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Getting Rhino ratsnakes to eat

M

Mec23

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Any tricks getting a stubborn rhino ratsnake to eat ? I've tried floating pinkies in there water bowl, guppies, live pinkies, putting them in a small paper bag with a pinkie, leaving pinkies in the tub with them over night, assist feeding, none of the usual tricks are working... I got a pair and one strike fed for me but the other is being a pain...

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I've never worked specifically with those: I take it they're hatchlings? Sometimes offering too frequently just stresses them more...how long have you had them? Were they shipped to you? Did they both feed before you got them? if so, on what? Have you tried giving more privacy? (cover cage with a towel or paper so they can't see you, etc) I know, some snakes will turn & grab a pink that bumps their neck, while the next one gets put off by that. Can be frustrating at times, but maybe just wait a week for hunger to kick in and stress to subside? They aren't housed together are they? (that
stresses most snakes, house solo...) Plenty of hides in the cage?
 
They are hatchlings, they were shipped to me as feeding on Frozen thawed pinks, they're being kept in a rack individually on paper towel with lots of hiding spaces and fake plants. I've only had them a few weeks. I got one to eat while he was in his water bowl which from what I've read is pretty common.

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How frustrating... I assume you have feeding tongs & have also tried wiggling the f/t pinks? Sounds like they might be the type of snakes that are turned off by too much mouse scent, from what you said? (fed on f/t, fed in water-which covers the scent) When you fed f/t, did you thaw it in water? (that might help? I have a snake that's not a mouse-eater by nature & he "insists" on "washed" fuzzies, thawed in water) Every now & then I've had a snake that didn't want to eat until their f/t started getting "ripe"...it was accidental, after a long day & work, & before I could remove the offending rodent, the snake was chowing it down...I know, "ew!" but thereafter he learned to take fresh anyway. Of course, if that was the case, the seller should have told you.
I assume you haven't been handling them either? (it's always best to ensure baby snakes feed several times before any handling, as the intimidation can mess up their hunger; shipping & changing homes doesn't do them any favors either, especially if they only fed once beforehand? I assume you asked the seller?)
 
What are the temperatures in their cages? & they need lots of humidity, which is hard to do on paper towels, even with a larger water bowl. You might try offering a "humid-hide" (a plastic food container with an entrance hole cut into it, with soaked moss inside). Guess you'll have to keep trying things, "been there".
 
Another idea, since these climb a lot in the wild: some snakes feel braver pouncing on prey from a branch overhead, if you can manage to do that in the cage they have? Good luck!
 
I've kept rhinos for a few years and have had some troublesome babies as well. Including hatchlings I received has f/t pink feeders. Some of them are bulletproof right from the get go, others require a little bit more patience. And that's the key, patience. They have a hardy, tolerant species that can do well in a very simple set up. So if they're in the comfortable room temp range and they have reasonable humidity, you really don't have to worry about dialing in temperature and humidity too precisely. In fact, I found that the more I kept changing things up and playing with their environment, the longer it delayed the process, because they were never able to settle in.
When trying to get these guys to eat, it's not a species you want to disturb too frequently. Give them 4 or 5 days between feeding attempts. Even the little tiny guys can go a long time without eating and be just fine, as long as you don't overly stress them. If they don't take the pink on their own out of the water bowl, I've always had the best luck off tongs. Ideally, try to catch them at a time when they're outside of their hide. Your approach with the tongs should be slow and calm. Try just offering it up in front of them and let them smell it. Then, gently try to illicit a strike response out of them by gently nudging them on the sides with the pink's nose. Be careful not to bump them so hard or often that you cause them to flee. Usually once they go into a flee mode, they won't have interest in eating for the day.
Try to keep the pink lined up so that when they do strike the nose goes directly into the back of their mouth. If they get a good hold, they'll likely sit there with it for a while. At this point, you want to be patient again. Let them just decide what they want to do with what's in their mouth. Don't move it around to get them to pull tighter, they'll just let go. If you're able, sometimes it helps to slowly, gently let go of the pink and take a step back. Don't try to close the cage, just stay close enough to keep an eye on them. With any luck they'll decide to start eating the pink.

There's my best advice I've had luck with. Good luck!
 
pjkohn said:
I've kept rhinos for a few years and have had some troublesome babies as well. Including hatchlings I received has f/t pink feeders. Some of them are bulletproof right from the get go, others require a little bit more patience. And that's the key, patience. They have a hardy, tolerant species that can do well in a very simple set up. So if they're in the comfortable room temp range and they have reasonable humidity, you really don't have to worry about dialing in temperature and humidity too precisely. In fact, I found that the more I kept changing things up and playing with their environment, the longer it delayed the process, because they were never able to settle in.
When trying to get these guys to eat, it's not a species you want to disturb too frequently. Give them 4 or 5 days between feeding attempts. Even the little tiny guys can go a long time without eating and be just fine, as long as you don't overly stress them. If they don't take the pink on their own out of the water bowl, I've always had the best luck off tongs. Ideally, try to catch them at a time when they're outside of their hide. Your approach with the tongs should be slow and calm. Try just offering it up in front of them and let them smell it. Then, gently try to illicit a strike response out of them by gently nudging them on the sides with the pink's nose. Be careful not to bump them so hard or often that you cause them to flee. Usually once they go into a flee mode, they won't have interest in eating for the day.
Try to keep the pink lined up so that when they do strike the nose goes directly into the back of their mouth. If they get a good hold, they'll likely sit there with it for a while. At this point, you want to be patient again. Let them just decide what they want to do with what's in their mouth. Don't move it around to get them to pull tighter, they'll just let go. If you're able, sometimes it helps to slowly, gently let go of the pink and take a step back. Don't try to close the cage, just stay close enough to keep an eye on them. With any luck they'll decide to start eating the pink.

There's my best advice I've had luck with. Good luck!
Click to expand...
Thank you for responding... What temps are you keeping hatchlings at ? At room temp are you providing a heat source on one end ? I have them I'm tubs and my room is about 72. They have heat tape under a section of the tub where it gets about 85

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Mec23 said:
Thank you for responding... What temps are you keeping hatchlings at ? At room temp are you providing a heat source on one end ? I have them I'm tubs and my room is about 72. They have heat tape under a section of the tub where it gets about 85

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Click to expand...
This is what my tubs look like. I taped up the outside to help them feel even more secure
98c17e7d43eb22d66330165cd30ad2c3.jpg


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Mec23 said:
Thank you for responding... What temps are you keeping hatchlings at ? At room temp are you providing a heat source on one end ? I have them I'm tubs and my room is about 72. They have heat tape under a section of the tub where it gets about 85

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Click to expand...

Taping the tub is a good idea. A little added security I'm sure helps.
When I saw room temp, what works for me, is just whatever my Michigan room naturally happens to be. This time of the year it's 68 during the day and drops 1-2 degrees at night, and my hatchlings feed no problem. I do not personally use a heat source at all for my rhinos, but if you have the set up they can certainly benefit from a little gradient. However, I believe 85 is way too hot for rhinos, especially in such a small tub. Because your room ambient is already at a decent temp of 72, I would recommend setting your heat tape to 78. They really don't need a lot of heat, this is a very cool climate species.
Other than that, your set up looks perfect. Some good hiding and terrain options. Just get them cooled down a little, be patient with them, and once they get feeding they'll be bulletproof for you.
 
Today was feeding day and the one that's been eating took the pinky no problem the other one again no feeding response at all and since it had been a while since it had anything to eat I decided to assist feed a pinky head. It wasn't easy and the snake wanted nothing to do with it but I finally at least got something in it... I probably stressed the animal out beyond what I should have but I'm hoping if I leave it alone now for a little while it will be ok

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Believe me, I feel your pain! After 5 seasons of breeding Rhinos, I've tried a lot of things to get them to feed. Nothing works every time, and sometimes nothing works. But there are a lot of tricks.

It sounds like you are on the right track, simply be patient. They can go much longer without food than they look and if you need to go down the force-feeding road (and sometime you just have to) mouse tails are easier to feed them than pinky heads.

I've had success pushing a wet mouse tail halfway down their throat and letting them finish the rest of it, while having a pinkie ready to go so while they are willingly eating the tail, they end up eating the pinkie as well. I call it "train feeding" there are youTube videos illustrating the idea.

Don't underestimate the power of water in getting a juvenile rhino to eat. I hope one day to learn about their natural history enough to understand their relationship with water and aquatic prey, but there's a reason they take to fish and tadpoles much more aggressively than mammalian prey. I like to wait until I find the snake in the water bowl for this technique. Then offer it a pinky mouse on tongs/tweezers/hemostats/whatever and wiggle it around like a fish. I start by wiggling it just in the water, not touching the snake. Then I'll gently tap the snake and judge by its response how to proceed. If the snake leaves the water, generally the gig is up and you may as well try another day. But if you can illicit a strike, you probably have found the chink in its armor that will turn it into a confident feeder.

I have a video I made of me doing this very thing.

I've also found placing a pinky in the water with a couple fish or tadpoles may result in some feeding behavior, either eating the fish or the pinky or everything. Beyond that, just placing a pinky in the water and then pouring a small stream of water in the water bowl around it can really get them fired up and ready to hunt too. (The key I believe is finding them in their water bowl already, as opposed to putting them in the bowl.)

Patience, patience, patience. And several days between feeding trials. You'll get there.

Sincerely,

Terry Burwell
TB Snakes
 
Thank you for the reply !!! I have one feeding regularly now, he'll take thawed pinkies off hemostats no problem. The other one I've made absolutely no progress with, as soon as she sees me or a tweezer she bolts out of the tub like lighting and I have to grab her while she musks and spins and shakes her head like a lunatic, she never strikes tho. I've been force feeding her frozen thawed pieces of rat tail weekly but if I don't get it all the way in her throat she kicks it right back out. This is by far the biggest pain in the ass snake I've ever had to work with. I'm hoping that with time and size she'll start taking food on her own

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I've had to assist feed some really tiny babies in the past. The long, thin ones like BRB's and rat snakes seem to be the trickiest as they're the hardest to hold on to, plus they usually make a run for it at the worst possible moment.

One trick I've found that makes life easier is to cut the hind leg off of a f/t mouse and feed that instead of a mouse pinky, which falls apart into a yucky mess, or a rodent tail, which is much like pushing string down the snake's throat. Pick a hind leg that's an appropriate size meal, bend it at the hock, and put the hock into the snake's mouth/throat first with the cut end and foot following it. It's fairly easy to get it far back in the snake's throat by pushing gently on the long leg bone. The snake also can't spit it out easily since the leg wants to unfold, so it gets caught up in or behind the snake's teeth.

Once the snake starts to swallow it you can often sneak a mouse pinky in behind it, assuming the snake is big enough to eat both food items at once.

The remainder of the one-legged f/t mouse just gets fed off to one of my king snakes.
 
Mec23 said:
...This is by far the biggest pain in the ass snake I've ever had to work with. I'm hoping that with time and size she'll start taking food on her own...
Click to expand...

That's quite a sales pitch, lol...:D I feel your pain, I hope your efforts pay off (sooner rather than later).
 
For what it's worth, I think it's easier to tube-feed Gerber's chicken babyfood...no matter what their normal diet is, they start liking the feeling of food & decide to eat. (I've not had the "pleasure" of working with rhino rat snakes though, to be fair...but had my share of difficult snakes such as getting Western longnose snakes to eat mice instead of their usual lizards...also, newly hatched desert glossy snakes.)
 
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