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09 New Morph ????

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phoenixboa

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I got very lucky this year. I bred a 100% het. albino female with a pastel 66% het. albino male. I was hoping to produce some pastel albinos, but the male did not prove out to be het albino. What I got was a litter with aberrant patterns, chains & stripes. Neither of the parents have any signs of these in their patterns. The babies are 50% het albino & some are pastel. This is an unproven new morph, won't be able to prove out until 2011 possibly 2012. My friend Rich told me to hold on to the litter til after I can prove them out myself. But with 35 babies there are too many to hold on to. They been eating great, will come with all records. I think that this will turn out to be a co-dominant trait, like the Roswell and the Scoria boa. I don't know of any recessive traits that have come out of 2 normal looking parents, but I could be wrong. I'am asking $2500 for her. Payments plans available and may consider trades. You can read more about the parents on the link: phoenixboaproject.com Thank you for looking. Bruce Essig 602-525-1227
 
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This looks alot like the cyclone boas from BBC Exotics. Do you know the lineage of the mother and father. Like steve said their are alot of "hets" out there that get sold as normals in lots. I'm not trying to bash you but, to say after just one breeding you have a new morph "a little soon". You sould hold them back and find out what you really have. Good luck. Oh, they are pretty cool boas though.
 
He can ask whatever he wants for the animals...none of us have any right to question his prices...

But, I do agree that there isn't nearly enough evidence to claim it to be a new morph but he was very clear in his ad that it was unproven and there haven't been any repeat pairings yet. Seems to be a pretty honest representation to me.
 
vonnick52 said:
He can ask whatever he wants for the animals...none of us have any right to question his prices...

But, I do agree that there isn't nearly enough evidence to claim it to be a new morph but he was very clear in his ad that it was unproven and there haven't been any repeat pairings yet. Seems to be a pretty honest representation to me.
Click to expand...

He can post what ever he wants but it is nice to inform people that they could possibly drop a lot of money on a possible normal they can get for $100.00. Im just trying to keep a look out.
 
It couldn't be co-dominant, dominant or incomplete dominant if they were produced from normal parents. That's not how the inheritance of those three work. More then likely it is an environmental thing that caused the aberrations in pattern if the parents prove not heterozygous for anything existing. They are pretty cool looking regardless.
 
I thought they kinda looked like some of the Nova boa offspring, just without the hypo. There's so many 50% & 66% hets cruising around right now, lots of crazy stuff will continue to pop out. Only solid records and single adult breedings will indicate what genetics really hold & prove out, and even then integrity is the key ingredient.

Based on what I see from the parents, it seems a bit odd that 35/35 made it healthy & all carried similar characteristics. Only time & proving them out will determine the genetics, but they are pretty tight looking, especially for pattern freaks. BTW- I for darn sure wish all my females would drop 35 healthy babies!!!

-Chuck

PS Tell Rich he should buy some, maybe give him a huge discount on the whole litter...you own the factory!!!
 
The aberrant zigzag stripes are very nice...outstanding patterns there:)



I also wanted to mention one thing, the Roswell boas are not believed to be codominant...

So far, all signs are pointing to the mutation as an incomplete dominant...with the striped Roswells being the super form of the laddertail/connected pattern appearance of the parents.

A few more pairings are needed to be certain, but so far, laddertail X laddertail has produced a mix of Roswells, laddertails, and normals. The more recent laddertail X normal pairings made half laddertails, half normals...
 
Thank you for all the feedback. I don't have any info on the lineage, just what I bought them as. The female is a 100% het proven, so that helped, that's how I knew it was the male that didn't prove out to be a het. abino. I read about the Novas, so I called Jeff and he said that he thought it to be a temp. thing, but i really don't see how with all the babies coming out so well. I talked to Rich at the beginning of breeding season and followed the temps that he uses. I told Jeff that and he said that's the reason why Rich throws so many different patterns as well. I couldn't have asked for a better litter. The reason why I didn't say anything about the Nova thing is because when I talked to Jeff he said that if it was a new morph I couldn't have had so many of them in one litter. I'm still working on a website, kind of a mess ( not very good at this stuff yet), you'll see that I have another new morph that I'm working on and it did throw half a litter. I didn't produce the first litter, I bought the parents and all the offspring from it. One thing about the snakes is if you ask 10 different people about something, you get 20 different answers, so I don't try to step on anyones toes, and that's why i think that so many differnt snakes look alike. I do think they look close to a Nova boa, now he has hypo in he's litter, but I have Kahl abino, and pastel ( don't know what line) which is another co-dom trait, but I couldn't see charging $5000 to $7000 for a unproven possiable trait. So I agree that it does seem like alot of money, but nothing for what they look like. I've already sold, the reason why is that the price isn't to high for the risk if they turn out to be a recessive trait. I'am still new to the computer stuff, so I tried to delete the Roswell part out of my posting, but I couldn't, very sorry. And thank you for squareing me away on the Roswell thing, really thank you. I'am going to be doing this for quite some time and believe me the last thing I want to do is mislead people in any way, when I started out it was just a mess, because I didn't know alot about genetics and was dealing with people that were looking for a quick buck or had messed up animals. Since then I have met alot of nice and honest people over time and it was a Godsend. On a serious note, if I can help answer any questions or if you can help me on anything I might have wrong, please drop a e-mail or call. Thank you again and please check out my site (http://www.phoenixboaproject.com), I will be working on it more this weekend, Bruce Essig
 
ilovemylizard said:
The aberrant zigzag stripes are very nice...outstanding patterns there:)



I also wanted to mention one thing, the Roswell boas are not believed to be codominant...

So far, all signs are pointing to the mutation as an incomplete dominant...with the striped Roswells being the super form of the laddertail/connected pattern appearance of the parents.

A few more pairings are needed to be certain, but so far, laddertail X laddertail has produced a mix of Roswells, laddertails, and normals. The more recent laddertail X normal pairings made half laddertails, half normals...
Click to expand...

Last I checked, Co-Dominant has a super form while Incomplete Dominant may have a super form that is not visually different from the non super. Hypos are considered Incomplete Dominant. I would think going from a Laddertail to a Roswell would be something other than Incomplete Dominant.


Nice litter but abberant litters pop up every year.
 
Bryon, you're confusing Incomplete Dominant with Dominant. Incomplete Dominant is a different form of Co-Dominance. For example, in ball pythons, Spiders are Dominant while Pastels are Incomplete Dominant. For an animal to be just Co-Dominant the heterozygous must express, in equal parts, the Homozygous and non-Heterozygous (normal) mutation (an example of this would be how a Pied is Normal and White, if it were not recessive, that would be considered Co-Dominant if the Homozygous was a solid white snake)...While Incomplete Dominant is a blend of the Homozygous and non-Heterozygous (normal) mutation.
 
I just moved a few of the babies and lowered the prices on the rest. Please look at the webshots( http://pets.webshots.com/album/572893356tMzudt ) and see what's still available. I'll consider trades and offers. phoenixboaproject.com is my website and I'll start working on it tomarrow, so please check it out. Thank you all very much, Bruce Essig 602-525-1227.
 
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