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Paypal Alternatives. Help please. Seller woes

C

CatchemallSC

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Hello.
Recently have sold some animals to fund a couple projects. I am a hobbyist and by no means a reptiles business. Have a personal paypal account as I am not a business nor do sale volume like that to warrant a business account. Recently sold some surplus to fund the purchase of a pair of snakes I've always wanted. So. Make sales. Accept paypal payments. I've taken price cuts to qualified homes,sent extra quantity for buyers birthday,eaten overages in estimated shipping,because I understand the struggle and AM the little guy myself. Lol
Anytime now a buyer pays for "goods" Paypal is holding my funds for TWENTY ONE DAYS. Mind you I am shipping overnight,with tracking provided through paypal site and directly to buyer. Some items have been recieved. Call paypal customer service which is another chore of its own but they fumbled and seemed to make up reasons as the conversation progressed. They asked me if it was an eBay transaction. Obviously no. She then told me twenty one days allotted for shipment,receipt and buyer to leave feedback. Ok. I repeat this is not an eBay transaction. I have now shipped animals,had buyer recieve. Provided tracking to paypal site and had immediately upon shipment. Why are my funds held? Am I not checking the magic button. I don't want buyers to be unprotected. I don't care about eating the fees. If I can sell my own stock and fund my future project without it eating my paycheck that's my intention. 21 days....how is that fair or realistic to a seller. Let me explain to my seller I can't pay you for 21 days. My animals are in others hands,my money is at the mercy of paypal. Where is my protection. I've asked buyers to pay friends and family and suddenly I'm a jerk? I really just want to be able to utilize funds from animals I wouldn't typically even be selling. What am I missing or doing wrong with paypal? What happy safe alternatives do you recommend for buyer and seller? I guarantee live arrival and satisfaction. Has anyone experienced this,and what did you do? Thanks in advance!
 
The 21 days is part of PayPal's TOS and you agree to it when you create an account with them. Most hobbyists use it because low-volume sellers without a business license find it difficult to get set up to accept credit cards.

You could ask for payment by USPS MO but sellers would have to trust you. Since I refuse to use PayPal that's how I pay - but I also research the heck out of sellers before even sending an inquiry about the critter up for sale so I don't get ripped off. Checks are another option but you would have to wait 10-14 business days for them to clear before shipping.

Alternatively there are services such as Chase QuickPay for sending money but there is no buyer protection so again, people would have to trust you.
 
Why do you refuse to use their service if I may ask. Nonetheless 21 days... its a ridiculous policy to expect someone to be out their product and money. As a buyer I'm all for buyer protection but that is imo excessive
 
CatchemallSC said:
I've asked buyers to pay friends and family and suddenly I'm a jerk? I really just want to be able to utilize funds from animals I wouldn't typically even be selling. What am I missing or doing wrong with paypal?
Click to expand...

Well, for one thing, you are depriving them of their livelihood and your buyers of their Paypal protection by a request to pay friends/family for a commercial transaction. I have a feeling that we are not seeing the whole picture. Is your account verified by them and backed by a credit/debit card? Most sellers do not have to wait to receive funds, when I have sold items the funds are immediately in my Paypal account and if I choose to send them on to my bank they are in my bank generally by the next day.
 
CricketChitin;2[LIST said:
[/LIST]032528]I've never used it, but i've heard that *Square* is a good alternative to paypal.
https://squareup.com/
Click to expand...

I've used square, it's a good alternative but because it has less of a name in the trade, and the person would have to dispute with their credit card company, it has a bit less traction going for it.
 
Raised from the dead...Payment suggestions.

I know this is an old thread, but I am looking for payment options and this thread comes close to hitting on what I wanted to know.

I plan to sell some baby ackies and I understand that paypal does not allow payment for live animals anymore. They are already personna non grata here for some of their other policies, but now they are completely out of the question.

I see references to using Zelle and other services.

I don't mind waiting for payment, such as waiting for a check to clear, but I don't want to ask buyers to wait, nor ask them to extend their trust to an unknown entity by sending checks/MOs without some sort of assurance/protection.

What is everyone using for electronic payment and how is it working?

Thank you,
Ed
 
E.Shell said:
I know this is an old thread, but I am looking for payment options and this thread comes close to hitting on what I wanted to know.

I plan to sell some baby ackies and I understand that paypal does not allow payment for live animals anymore. They are already personna non grata here for some of their other policies, but now they are completely out of the question.

I see references to using Zelle and other services.

I don't mind waiting for payment, such as waiting for a check to clear, but I don't want to ask buyers to wait, nor ask them to extend their trust to an unknown entity by sending checks/MOs without some sort of assurance/protection.

What is everyone using for electronic payment and how is it working?

Thank you,
Ed
Click to expand...

I've don't use PayPal anymore for snake sales, I use venmo, cashapp or zelle. I look at it this way, if I don't trust the person with my money I shouldn't be buying animals from them.

I had a customer file a claim with PayPal to get a NON REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT back after they ghosted me and decided not to finish paying for the animal. Now, if they would have come to me and asked, I probably would've returned the money, they didn't though.
 
I know this isn't your question, but your question in part depends on it: I can't find any prohibition on using PP to pay for or sell live animals except for their "Alternative Payments Methods" agreement (whatever that is):

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/apm-tnc

All the 'normal' prohibited goods should be listed here, but live animals are not:

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/acceptableuse-full

I'd be interested in a citation for the claim that PP doesn't allow its services to be used for live animal sales.

I respect some of the other reasons people won't use PP, though.

To answer your question, I use PP for shipped animals, Square reader for show sales (I've only used this for less than a year now). I personally would not use Zelle as a buyer, if I'm correct in believing that Zelle does not offer any buyer protection.
 
Socratic Monologue said:
I personally would not use Zelle as a buyer, if I'm correct in believing that Zelle does not offer any buyer protection.
Click to expand...

It does not have any protection, but I'm also not buying from people I don't trust enough to send money to.

Socratic Monologue said:
I'm curious: how did that turn out?
Click to expand...

I refunded, I couldn't tie up 6k for a 150 dispute. I will no longer take PayPal for deposits or new customers. I've lost one sale because of that and they probably wouldn't have purchased anyway.
 
If you expect your total annual sales to be more than $600/year I'd recommend looking into https://www.waveapps.com/.

Wave offers free accounting services through their online portal, and make their money through credit card processing services; Stripe is the back-end processor. My overall rate last month was 3.17% (swipe fees vary by type of credit card).

I brought up the $600 threshold due to the change in 1099-K reporting requirements by merchant processors - https://wallethacks.com/600-dollar-venmo-cash-app-paypal-tax-rule/]. Wave also has a mechanism to track your expenses, making it easy to generate a balance sheet or profit/loss statement so that even if you do get a 1099-K you can show the reported amount wasn't all taxable profit.
 
E.Shell said:
I understand that paypal does not allow payment for live animals anymore.
Click to expand...

Years ago it was true, but EVERY year PayPal updates its TOS, including policy changes. Here is this year's list of ineligible items:

Ineligible items and transactions

The following items or transactions are not eligible for PayPal’s Purchase Protection program:
Real estate, including residential property
Vehicles, including, but not limited to, motor vehicles, motorcycles, recreational vehicles, aircraft, and boats, except for personally portable light vehicles used for recreational purposes like bicycles and wheeled hoverboards
Businesses (when you buy or invest in a business)
Industrial machinery used in manufacturing
Payments that are equivalent to cash, including stored value items such as gift cards and pre-paid cards
Payments made in respect of gold (whether in physical form or exchange-traded form)
Financial products or investments of any kind
Gambling, gaming, and/or any other activities with an entry fee and a prize
Donations, including payments on crowdfunding platforms as well as payments made on crowdlending platforms
Payments to a state-run body (except for state-owned enterprises), government agencies, or third parties acting on behalf of state-run bodies or government agencies
Payments to any bill payment service
Significantly Not as Described claims for wholly or partly custom-made items
Item Not Received claims for physical, tangible items you collect in person or arrange to be collected on your behalf. This includes items bought in a seller’s point of sale location, except if you paid for the transaction in person using PayPal’s goods and services QR code
Anything prohibited by PayPal’s Acceptable Use Policy
Payments made using PayPal Payouts (formerly Mass Pay)
Personal Payments including payments sent using PayPal’s friends and family functionality
Payments that you have not sent using your PayPal account
Items intended for resale, including single item transactions or transactions that include multiple items.

Note that live animals are not on the list. Also note. however, that prohibited are items prohibited in the Acceptable Use Policy. While live animals are not on that list either, illegal items are, so if your reptile should by legally prohibited in a certain jurisdiction you will not have protection. Please note that the updates are annual, so that you should as a buyer or seller check the annual updates.

There IS a prohibition against live animals using Alternative Payment Methods, detailed here:

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/apm-tnc
 
Socratic Monologue said:
I know this isn't your question, but your question in part depends on it: I can't find any prohibition on using PP to pay for or sell live animals except for their "Alternative Payments Methods" agreement (whatever that is):

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/apm-tnc

All the 'normal' prohibited goods should be listed here, but live animals are not:

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/acceptableuse-full

I'd be interested in a citation for the claim that PP doesn't allow its services to be used for live animal sales.

I respect some of the other reasons people won't use PP, though.
Click to expand...
Thank you for bringing that up. I will admit to seeing/parroting comments to that effect and not actually reading the terms. I have an inactive PP account, but stopped using them following other policy changes.
To answer your question, I use PP for shipped animals, Square reader for show sales (I've only used this for less than a year now).
Click to expand...
Does the Square system allow one to process a remote card?
I personally would not use Zelle as a buyer, if I'm correct in believing that Zelle does not offer any buyer protection.
Click to expand...
I didn't fully understand their site, but kept seeing a notation "1" next to key statements and ran out of patience without ever finding the footnote.
 
bcr229 said:
If you expect your total annual sales to be more than $600/year I'd recommend looking into https://www.waveapps.com/.

Wave offers free accounting services through their online portal, and make their money through credit card processing services; Stripe is the back-end processor. My overall rate last month was 3.17% (swipe fees vary by type of credit card).

I brought up the $600 threshold due to the change in 1099-K reporting requirements by merchant processors - https://wallethacks.com/600-dollar-venmo-cash-app-paypal-tax-rule/]. Wave also has a mechanism to track your expenses, making it easy to generate a balance sheet or profit/loss statement so that even if you do get a 1099-K you can show the reported amount wasn't all taxable profit.
Click to expand...
Thank you. I appreciate your suggestion and will look into that. The law is a definite consideration and having a built-in ability to cleanly account for sales revenue is a plus.
 
Lucille said:
Years ago it was true, but EVERY year PayPal updates its TOS, including policy changes. Here is this year's list of ineligible items:

Ineligible items and transactions
<snip>
...list...
</snip>
Note that live animals are not on the list. Also note. however, that prohibited are items prohibited in the Acceptable Use Policy. While live animals are not on that list either, illegal items are, so if your reptile should by legally prohibited in a certain jurisdiction you will not have protection. Please note that the updates are annual, so that you should as a buyer or seller check the annual updates.

There IS a prohibition against live animals using Alternative Payment Methods, detailed here:

https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/apm-tnc
Click to expand...
Thank you Lucille, I appreciate your help. I was probably confused in the discussions I saw and the APM rules.
 
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