Info Just got this from SYR

[deborahbroadus]

Re: Post 219..

Hi Lonnie, thanks for the email. Snake shipments get flagged mostly by self exposure on the customer's part. There is nothing on our site, account or labeling that causes any packages to be flagged.

Am I the only one that has a problem with this statement?

Why would self-exposure be a problem if they had a waiver AND were approved to be shipping snakes for others?

IMO, A waiver negates the need to be secretive.

 

[brd7666]

Re: Post 219..



Am I the only one that has a problem with this statement?

Why would self-exposure be a problem if they had a waiver AND were approved to be shipping snakes for others?

IMO, A waiver negates the need to be secretive.

BINGO

 

[bwt501]

The reason for secrecy was more to protect your shipment from uneducated UPS workers that just finished watching Snakes On A Plane and think that your juvie garter snakes is going to bust out of the box and sink its 4 inch venomous fangs into them. They could have all the waivers they want but its not gonna stop someone who refuses to touch a box because there is a snake inside. My snakes are in my basement and i have friends and family that wont come into my house at all.(Works in my favor alot!) Its a hassle that SYR wanted you to avoid if possible so they recommend being a little hush hush about whats in the box. I understand that.

 

[deborahbroadus]

The reason for secrecy was more to protect your shipment from uneducated UPS workers that just finished watching Snakes On A Plane and think that your juvie garter snakes is going to bust out of the box and sink its 4 inch venomous fangs into them. They could have all the waivers they want but its not gonna stop someone who refuses to touch a box because there is a snake inside. My snakes are in my basement and i have friends and family that wont come into my house at all.(Works in my favor alot!) Its a hassle that SYR wanted you to avoid if possible so they recommend being a little hush hush about whats in the box. I understand that.

Illogical.

If there is a waiver...this means that the shipments are APPROVED..thus the employees are accountable for doing that they have been TOLD to do by the people that approved the waiver. I doubt that a lot of people want to be fired for not doing what they were told to do.

 

[bwt501]

A fear is a big thing to overcome for alot of people. To us its irrational, but i have seen people freak out in the presence of snakes to the point that i thought they would go into cardiac arrest. Were not talking about a soldier in battle refusing a direct order. No one at UPS would get fired because they began to hyperventilate when they found out a snake is in their truck.

 

[Southern Wolf]

I was responding to your claim that he wouldn't be liable if someone else posted his email.

As for getting certified, I rarely ship, but I might look into it. SYR has been a very good service for me because up to now, it has worked for me, but I don't ship snakes. I keep and rehab lizards. I will probably wait all this out as well, though.

It is my understanding.... so someone correct me if Im wrong.... all you need is your own UPS account to ship lizards... no certification needed.

 

[StrictlyExotics]

Since everything being said is primarily opinion, I will share mine. Personally, I do think that SYR had some pull with UPS regarding snake shipments. It may have been a little suspect at best, but I think there was some sort of waiver. Now, with that being said, I dont know what that waiver stated. The reason I believe this is for a couple of situations, one in particular, that I had with them.

I am sure a lot of you remember when I shipped out my Albino Boa and UPS could not find it. Well, my box was clearly labeled and it was a larger sized package (almost 16 pounds). For some odd reason, my package ended up in Dallas which my packages never go to. They usually go to Arkansas, then to the hub for overnight shipments.

Now that I think about it, I will bet that the package was most likely inspected by UPS before it ended up at its final destination. A 16 pound snake package would draw red flags to me if I was UPS. I couldnt get answers for my package when I called UPS but, I did get answers from SYR and he said the package should show back up in the system the following day. I did comply with SYR regulations regarding snake shipments as I do remember something on their website stating that a shipped snake could not be more than 5-6 ft. I will admit that I was really close to those limits though.

When I took my snake packages to the UPS hub here in OKC, they KNEW what I was shipping because they specifically asked me as well as the box being labeled. They never seemed to have issue with me doing so. If they in fact were NOT allowed to ship snakes, and my boxes were clearly labeled with "python" or "boa", why would they let them through. I even STOPPED having problems with my local UPS Store because they looked up the acct.

Now, I am not suggesting that will continue to do business as usual, as I will not be until this mess is cleared up. I hope people will NOT look at my example and decide "hey, I am going to take the chance". I personally dont want to see more bad guy threads because people took the chance and wont refund they buyers money if something happens.

For those of you that are FedEX verified, and havent used SYR or never planned to, thats great for you guys. Just remember though, having another option is always a good thing. I would HATE for there only to be one option in anything I do, only because I am against monopolization.

SYR, if legit, was a positive thing for the reptile industry. Its sad to think that, if legit, a couple of lousy people may have taken this option away from us, the consumer.

While UPS has its downsides, it also has it upsides too. One in particular, you can ship to residences instead of only business addresses. I have received both packages and I have had just as many problems with receiving FedEX packages at the FedEX facility as I have with shipping via SYR.

Its a tough business right now and this is definitely going to make it a little tougher for everyone, regardless of who you ship through. I am going to venture to say, soon, only Delta Dash will be the only way we will be able to ship. I hope the opposite is true for everyones sake, however, I dont feel this will be the case.

 

[Diego Velarde]

Days before SYR

Before SYR got started I remember getting a few of my snakes delivered by UPS. I think some one here mentioned that breeders have been doing this for many years now. My question to all of you (sellers and buyers) is:
Will you still consider using UPS to ship or received snakes using you're own account? Yes you wont be getting the nice discount from SYR but you can still have a back-up plan other then FedEx.
IMO, If the shipper is not FedEx certified yet and offers to use UPS (not via SYR) and still guarantees delivery and live arrival I will still buy the snake.
It sucks that many people are not FedEx certified yet and will have to freeze their sales because they are not able to ship.

 

[StrictlyExotics]

Before SYR got started I remember getting a few of my snakes delivered by UPS. I think some one here mentioned that breeders have been doing this for many years now. My question to all of you (sellers and buyers) is:
Will you still consider using UPS to ship or received snakes using you're own account? Yes you wont be getting the nice discount from SYR but you can still have a back-up plan other then FedEx.
IMO, If the shipper is not FedEx certified yet and offers to use UPS (not via SYR) and still guarantees delivery and live arrival I will still buy the snake.
It sucks that many people are not FedEx certified yet and will have to freeze their sales because they are not able to ship.

Regardless of live arrival guarantee or not, if someone is illegally shipping me a package, I will not accept it. This contributes to the problem and it will not help in fight to educate people or for reptile awareness. Thsi should be UNACCEPTABLE to everyone, not just me.

 

[Southern Wolf]

this is the response Robyn sent me in response to me asking if they are being flagged or scrutinized any extra. For everyone wishes to call me a moron, tell me i'm part of the problem, turns my box red (ouch!) , i'm just stating that this almost seems to be a non issue at SYR. Why in the world would they not put a banner up on their site telling people not to ship snakes? Like i stated before, over the past three days how many new customers signed up with them and shipped unaware of the warning that was only sent to existing cutomers. I am a responsible shipper. Shipping snakes was NEVER allowed by UPS. But we did it. We all did it. Looooooong before SYR ever came about. Were you all part of the problem then? The only incentive to go with FedEx was their efficiency. I'm sure it wasn't your conscience weighing heavy on your head about bending the rules by shipping with UPS.

I have NEVER shipped a snake via USP either directly or thru SYR's. When I started shippping I did it the right way... I got certified so I dont have to hide anything. Does that make me better than others... nope... it just means that I TRY to follow the rules. There may be a moment in time that the whole industry is a black market... at that time.... I cant say what I will do.

But right now I am trying to do the right thing.

 

[Southern Wolf]

Re: Post 219..



Am I the only one that has a problem with this statement?

Why would self-exposure be a problem if they had a waiver AND were approved to be shipping snakes for others?

IMO, A waiver negates the need to be secretive.

where's the clapping smilie... guess this will have to do

two thumbs up

 

[deborahbroadus]

A fear is a big thing to overcome for alot of people. To us its irrational, but i have seen people freak out in the presence of snakes to the point that i thought they would go into cardiac arrest. Were not talking about a soldier in battle refusing a direct order. No one at UPS would get fired because they began to hyperventilate when they found out a snake is in their truck.

That may be true, but shipments aren't being stopped because workers are "hyperventilating"; they are being stopped because it's against the rules....

thus back to the logical argument...why does anyone have to be secretive?

Dean's example is perhaps an example of some workers who did NOT know that it was against policy and assumed that an account made everything fine?

 

[Southern Wolf]

The reason for secrecy was more to protect your shipment from uneducated UPS workers that just finished watching Snakes On A Plane and think that your juvie garter snakes is going to bust out of the box and sink its 4 inch venomous fangs into them. They could have all the waivers they want but its not gonna stop someone who refuses to touch a box because there is a snake inside. My snakes are in my basement and i have friends and family that wont come into my house at all.(Works in my favor alot!) Its a hassle that SYR wanted you to avoid if possible so they recommend being a little hush hush about whats in the box. I understand that.

Actually it will stop those that refuse to touch it.. because at that point... they dont have a choice. There is a document that says they MUST accept the package.

 

[brd7666]

It is my understanding.... so someone correct me if Im wrong.... all you need is your own UPS account to ship lizards... no certification needed.

This is what you can ship through UPS, regardless of who you are.

Reptiles (Limited to the following):
- Lizards: Examples: chameleons, geckos, iguanas, monitors, flying dragons
- Turtles: freshwater turtles (except: snapping turtles), land tortoises, sea turtles

 

[Abby]

That may be true, but shipments aren't being stopped because workers are "hyperventilating"; they are being stopped because it's against the rules....

thus back to the logical argument...why does anyone have to be secretive?

Dean's example is perhaps an example of some workers who did NOT know that it was against policy and assumed that an account made everything fine?

My hub knows I ship snakes, and they never said anything about it being against the rules. I haven't even had to tell them about SYR. Could be coincidence, but I would think all workers would be aware of the rules.

 

[StrictlyExotics]

Actually it will stop those that refuse to touch it.. because at that point... they dont have a choice. There is a document that says they MUST accept the package.

Kevin, I would tend to think that if you are talking about the Corporate hubs, you might be right however, if they are franchise locations, I would imagine that they can and will refuse packages based on their discretion.

 

[StrictlyExotics]

My hub knows I ship snakes, and they never said anything about it being against the rules. I haven't even had to tell them about SYR. Could be coincidence, but I would think all workers would be aware of the rules.

Like Abby, my hub knew I was shipping snakes and so did my local franchise location. My franchise location gave me an issue the very first time I used them however, stopped once they talked to someone at UPS. All of my packages have gone out through the same location now and I havent had one incident shipping through them since.

This is why I DO feel that they personally had some sort of waiver. However, I do NOT think that waiver covered all of the others who shipped under their acct number, which is basically what we were all doing.

 

[Shadera]

Kevin, I would tend to think that if you are talking about the Corporate hubs, you might be right however, if they are franchise locations, I would imagine that they can and will refuse packages based on their discretion.

If they want to lose their franchise.

But that is IF it's legit in the first place.

 

[bwt501]

That may be true, but shipments aren't being stopped because workers are "hyperventilating"; they are being stopped because it's against the rules....

thus back to the logical argument...why does anyone have to be secretive?

Dean's example is perhaps an example of some workers who did NOT know that it was against policy and assumed that an account made everything fine?

I have to disagree. When SYR sat down with executives at UPS (this had to happen, we are talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars), do you think UPS thought this entity wasnt going to ship snakes? no one at UPS is acvtively seeking out snake shipments. i would venture to say that almost every incident arises from fearful employees that encounter a box making some crinkling sounds against the crumbled newspaper inside the box.

 

[Diego Velarde]

Regardless of live arrival guarantee or not, if someone is illegally shipping me a package, I will not accept it. This contributes to the problem and it will not help in fight to educate people or for reptile awareness. Thsi should be UNACCEPTABLE to everyone, not just me.

Dean, I completely understand your point of view. Okay let me re-phrase my Q. Before SYR and Before FedEx certification how were you breeders that have been in the biz for many years shipped your animals?
I really want to know how it worked. Like I mentioned, when I first started building my collection most of the snakes got delivered via UPS, and I bought them from very reputable breeders since I was scared of getting scammed. I've only been in the hobby for 3 yrs so I'm not sure how shipping was done before. I know many people dont want to do anything against regulations and etc but this hobby is very old and I just cant see people driving 300 plus miles every time they sell or buy a snake.