Bad Guy tinmantribe5 - Shawn Lewis

[StrictlyExotics]

i would like to let other people know that the beardies that came the first time 2 of the 4 lived 5 to 7 days and shriveled away but we choose not to say anything because shawn was friends with amanda and don’t like to make waves with his friends .the videos were all shot when he first got them and had not got a chance to get the uv lights and yes he did take amandas advice on cutting up the greens and getting the uv lights because it was his first time having beardies and that is why he made the video to amanda to make sure he was doing right buy them . the video was to get advice in caring for the beardies not to be used by poking fun of! the sad thing is the only beardies that have died out of all of ours is 3 of the ones recieved from amanda!

Sorry but friend or not, I would have said something as soon as it happened. Personally, as a friend, I would want to know if something were wrong with what I was sending out to my so-called friend. Also, why would you go back and purchase MORE from someone that sent you animals that died in a few days? That doesnt make sense to me.

Ben, the dragons did not die months later like Amanda kept saying? They died 5-7 days later and the newest one died 10 days after it was received? No offense, but I probably would have snapped myself if I paid for 3 dragons and they died in that short of time from arrival. Amanda, you really might want to change your TOS to maybe a 7 day health guarantee instead of 3 days and definitely change your shipping practices. Friend or not, I would have probably snapped worse then Shawn if that happened to me.

Andrea, I think the difference between Shawn, Ben and the rest of us simple really... 1) We would at least mention the dead animals, regardless of a TOS and 2) We would no longer do business with that person if this really were the case. I could not see myself selling you a snake, it dies 3 days AFTER my TOS has expired, you coming back to me stating that it died, me doing nothing about it since we are friends and all, and you buying another one from me months later.

Something just doesnt quite add up here.

 

[AndreaH]

Aleria, I am in no way excusing how Shawn handled it. I am just saying that I would have snapped also, but probably a little nicer on how I would word my anger. Shawn had no right to name call her, cuss at her, and etc. but I do understand why he snapped. How I would have dealt with it is pretty simple, PayPal the money back to his account with an apology that the dragon didnt make it. The ball then would be in his court on whether or not he accepted the apology and the money. That is how I would have dealt with this situation before it became this BOI thread.

 

[Sissy's Midwest Morphs]

Shawn did provide her pictures through E-mail, (your going off of here say ) . All i can do is learn i should have just said something but it was shawns friend was trying to keep the peace . You live and learn I accept not telling her sorry

 

[DAND]

So are you saying that because she purchased an animal from a "friend" she doesn't have a legimate complaint?

I was addressing Ben hence quoting his post.

But to answer your question, if she purchased it and the resold it, it would be her responsibility as far as I am concerned. But, if the person who purchased it from her didn't have the proper knowledge of husbandry to maintain the dragon then I don't see her being at fault, unless she knew beforehand that the person she was selling the animal to was not properly versed in the animal's proper husbandry.

 

[StrictlyExotics]

Shawn did provide her pictures through E-mail, (your going off of here say ) . All i can do is learn i should have just said something but it was shawns friend was trying to keep the peace . You live and learn I accept not telling her sorry

The only hearsay that I am going off of is what you are stating in Shawns absence. You stated that other dragons died and no one told Amanda about it, until now.

See Ben, this is what I do not understand, comprehend, etc.. You state that dragons died within days of receiving them and it was the OPs fault (hearsay) unless you have some sort of proof that shipping caused their untimely death. You then, months later, purchase another dragon. Ever think that had you mentioned something when the other dragons died, maybe we wouldnt be here because of another bought and paid for dragon but maybe a free one.

Another thing, why is it that from all the posts that I have seen here, the only dragons Amanda has sent out that are dying is the group(s) you guys got from her? Again, something is just not adding up to me.

 

[deborahbroadus]

I was addressing Ben hence quoting his post.

But to answer your question, if she purchased it and the resold it, it would be her responsibility as far as I am concerned. But, if the person who purchased it from her didn't have the proper knowledge of husbandry to maintain the dragon then I don't see her being at fault, unless she knew beforehand that the person she was selling the animal to was not properly versed in the animal's proper husbandry.

My mistake, thanks for the clarification. I agree with you 110%

 

[AndreaH]

Andrea, I think the difference between Shawn, Ben and the rest of us simple really... 1) We would at least mention the dead animals, regardless of a TOS and 2) We would no longer do business with that person if this really were the case. I could not see myself selling you a snake, it dies 3 days AFTER my TOS has expired, you coming back to me stating that it died, me doing nothing about it since we are friends and all, and you buying another one from me months later.

Something just doesnt quite add up here.
I had a very similar experience with a dragon except it was not shipped. I bought the baby red leather back at the reptile expo. I had that dragon for 31 days and then on the 31st day I came home from work to find it dead in its enclosure. I had just saw the breeder the day right before and told him she was doing great, but the next day she died. No none reason because she showed no health problems and I had her set up exactly like my babies from my own breeders, but yet she still died. I didnt say anything to the breeder until 2 weeks later because I did not want to cause much of a fuss and it was well over normal TOS. He emailed me to see how she was doing and I told him that she had died the day after I saw him at the show. To my own surprise, he told me he would replace her for free. I thought that was very kind of him to do so. Was I hesitant over the new baby, well of course. Did I keep her away from my other dragons, of course. I have now had her for 3 months and everything is fine and perfect with her. I was also willing to take the hit over the money because I didnt want to start any kind of fuss with another breeder, so I can understand why he went back. The only part that differs is he knew I had proper knowledge of care and yes, somethings we disagreed on when it came to what brand of lights and so on. Can I understand why Shawn went back, yes because they were friends regardless.

 

[aleria]

Andrea, I think the difference between Shawn, Ben and the rest of us simple really... 1) We would at least mention the dead animals, regardless of a TOS and 2) We would no longer do business with that person if this really were the case. I could not see myself selling you a snake, it dies 3 days AFTER my TOS has expired, you coming back to me stating that it died, me doing nothing about it since we are friends and all, and you buying another one from me months later.

Something just doesnt quite add up here.
I had a very similar experience with a dragon except it was not shipped. I bought the baby red leather back at the reptile expo. I had that dragon for 31 days and then on the 31st day I came home from work to find it dead in its enclosure. I had just saw the breeder the day right before and told him she was doing great, but the next day she died. No none reason because she showed no health problems and I had her set up exactly like my babies from my own breeders, but yet she still died. I didnt say anything to the breeder until 2 weeks later because I did not want to cause much of a fuss and it was well over normal TOS. He emailed me to see how she was doing and I told him that she had died the day after I saw him at the show. To my own surprise, he told me he would replace her for free. I thought that was very kind of him to do so. Was I hesitant over the new baby, well of course. Did I keep her away from my other dragons, of course. I have now had her for 3 months and everything is fine and perfect with her. I was also willing to take the hit over the money because I didnt want to start any kind of fuss with another breeder, so I can understand why he went back. The only part that differs is he knew I had proper knowledge of care and yes, somethings we disagreed on when it came to what brand of lights and so on. Can I understand why Shawn went back, yes because they were friends regardless.

And that is also where the difference lies between your situation stated above and this one. When Shawn was questioned as to the details of his husbandry rather than just explaining his setup and what he was doing it was stated that he blew up and started with all the name calling, etc.
He did not make it possible for there to be a resolution. If I sold an animal to anyone and they came to me, even outside the dates of the TOS, and told me it had died. I would not just up and give them a new animal or refund without questioning their husbandry and attempting to get as much information as possible as to how the animal might have died. Not even bothering to do that much and then just sending out a replacement no questions asked could mean you are just sending yet another animal to it's death over a simple matter of improper husbandry. But there is no way to know for sure without asking, and the OP did just that, and was cussed out for doing so.

 

[AndreaH]

As I said before to you Aleria, I am not in anyway saying what he was right. I was not asked by the breeder because we had already discussed our knowledge of dragon keeping at the previous show the day before my red leather back died. The one question that none of us have asked is does Amanda have proper knowledge of keeping bearded dragon babies? Did the person she buy them from have proper knowledge? With the first group of dragon she sent to Shawn, did she go over the proper care or send any information with the first group? Sometimes if you send a care sheet along with the dragons arguments like this wouldnt happen. This is the 3rd baby that has died in such a short time and that is why I say shipping is IMO what caused the untimely death.

 

[AndreaH]

Sorry meant to say " saying what he said was right'

 

[hhmoore]

Andrea, is there a reason you are pursuing this in both threads?

 

[AndreaH]

I was just replying back to Aleria statement and that was all Herald. Trust me, I dont like going back and forth myself.

 

[StrictlyExotics]

As I said before to you Aleria, I am not in anyway saying what he was right. I was not asked by the breeder because we had already discussed our knowledge of dragon keeping at the previous show the day before my red leather back died. The one question that none of us have asked is does Amanda have proper knowledge of keeping bearded dragon babies? Did the person she buy them from have proper knowledge? With the first group of dragon she sent to Shawn, did she go over the proper care or send any information with the first group? Sometimes if you send a care sheet along with the dragons arguments like this wouldnt happen. This is the 3rd baby that has died in such a short time and that is why I say shipping is IMO what caused the untimely death.

I understand what you are saying about telling a breeder or not however, from all the dragons she has sent out, it seems the only ones dying are Shawns. I know Becky bought some from her and they are still thriving. I just remember the post that Becky posted and stated this. I am sure there are others but, I do not know if thats 100% the case.

Amandas shipping situation is subpar, at best but the problem I have is why is it that Shawns are only dragons dying and he is most likely the only one on a payment plan as well. These are the things that do not add up for me.

I would almost be that Amanda made a mistake and assumed that Shawn knew how to take care of dragons as well, so she probably didnt go over basic care with him. I know that a lot of times I assume people know what they are doing enough to get them by. However, I see that I should not be overlooking basic care anymore so I have learned something from this thread as well.

 

[Lucille]

that most people can't stand .

At first glance, the following comment may seem off topic. It is not, your characterization of the thoughtful person you attempted to put down reflects back on you. You know, sometimes getting a ding is not a way to hurt you, it is a way to show you a difference of opinion, and the comments can help. People have to care to leave a comment, if they didn't, they just wouldn't bother.

Unless you have polled 'most people' you are blowing smoke up.

I don't mind at all on the BOI when people are called out for something they have done, or for specific character flaws. But vague descriptions such as the above are merely attempts at character assassination.

You can apologize for the comment and gain stature, it is hard to admit doing wrong.

You can let it go.

But if you do it again, you better be ready for a (verbal) new one.

I've said it about a million times, let this be million and one: the manner in which a person responds to a misfortune, is the true measure of a man. Or woman.

 

[bekers71]

Yes, I have 2 beardeds and 2 leos from Amanda. Matter of fact, I traded Amanda snakes for the geckos and lizards. Never once have I had an issue with any of them. The leos have bred and hatched beautiful babies and the beardeds are growing fast. I would be more than happy to provide pictures of when they arrived here and current pics to those who want to see. But that would have to be done via PM or email as it wouldn't be appropriate to post them on this thread.

A while back I bought a sub adult bearded dragon from some one else on this forum who was going out of business. Once the girl arrived, she didn't want to eat, was very slow moving and had a nice case of internal parasites. After contacting the breeder and getting a few emails back, the breeder stopped answering my emails and my concerns. I asked Amanda for advice and we had a very lengthy email conversation about what I should do. I tried the advice she suggested and my girl is gaining weight, much more active than before and parasite free. There have been times when Amanda has had questions about snakes, husbandry or genetics wise, and has come to me. She has been open to listen to my advice and appreciative. IMO it's these actions/questions that show me the person I am dealing with cares about their reptiles.

Amanda already stated she would fix the shipping issue. So there's really nothing more to add to that. As far as the animals that died, it was Shawns responsibility to contact Amanda ASAP if there were indeed some thing wrong with them, not months later. Friend or no friend. Maybe if that had happened things wouldn't have gotten this far out of hand.

 

[deborahbroadus]

So I get bad Karma from Miss Deb, that most people can't stand even Shawn cusses her daily. She says "do the right thing" well Deb just what is the right thing to you?

The 3 day guarantee was up but I was going to replace it anyway since we were friends but Shawn did NOT want that, so please come step up and post what the right thing is, when it wasn't even me that killed the dragon!

Again go look and see what is killing his dragons..

It's not about what is killing his dragons, and I don't know about Shawn "cussing me daily" because he just left me some good Karma before he was banned (this can be proven, but your statement can not). Perhaps you know him better than I.

But if he's actually doing what you say (cussing me out, daily), you have just revealed how deeply YOUR and HIS dysfunctionalism goes. I would never have revealed what a friend says about someone else "behind their back;" that's for the friend to reveal.

Your behavior has ABSOLUTELY put you on my DO NOT BUY FROM or SELL TO list.


*Doing the right thing, would have been just giving him another dragon as you repeated over and over that you would have. His behavior should not have any effect on your decision since you still call him FRIEND.

I give my friends stuff all the time, and if they double cross me and I have already said I would have given them the world, I will still give them what I implied that I would and THEN..I WOULD CUT THEM OFF. THEY WOULD NO LONGER BE FRIENDS.

In this world, I have learned absolutely, WE ARE JUDGED BY THE COMPANY WE KEEP. i suggest that you choose your friends more wisely in the future.

 

[dturner100]

I understand what you are saying about telling a breeder or not however, from all the dragons she has sent out, it seems the only ones dying are Shawns. I know Becky bought some from her and they are still thriving. I just remember the post that Becky posted and stated this. I am sure there are others but, I do not know if thats 100% the case.

Amandas shipping situation is subpar, at best but the problem I have is why is it that Shawns are only dragons dying and he is most likely the only one on a payment plan as well. These are the things that do not add up for me.

I would almost be that Amanda made a mistake and assumed that Shawn knew how to take care of dragons as well, so she probably didnt go over basic care with him. I know that a lot of times I assume people know what they are doing enough to get them by. However, I see that I should not be overlooking basic care anymore so I have learned something from this thread as well.

I can't say whether or not she went over the basic care with Shawn himself, but I can vouch for the fact that when Amanda shipped my dragon to me she was very descriptive before and after shipping on beardie husbandry. She also to this day gives me tips when needed as this is my first beardie.

 

[StrictlyExotics]

WE ARE JUDGED BY THE COMPANY WE KEEP.

And, because of this fact, my buying and selling habits have definitely been affected by this simple fact recently (by choice). I am far more particular whom I do business with now moreso then ever now.

 

[AndrewLiu]

Pretty crazy thread i just finished reading. Im wondering if anyone else noticed that Shawn keeps his Beardies in an outside day pen.

Well considering thats their nite tank from when he brings them in from their outside day pen!

Im no expert on Beardies, but aren't there fireflies in Iowa in the summer? Im pretty sure i read somewhere fireflies kill Beardies.

 

[Abish]

Pretty crazy thread i just finished reading. Im wondering if anyone else noticed that Shawn keeps his Beardies in an outside day pen.



Im no expert on Beardies, but aren't there fireflies in Iowa in the summer? Im pretty sure i read somewhere fireflies kill Beardies.

I'm pretty sure that statement was regarding the sulcatas that were in the tiny 'night cages' in the videos.