They both drop any further litigation like Tim suggested. They both cease all discussions/postings regarding the matter forever.

Both have lost "other" money, time, effort, etc. If you want this to end, both parties are going to have to put pride aside and take a loss. All of this could be stopped in a matter of 24hrs..."if" they wanted it to be.

 

[ElliotNess]

I don't believe Ty Park is an evil/unethical tegu farmer cackling away on his Scrooge McDuck money out to screw the next charity raffle winner. He got annoyed by Michelle's attitude and I understand perfectly where he is coming from.

I believe Michelle deserved to get the tegu she technically won. I wish you the best, but I wouldn't be surprised if you lost either. You've stalked and gathered quite a bit of "information" from Ty's facebook in order to dampen his reputation. And now he's suing you for it. You may have the favor of some "people" (a rather charitable term by the way) who are constantly abusing the BOI for not what it was unintended, but rather as an emotional outlet for some blatant issues and toxicity in their lives (ie. DavidBeard), but this is America where a juridical system is in place so we'll have to let the court decide.



Hypocritical and ironic indeed. Try seeking some sunlight.

I find your post comical. Here is why. You joined in the last 24 hours. You have 1 post. You join and don't spent the time posting in the thousands of threads here, you manage to come to the 1 thread where I am going to "go out on a limb here" and say you were told to come post in. Not only that but you come here and in your vast knowledge of Fauna, attempt to discredit it based on what you know. I know I know, long time reader - first time poster but that doesn't help either because again 1st post is this thread. Come on, no introduction post, no classifieds. Just coming to quietly support Ty.

**And just for the record, the fact that Michelle was able to get so much information from his FB page, doesn't make her a stalker. It makes her smarter than him. I did the same thing during my divorce, I won.**

Anyways, Im looking for factual information about this case if SugarHedgie or any of you internet stalkers (you know who you are) have any.

 

[Lucille]

Does anyone know or able to ask Michelle if she is open to ending this outside of court realizing she will need to meet somewhere in the middle?

Yes, I have been discussing this possibility with her. However, while I think ideas for proposals are fine and I have actually asked for them, negotiations, actual offers and acceptance are going to be discussed privately with her.

 

[kerrek]

As a an outsider looking in I see several issues on both sides case, but my experience tells me that ty will win the legal portion in the end. There are 5 main things I see going against the op here. 1. This thread. As this was stated after a suit was filed, most judges and even arbitrators see that as you asked the court to resolve the issue, and this looks like an attempt to force a resolution in spite of that. Because we have never seen a lawsuit filed where the filing attorney has a press conference to put the heat on the party they filed against (see Gloria Allred) I'm not saying that's what it is, I'm just saying that's how they often see it. 2. The raffle was for a tegu the "Will grow up to look like this" and although a matter of semantics never said prize would be produced by him. Also a matter of semantics is the whole alternate prize. Now in the case of contracts ambiguity is argued against the writer, which is ty, however as trivial as it may seem to most he did technically adhere to the strict literal writing. Actually the raffle was for two baby albino tegus to be delivered to the winners in July 2016 3. At one point on the back and forth he did say he would send the op a blue tegu from a previous clutch, which was responded with a the how do I know your not just going to get one from someone else. That will be seen by many as a refusal of a prize that specifically fits the parameters of the raffle.after all the back and forth about where the tegu was coming from you think her asking for proof is a refusal to accept it? 4. The op has posted on here multiple times that she doesn't care where the money comes from, ircf or ty, and that looks really bad to a judge or jury. Seeing that both parties were involved in the raffle her wanting one of them to make her whole is pretty understandable And 5. Is probably the most important one, as a mass resident the op was not able to legally enter said raffle and could not therefore be the recipient of any prize. Even the court told her that she could only get the raffle ticket money and filling cost back. From the conversations it appears ty didn't know this either, I'm sure he does now, and would have actually given a prize that would have been by mass law not legal. Just because Massachusetts doesn't allow raffles doesn't mean you can't enter a raffle in another state and win it.

I could be wrong but I believe ty has a non profit , in fact I'm almost positive he does, and therefore could hold the raffle legally in Florida.

Also I saw some incorrect info a few pages back I wanted to address. A case may be dismissed without prejudice only if a counter claim has not been filed. If one has been filed, as tys defamation countersuit was, it can only be granted if the countersuit has merit enough to stand on its own as a claim and therefore is redirected. Ty's counter suit was dismissed with prejudice and her original suit was dismissed at her request without prejudice.

I'm not here to pass judgement or say who's wrong or right, those are just the facts as I've seen in personal experience and from the bit of research I did. At this point I don't think pride or ego will allow arbitration, so we will see what the court says.

See bold.

 

[kerrek]

I think most people know that "produced" has more than one meaning, and insulting someones comprehension is petty.
In a legal sense it does matter what his definition was when he "produced" the terms (maybe he copied them from another raffle site) of the raffle, but he could argue all day long that, 1, he did produce albinos or that he meant produce, like "have in hand".
Someone asked about sending her the money instead of buying her tegu, I would think he could purchase a $3000 tegu in a lot of several for .50-.75 cents on the dollar.

I did not say it was required,but being disrespectful to someone who thought they were doing a great thing, (who by the way is supposed to provide you with something) would clearly not be my recommendation...??

It was my impression at the very beginning, that Michelle was very excited about having won the cash, that is why she asked for it several times.

So if I told you I'd send you a blue bar ambilobe chameleon I produced for one of your incubators you wouldn't care if I got it somewhere else and gave you zero info on it?

 

[Robert Walker]

Yes, I have been discussing this possibility with her. However, while I think ideas for proposals are fine and I have actually asked for them, negotiations, actual offers and acceptance are going to be discussed privately with her.

Good luck Lucille in your discussions.
Ultimately, there is a big difference between:
1. Wanting to end this
vs.
2. Wanting to "win" this

Ending it with a variety of concessions/compromises will come quicker, cost less, cause less headaches and only produce two losers in the end. Trying to "win" this will take longer, cost more, cause more headaches and still only produce two losers in the end.

A case of "pick your poison", money can't heal everything.

 

[snakesareawesome]

So far Ty is the winner, he's not had to give up the lizard and still got the sale of the raffle tickets. Actually, that would be an awesome business model. Create a lottery, get all the ticket money, and never pay the winner.

 

[ElliotNess]

So far Ty is the winner, he's not had to give up the lizard and still got the sale of the raffle tickets. Actually, that would be an awesome business model. Create a lottery, get all the ticket money, and never pay the winner.

Business Model Name - Criminal Enterprise