Bad Guy Elizabeth Minton - RIPOFF ARTIST

I responded to a "Wanted" ad from Elizabeth Minton on October 15th where she specified that she was looking for a pastel male...

I responded by PM (see below for screen grab of my response and her reply...

I got an email from her in response (see next post)...

Continued...

I got an email from her...

>---- Barbara Gomez <[email protected]> wrote:
>hi im Elizabeth on fauna classifieds. please send me pictures of him and >when was he hatched

I replied...

>>>>>> From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
>>>>>>To: Barbara Gomez <[email protected]>
>>>>>>Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 1:50
PM
>>>>>>Subject: Re: please send me pictures of the pastel for $125
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Here you go. He is bright and eating well. He also has a funky pattern. If you want him, please send a paypal payment to [email protected]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Dale
>>>>>>
>>>>>>

She then said she sent payment

>>>>>On Oct 15, 2012, at 5:08 PM, Barbara Gomez <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>ok payment sent. let me know if it goes through ok
>>>>>>________________________________

The paypal payment was sent:::

Gregory Smith sent you $125.00 USD
Transaction ID: 6AV955637T102123D
Dear Dale Christensen,
Just thought you'd like to know Gregory Smith sent you $125.00 USD.
Note from Gregory Smith: Payment for Male Pastel ball python C6-Pas-M2 from the photos you sent me

So I shipped the snake the next day and emailed her the tracking #.

>>________________________________
>> From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
>>To: Barbara Gomez <[email protected]>
>>Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 6:12 PM
>>Subject: Re: please send me pictures of the pastel for $125
>>
>>Here is the tracking #.
>>
>>FedEx Tracking Number: 799199916419
>>
>>Dale
>>

He was delivered on October 16th... and I got the following message from her...


---- Barbara Gomez <[email protected]> wrote:
> yes he is alive and doing great. hes alot brighter in person. im very pleased with him. thank you.


and she wrote on my BOI thread...

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=298209&highlight=dchristensen

I thought everything was great...
________________________________
From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
To: Barbara Gomez <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2012 10:22 AM
Subject: Re: please send me pictures of the pastel for $125

Hi,

I'm glad he is there safe and sound. Most of all I'm very happy that you are pleased with him, it is difficult to capture the true yellow/orange color on him in a picture.

Dale


Then the next day I get an email from PayPal...

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Bank Issued Payment Reversal
----------------------------------------------------------------------


Dear Dale Christensen,

Transaction date: Oct 15, 2012
Transaction amount: $125.00 USD
Buyer's email: [email protected]
Buyer's name: Gregory Smith
Your transaction ID: 6AV955637T102123D

Your buyer or your buyer's bank requested a payment reversal for the transaction
detailed above. Often times, bank reversals occur when a buyer or a buyer's bank
reports that the transaction was not authorized. Although we are required to
return the payment to the bank in these instances, we don't debit your account
if the transaction was covered under PayPal Seller Protection. Unfortunately,
this payment was not covered under PayPal Seller Protection, and it was deducted
from your PayPal balance.

If a transaction is eligible for PayPal Seller protection it will be marked as
"Eligible" or "Partially Eligible" on your Transaction Details page. To learn
more PayPal Seller Protection, click "Legal Agreements" at the bottom of any
PayPal webpage and then click "User Agreement".

We appreciate your business and are truly sorry for the problems you have
experienced with this transaction

Sincerely,
PayPal

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Maybe Greg did not know Elezabeth was using his account or that she was buying....has she responded to your request for payment and or explanation?

Continued...

So, I contacted her by email...

________________________________
From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
To: Barbara Gomez <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2012 6:31 PM
Subject: Re: please send me pictures of the pastel for $125

Ummmm,

I have a question. I just got a notice from paypal that the charges have been reversed. What is going on? I provided you the snake you asked for in a very timely manner and now I don't have the money for it. Please let me know what is up and when I will get the payment put back.

Thanks,
Dale

Notice that was the same date that Maria Smith registered her account!!!

I got the following response...
---- Barbara Gomez <[email protected]> wrote:
> I looked at my bank account online and it appears my cell phone payment as well as your payment for the pastel were returned to the bank and my check that i just cashed is no longer registering on my account. i will call in the morning and see whats going on. im so sorry for this. if i can do anything to right it please let me know. If i have to i will start a different account and send you payments that arnt linked to my bank so nothing can be returned or frozen.

Im on disability due to a work related accident where my legs were crushed that's why i had a limited spending limit.

So, here is where it stands now:
She responded at first a couple of times, then she stopped responding by email. I called her phone number, and it was disconnected. I tried to PM her on Fauna, and she is not accepting messages.

Then yesterday I noticed this post by Maria Smith wanting a Patel female... she was in the same area as Elizabeth and became suspicious..

At this point, I'm out a pastel male and shipping costs. I just want my money, and I want to make sure that no one else falls for her ruse.

I remember Elizabeth from all sorts of posts here, but THIS is something of a surprise. While I'm always disturbed by reports of scammers, I can't help wonder why people ignore discrepencies. If a person contacts me as one person, emails from an account with a different name on it, then uses a PayPal account with yet another name; you can bet that I'm wanting answers/explanations. If it is another person's paypal account, I require an email from that address confirming that they are purchasing the snake (or whatever) for the other person, and indicating that it is to be shipped to that person.
I'm sorry you are going through this...luckily it is a relatively cheap lesson, and it will save you from making more expensive mistakes in the future.

Now I have to go look up Elizabeth's other recent account name, and consider the possibilities of whether "Elizabeth Minton" is real

I started to question...

Harald,

I looked at the email and even though the name was different, it was the email address she had given = [email protected]

I was a little more nervous when I saw the paypal name different, but I have had a person send payment through their boyfriend's paypal account before for another snake.

At that point, I thought about it and it was only a $75 pastel male I was shipping instead of a very expensive snake and figured I'd go ahead...

I should have followed my gut when I saw that name difference... Oh well, live an learn I guess.

Better yet, if she will just send me a money order we can all be happy...

Also, can you send her a PM to let her know about this thread? She has me blocked.

--Dale

Definitely sounds like she is trying to scam you out of that snake.

Do you know if the address you mailed it to was the same address on the paypal? If so, I would take it through paypal and show them tracking info etc. and try to have them give the money back.

I knew it was a matter of time before this one popped up again.

There is no question that she now admittedly has the snake, and she didn't pay for it.

I'm all for having a change of heart and allowing someone back in who dropped the f bomb a few times too many. But unbanning someone who was banned for doing something shady is setting up people who don't know her history to be taken advantage of. No, fauna can't hold our hands, but hopefully you can see the logic.

She's used several different usernames with different real names and locations on different forums. Is it such a stretch to believe the email address she was emailing him on would have a different name on it?

FWIW, and though I despise having this thing see the light of day again, it's the same email address she used to contact me, proof here:
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176957

Elizabeth Minton is her real name. I was able to dig up an arrest record some time ago that traced her back to her, at that time, address.

And yes, this username was proven to be her:
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=359997

Always same MO. Looking for snake, but no money right now to buy snake.

Dale - she has disabled private messaging entirely, which makes the things pointed out in this thread look just that much more damning, IMO. She hasn't visited the site since 10/28.

Dale,

Go to your bank and tell them about this fraud. Before you go, print out this thread and anything Paypal sent you.
File a complaint:http://www.ncdoj.gov/getdoc/fdbee1c7-c2a9-4f67-91b2-bb50beea1c0a/2-2-12-File-a-Complaint.aspx

Even though this was not high dollar, money doesn't grow on trees, if this person has stopped communicating with you, and has blocked your emails, any thoughts that this might possibly be an innocent mistake of some kind are rapidly evaporating.

The three names would have definitely caused me to ask questions. Now "Gregory Smith" could come out and say he doesn't owe you anything since you didn't have any deal with him specifically. Always a bad idea to accept money from an account if you didn't talk to the account holder or someone with the same last name.

Sorry to hear this Dale, sounds like a bum deal for a stand up guy. You have documented things very well and not sure why Paypal wouldn't award you back your money since you have a shipped tracking number.

Thanks for the heads up on whoever "Elizabeth" is and good luck brother!!

Paypal...

won't refund the money to me because they say it was a bank reversal on the other end. I'm still trying with them but it is a slow process...

Thanks for the kind words Robert.

Harald, as for the question of why she hasn't been on the site since 10/28, that is when she stopped returning my messages. Also, I noted that she may have created the "Maria Smith" identity the day that paypal reversed on me in anticipation that I might post to this thread. She would have the other identity established and ready to go...

The claim is that he PayPal account owner didn't authorize the payment - that has nothing to do with whether it was shipped. If he didn't ship to the address on the PayPal account, and doesn't have an email from that account authorizing the charge, he doesn't have a leg to stand on.

That is what I don't like about Paypal. I've heard of this type of scam before and unfortunately she'll just drop off the face of the earth and assume another identity. I don't have any tips for you other than what others have suggested.
This is what I do when using Paypal and I think everyone should. I do not keep money in my Paypal account. As soon as it comes in I transfer it into a regular bank account. I will not ship anything until the money is in that bank account. This way they cannot do a payment reversal. I also let the purchaser know of this in advance. It takes a few days for it to transfer usually.

Good idea. Explain a little delay up front and you both win. Still much faster than a check or money order mailing and clearing.

They can still do the payment reversal, just not through PayPal (kind of like what happened in this case, if you read it). If PayPal tries to recover their money, and it isn't there, they can simply disable your account until you cover it.

Receipt of Payments; Risk of Reversal of Transactions; Collection of Funds you owe PayPal. When you receive a payment through the Service, unless you follow the steps necessary to qualify for our Seller Protection Policy described in Part VII of this User Agreement, you are not protected against a subsequent reversal of the transaction. In the event that the sender's transaction is reversed for any reason and you do not qualify for the Seller Protection Policy for that transaction, you will owe PayPal for the amount of the reversed transaction plus any fees imposed on PayPal as a result of the reversal. Examples of such a reversal include, but are not limited to, a credit card reversal by the sender of the payment, and a reversal of the transaction because the sender of the payment was using a stolen credit card or unauthorized bank account. PayPal will seek to recover the funds from you by debiting your PayPal balance and, if there are not sufficient funds in your PayPal balance, PayPal reserves the right to collect your debt to PayPal by any other legal means. If you open a Premier or Business Account after October 11, 2001, you authorize PayPal to debit your bank account linked to that PayPal account for the amount that you owe PayPal on transactions which were not covered by the Seller Protection Policy and which were not recoverable from your PayPal balance.

If you've connected your bank account to your Paypal account, Paypal just takes the funds from your bank account.

Basically what Lucille said, lol. Sorry, I used the Quick Reply and didn't see that before I posted.