Paid subscription plan?

Just for the record, I never said (at least I don't think I did) that the membership fee was going to be a toll both for everyone for everything on this site. It is geared up mostly (the $10 level) to be at least a minimal hurtle for people to meet in order to post on the BOI and some other selected forums. The discussion forums in the general areas would continue to be free for everyone.

One of the biggest complaints I have heard since day 1 with the BOI is that there is too much crap going on in there and too much abuse from people that are not who they say they are. I think it is just time to try to stop, or at least slow down dramatically, that sort of activity. I have thought on this long and hard, and there is really no other method that will begin to work in this direction.

So if even 1,000 people are willing to sign up for the privilege of posting on he BOI and those other selected forums, even that little bit of money coming in will help out around here.

I am not expecting to get rich from this site. Not at all. But I am getting rather tired of doing this for free. I am sorry that some people feel that this is too much of me to ask from them.....

Originally Posted by WebSlave

Just for the record, I never said (at least I don't think I did) that the membership fee was going to be a toll both for everyone for everything on this site. It is geared up mostly (the $10 level) to be at least a minimal hurtle for people to meet in order to post on the BOI and some other selected forums. The discussion forums in the general areas would continue to be free for everyone.

I think that the scenario predicted by Chris Raden is the most likely one - the BOI will effectively become useless because the majority of people simply will not pay to use it. Your userbase will drop off dramatically if everyone currently using the BOI is expected to ante up or leave. The only way I think you may be able to get around that and keep a large enough user base to prevent this outcome is to "grandfather" in all existing accounts at the most basic level and begin charging the setup fee only for new accounts.

One of the biggest complaints I have heard since day 1 with the BOI is that there is too much crap going on in there and too much abuse from people that are not who they say they are. I think it is just time to try to stop, or at least slow down dramatically, that sort of activity. I have thought on this long and hard, and there is really no other method that will begin to work in this direction.

I agree, but by solving this problem by some methods you may create even worse problems.

So if even 1,000 people are willing to sign up for the privilege of posting on the BOI and those other selected forums, even that little bit of money coming in will help out around here.

If only 1,000 people sign up to use the BOI, it will no longer be nearly as useful to anyone because it's just going to be those same 1,000 people talking to each other. A lot will get missed, and the BOI will simply no longer function as an effective weathervane for the herp business community.

I am not expecting to get rich from this site. Not at all. But I am getting rather tired of doing this for free. I am sorry that some people feel that this is too much of me to ask from them.....

Well, I'd give money to support this site, but the cold hard fact is that the typical casual user will never give money to use a web site because it is much too quick and easy to click over to one with similar content for free. I agree that this is horrendously unfair to you and that you should not be expected to permanently subsidize the community's Better Business Bureau. I do think that there are other ways to get revenue from the site that don't effectively hamstring and cripple the BOI, which is the site's main draw.

One vague, unformed idea I'm tossing out here is to modify the Reputation Points software to actually subsidize memberships. If sponsor level accounts paid, say, $10 extra into a voting power pot, they could chose to vote small increments of that money into the accounts of members whom they felt contributed useful or entertaining posts. So at the end of the year, members who had contributed enough in the way of positive helpful information to the board would get a free ride. To help balance the system, people could also use their money increments (say, ten cents or a quarter at a time) to vote against someone, taking away from their free ride total. The end result of a negative vote on a post would effectively be to pay Fauna twice, as it would take money away from the paid voting pot and also take money away from the offending member's free ride pot.

It's just a rough idea. Make of it what you want, or not. I think it could prove to be remarkably effective and addictive however. You can look at the Slashdot model for a good example of how community feedback rating works, but I suspect you probably have done so already.

I'd say to start do $35/yr for posting new threads in the classifieds, free to respond. That way those selling would have to pay and people wouldn't have to pay to shop, if they had to pay to shop they would go elsewhere. KS charges that much for just a few months, $35/yr is a deal.....especially as the site grows.

I also think the fine to return after an infraction should be $50+. BOI I think should always remain free, it's too valuable of a service to restrict. By this I mean if you charge people to inquire they just won't and those people may get burned because they didn't use the service.

Only 100 people have voted. I hope this site stays free, at least the chat boards. so many people come here for tips on care , breeding, and even emergencys. and just to talk to other who are interested in the same things and share storys and exchange information. chargeing for ads is a great idea becuse people are makeing money. If I started selling animals again I would gladly pay to post ads on this site. but chargeing for the discussion boards would leave alot of people with no where to go if their leopard gecko just laid some eggs or their snake wont eat. this site is much more then just the BOI.

Charging even a modest fee would certainly reduce the number of users, but it might improve the overall quality of the BOI. If you go that way though, you might consider allowing free access for folks needing to defend themselves in bad guy threads - although that would probably be an administrative nightmare and easily abused.

I am a relatively inexperiencd herper (and new to FC) and don't really have anything to contribute in the way of discussions. It still made sense to me though to make a small donation, because my last purchasing decision was made solely on vendor research in the BOI. Is there a way to help people think about it from this perspectve?

I agree with what was mentioned above concerning increasing the fines. If these are the folks who are causing a large part of your problem, why not make it more painful for them to be a problem?

Well after reading this whole thing, I am going to respond. I hope that my comments are taken as feedback not insults, as thats what they are meant to be.

Im not good at cutting and pasteing quotes, so Im just going to paraphrase best I can.

Rich you say you dont really care if the boi is taken as a drama or a serious resource. I for one feel a statement like that is dangerous. This board can and does pull weight. It can and does effect peoples business both in good and bad ways, as such you of all people should take it as seriously as possible. Im not saying you dont, but statements like that could lead people to believe otherwise.

Next from an ex advertisers point of view, I can tell you my reason for pulling advertising, but Im sure we both know it to well. Now imagine that scenario rolled over to other advertisers because they loose faith in the boi. I know I personally advertised here only to support what you were doing. I wanted to help keep the site free for other people, by paying a bit myself. Im sure other advertiser are also doing this. But if you make people pay to post on the boi, your effectively cencoring the boi to only thoose who find it in their intrest to pay to play. I personally think this is a bad idea, and hope that it doesnt happen.

In my experience the advertising here doesnt seem to pay in a tangible way. When I did post in the classifieds I wouldnt get a single responce. In all the years Ive posted here, Ive neve once sold a single animals to a person based on a add on this site. While in the same time Ive sold thousands of animals on ks with only classified adds. As such I dont see many people paying for the classifieds.

So this leaves you in a catch 22, and I assure you I feel for you. I can tell your stressed over this. Ive never seen you loose your cool as you did on Glenn on the forum before. What you said to him was a point worthy offence, and honestly I wish you would have been pointed. This leads back to the moderation issue that made me pull my advertising. This screams biased moderation to me, yet again. I understand its your site, but if you expect us to play by the rules, you also should.

This leads to another point, you claim the warning level was meant to keep people in line, not to reflect on their business. Well heres a perfect chance to put your money where you mouth is, Rich sir in my book you have one warning point. Now obviously your right the statement you said doesnt reflect you or your business as a bad guy, but the little red point may make people wonder. Well one wont, but 69 could. But now Im digressing, but I hope you see my point and PLEASE DONT TAKE OFFENCE IM JUST MAKEING A POINT.

I guess Tanith has had the best idea in my opinion if you TRUELY only want to weed out problems, and work on getting the site on stable ground. Grandfather ALL ACCOUNTS to basic, and start chargeing new people a small fee starting NOW. All new people will assume everyones always paid, and all old people will not have to feel as though the rugs been pulled. Then when a troll falls out of line, they need to pay the fine to keep their name, or pay to become a "new member". Either way you punish the bad guys without damageing the status quo to much.

Again Im not trying to start a flame war, just adding my two cents. I think the boi holds alot of value, but if left unchecked can become a useless mess.

It is pretty much the general consensus that if there was a basic charge to access the sit it would deter a lot of new peple from joining the ranks of the members.
What about if the was a "free period" of "trial period" for all new comers to the site maybe 30,60 or 90 days to let people get familiar with thwe site and see what a benefit it is to them. Most people after being here for a while would find it worth while to contribute in some way to become a member and keep the site going.
The idea is to get as many new people here as possible and to get them to stay and want to become members by giving a little to help support the site.
Paid classified is a good idea as well just not too much to scare the little guys away. Maybe 2% of the selling price or something of that nature.
the more people we get to come here the more people will buy from the classified which will bring in more and more sellers and advertisers.

Look for what its worth, if there is a yearly fee of the 35$ with full access to all on this site. selling ads, the boi, all this site has to offer .Just tell me where to send the money.the way I see it "THIS SITE" has saved me a alot more money then the $35 and maybe by this fee you may lose people IMHO so what. Some of the people here are great some should wither away ..This site is like a favorite radio station I have it tuned in all the time and if it cost me a couple of bucks a year to keep it so be it....in the long run I'll be saving. there is no such thing as free anymore in the long run you have to anty up. I may be 1 out of 16,000 but it has to start some where thank for time and Rich what ever you decide I'll stand up and be counted

I look at the polls here that show what people are willing to pay or how they'd like fees structured and I wonder how can people be so damned cheap? They whine or bitch and moan on the BOI, use the classifieds, or any other service this site has to offer but aren't willing to pay squat? I guess everyone wants something for nothing but IMHO the freeloaders should be ashamed of themselves. All I can say is send me a bill for $35 Rich. I love this site and I want in!

My vote goes also for the $35 (I voted long ago but did not post). It's kind of difficult to understand the logic behind spending hours on this site (minimum wage at around what $5.5 an hour? ), and not willing to pay less than a dime a day for the service it provides.

Just an opinion.