Bad Guy David Ferguson ( hdavidf309 ) Sold unhealthy animals as RTB and shipped improperly

I was hoping to never have to make a "Bad Guy" thread on here but here we go:

I purchased some crested gecko females from David Ferguson in July 2013. Here is the ad that he posted:

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=412419

When they arrived, not only were they not RTB (ready to breed) as advertised, they were unhealthy and may not ever be ready to breed. I was ok with them being too small to breed yet because he did tell me that before I received them. I wasn't in a hurry as I wasn't planning to breed them until next spring anyway.

3 of the 5 have FTS (floppy tail syndrome), one is pretty significant and the other two are relatively mild. All four of the females that had tails had wavy tails which can indicate a problems with lack of calcium caused by improper diet. One of them has a "sunken in" eye. I have repeatedly offered to show pictures to David but he insists that his geckos were all in perfect health before he shipped them out.

As for the shipping: I did not take pictures of this but I should have. The box had no labels indicating that it was fragile or that it had live animals inside so he was in violation of SYR terms. One side of the box did not have any insulation foam and the deli cups were all in the box sideways instead of stacked which was probably pretty uncomfortable for the geckos. One of the deli cups was resting right against the side of the box that had no insulation. He insists that SYR and Fedex are responsible for the way the boxes are packed and sent out, not the shipper...ugh.

Anyway, I feel that the very least he can do in this situation is a 50% refund since I received way less than 50% of the value I thought I was getting. Only 1/5 of the "RTB females" was actually healthy and in a condition that is 100% ok to breed in the future. The two with milder FTS may also be ok to breed in a year or two with special care if their wavy tails straighten out and they seem healthy. The one with the eye issue, the one with more significant FTS, and the one with more significant signs of MBD (wavy tail, swollen arm/hand, unable to climb well, strangely shaped spine) should never be bred.

He ignored all contact with me until I filed a dispute through Paypal. He only responds to me when I file a refund request and he denies the request every time. I feel that anyone else considering making a purchase from him should be aware of the way he ships, cares for his animals, and treats his customers. I will attach all correspondence as well as photos of the geckos.

Fauna PMs:

Hi David,

What would you do for a deal for all of them? I'm most interested in the first one pictured but I have time and space to take the whole group for the right price.
Have any of them been bred before?

Thanks,

-Samantha

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Peach bi-color has bred. al others are young.
I will take $500 + shipping for all (including patternless). That's 5 geckos for $500 (+ shipping). let me know. Thanks!
Dave

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I'm interested. Do you have weights on the ones that haven't been bred? I'd love a shipping quote to 04062. Also, do you have more photos of the one pictured second from the bottom? Her shape looks a little odd in that photo and I'm hoping it's just the pose. What have they been eating for a diet?

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haha....definitely just the pose. All Crested geckos feeding on CGD, fruit cocktail (treat I make once a month), and insects (mainly crickets). Weights for all are as follows:
Extreme cream/Harley - 30 grams
Peach/pink bi-color - 37 grams
Lavender fire w/ super dal spots - 23 grams
patternless - 23 grams
pinstripe - 27 grams

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Okay, so heres the thing - I have been toying with uploading pics on here and have not been able to get you a new pic of the pink/salmon girl yet. I wanted to "try again this morning" but to no avail. If I could please get your phone #, I can send you pics that way. ALSO, a lot of people interested in all of the girls, so please let me know if you want them or not. I have been holding them but cannot hold them after today. this is also the last day I can ship until next week. Please let me know where you're at and if you want them, ok? Thank you and please respond quick.
Dave

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Hi Dave, my number is 207-239-9646 to send the photos to. I won't be able to be very responsive until tonight unfortunately because I'm at work. If you can't wait that long and have to move on the next person, I understand. Can I get a shipping quote for 04062 please? Also, if I decided to just take the first one listed, what would you charge for her?
Thanks!
Samantha

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Okay, thanks Samantha. I really hope this is okay, but I will be texting from now on to let you know quotes and send pictures, ect. If you want to, feel free to contact me by tonight whether it be through text or calling, in regards to the geckos. I may be a bit busy, but I always have time for you. Hope this works out weather you get 1 or up to 5 and take care! thanks!
Dave

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Hi Dave,
I texted you back a little bit ago. If you're just busy, that's perfectly fine but I just wanted to send a quick message here in case you didn't receive my texts for some reason. I might not be online much for the rest of the evening but I'll be around to get back to you tomorrow if you get back to me tonight or tomorrow. Have a good night
-Samantha

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Hi Dave,
I just wanted to check in and make sure you're still all set to ship out the 5 geckos tomorrow evening. My forecast high for Wednesday has increased to 81 but the overnight low Tuesday night is 63 so I'm sure it will still be cool enough for them by the time they arrive in the morning. Fedex usually comes by my house around 9:30-10:00.
Talk to you soon,
-Samantha

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Yes, I am absolutely sending them tomorrow for ya! thanks again!
Dave

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I have sent many texts to you since yesterday with no response. I need to hear from you this evening or I will have to go to the BOI. I'd really rather just resolve this situation with you privately and get it over with rather than have to drag other people into it and make it a big thing. I think a 50% refund would be the least you could do.

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Paypal Correspondence:

From Seller - David Ferguson7/26/2013 10:32 EDT
I am denying your request for a $400 reimbursement the only claim truth behind your claim is they were advertised as RTB, which all were not. As for other claims they are based on a persons opinions and not fact. I never had the problems you are stating.

From Seller - David Ferguson7/26/2013 10:38 EDT
Pictures were send, re-clarification on which were ready to breed, and great customer service was provided. You had been aware of their appearance and had conversations regarding their weights before they were shipped off. I will only take this claim seriously if I see proven statements/documents that you get from an animal veterinarian that gets paid out of your pocket with no reimbursement from me whatsoever. At that point, if there are in fact problems then I will only give a partial (1/2) refund, since that is what you had requested via text message (not $400). Keep in contact only here from now on.

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"The claims are not based on opinion. Wavy tails, swollen limbs, and sunken eyes are not a matter of opinion. Those are facts and I have photos. The way that you shipped them was illegal and that's not a matter of opinion either, that is also fact. That shipment was not in compliance with the Lacey Act because there were no indications on the box stating that there were live animals inside, let alone what species.


The reason that I asked for $400 back is because 4 out of the 5 geckos are defective and not as described so it seemed reasonable to pay for only the one that is ok and for the shipping to receive her. I think that is more than reasonable on my part considering what a burden this is going to be to me, not to mention the money that I spent purchasing enclosures and supplies for them.

As for stating that you sent pictures so I knew what I was getting, that is false. I looked at the pictures and none of them show the issues that these geckos had. The angles of the photos do not show the wavy tails or floppy tail syndrome. There was no photo of the patternless girl so I could not see her deformed eye. There was one of the geckos (the "superdal") that I requested more photos of and even told you that I wanted more photos because she didn't look quite right in that photo. You did not send those additional photos and reassured me that it was "just the pose" and that she was perfectly healthy and normal. You also claim that you never had these problems with them but these are not issues the show up overnight so that is a lie on your part.

I would be happy to involve a vet for their sake but your terms are ridiculous. I think that if I pay for a vet out of my pocket and get something written from them that proves that these geckos are unhealthy, you owe me a full refund at the very least and ideally should also pay for some of the vet costs."
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"The claims are not based on opinion. Wavy tails, swollen limbs, and sunken eyes are not a matter of opinion. Those are facts and I have photos. The way that you shipped them was illegal and that's not a matter of opinion either, that is also fact. That shipment was not in compliance with the Lacey Act because there were no indications on the box stating that there were live animals inside, let alone what species.


The reason that I asked for $400 back is because 4 out of the 5 geckos are defective and not as described so it seemed reasonable to pay for only the one that is ok and for the shipping to receive her. I think that is more than reasonable on my part considering what a burden this is going to be to me, not to mention the money that I spent purchasing enclosures and supplies for them.

As for stating that you sent pictures so I knew what I was getting, that is false. I looked at the pictures and none of them show the issues that these geckos had. The angles of the photos do not show the wavy tails or floppy tail syndrome. There was no photo of the patternless girl so I could not see her deformed eye. There was one of the geckos (the "superdal") that I requested more photos of and even told you that I wanted more photos because she didn't look quite right in that photo. You did not send those additional photos and reassured me that it was "just the pose" and that she was perfectly healthy and normal. You also claim that you never had these problems with them but these are not issues the show up overnight so that is a lie on your part.

I would be happy to involve a vet for their sake but your terms are ridiculous. I think that if I pay for a vet out of my pocket and get something written from them that proves that these geckos are unhealthy, you owe me a full refund at the very least and ideally should also pay for some of the vet costs."
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"ShipYourReptiles does not inspect the packages and ship them off, the seller does. The Lacey Act absolutely does apply to you and everyone else that ships reptiles in this country. Here's a link to the info about it from the SYR site. The shipping part isn't really our issue here but it is important for you to know how to do it correctly.

http://www.shipyourreptiles.com/en/get_help/get_help_shipping_standards/#question-114

If you send me an email address to send the photos to, I would be happy to send them to you so you can see what I am talking about (the eye, swollen limb, floppy tail syndrome, etc. Without a vet diagnosis, I cannot say that they have MBD, I'm telling you that they have some of the obvious signs of it.

I did not receive the pictures you texted me, as I stated. I did at that time decide to trust you since you had at least attempted to send them and I figured you wouldn't if you were trying to hide something. I obviously realize that no one forced me to purchase these. I chose to purchase them and based on the information that I had from you, I thought that I was receiving 5 healthy, breedable females. The angles of the photos in the ad made the geckos look fine and none of the problems were visible there. Again, if you send me an email address to send photos too, I will show you photos of what I'm talking about.

After reading your last response on here, I no longer think you did this intentionally, I think it is complete lack of knowledge. It is still unacceptable and you still need to make it right somehow.

In the ad, you did mention that the patternless one was free with any purchase so I'll just drop that. Still, that leaves 3 of the 4 that I did pay for that have issues so a 3/4 refund would be fair. Even 1/2 would be acceptable to me at this point now that I realize you did all of this out of ignorance and not intentional malice. I think accepting a 50% refund is quite reasonable on my part, all things considered."

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**I do not have a copy of this one but last night (8/6/13) I sent him another refund request and reminded him that we had been waiting patiently with no response from him. I again asked for a way to send him the pictures**

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From Seller - David Ferguson8/7/2013 13:50 EDT
I have made clear the fact that I do not

feel it necessary to give a refund. I

would appreciate if you please just

drop this dispute so we can all

continue to live our lives without

inconvienience. I have denied refund.

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8/7/2013 14:44 EDT - Buyer: You have made it clear that you are ignorant and that you feel it was ok to screw me over. I am not going to drop it. I have calmly explained the problems to you repeatedly and you deny any possibility that you are wrong and just keep ignoring me hoping that I'll just disappear and leave you alone. I will not drop this until you make it right. I have asked for your email so that I can send you photos as proof and you're not interested in seeing it. I sent you a link to info proving that you are completely wrong about the shipping rules and laws and you have no response to that. You are a terrible seller and should not be in the reptile business.




-Samantha Harrison

Eye issue:



(note the wavy tail visible in the photo as well as differences between each eye)

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Wavy tail, strangely shaped spine, swollen arm/hand, mild FTS:





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Mild FTS, mildly wavy tail not visible in photo:

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Significant FTS, wavy tail (not visible in the photo). This 22.6 gram gecko laid 2 FERTILE eggs shortly after this!!

I remember this ad and was interested in the one second from the bottom. I too was worried about the way it was sitting. We have a tiger dal about the same color and my daughter took a liking to her. Had hoped she was just a chubbers. I am so sorry this happened to you. At least now they will be properly taken care of (trying to see something positive in such a horrible situation). Bad investment unfortunately, but you saved lives here.
Is there anything you can do for the girls? have never had to deal with FTS.
How was the paypal paid? bank account or credit card? Was asking because maybe you can file a dispute with them also. Guess it couldn't hurt.
Hope it all works out (fingers crossed). Please keep us posted!

Thank you Lisa. I am also trying to see the positive side of it. I am glad that they are in my care and will have the best possible chance of living healthy lives. I am glad that they didn't go to someone that wouldn't know better and would breed them in the condition that they are in.

I can keep the FTS from getting worse by providing appropriate enclosures with enough branches and hides so they won't sleep upside down on the glass. I have also been supplementing them with calcium since I got them which is the best thing to do for them. They are also all in separate enclosures now so I can monitor each one and make sure they are all getting their food.

We paid with the money that we already had in our Paypal account. After his last response today, we escalated the dispute to a claim so we will just have to wait and see what Paypal decides.

Seems like paypal usually will side against you in an animal transaction, from what I have seen, but I could be wrong?

Looking at the original ad, it does appear that this individual has a business, crappy reptile store or the like, since "crested gecko" is stuck to one of the exo-terras.

If this is the case then typical crappy reptile store that does not take care of animals properly.

I do not think anyone would do that at their home?

Perhaps this info will help with paypal?

I like credit cards only through them for animal transactions because if worse comes to worse my credit card company really does not care what pay pal has to say.

Only way you win a PayPal dispute with live animals is in the case of no-delivery. Did you offer to send the geckos back for a refund? Most breeders/dealers will not give a partial or total refund and just let you keep the animals. Paying vet bills has been brought up a lot in threads lately. This is just not usually done. Very few breeders/dealers are wealthy and cannot afford to let customers run up vet bills and have them pay for it. The industry standard is to send the unhealthy or unacceptable animal(s) back. That said, I would be unhappy, too. My point is just that customers cannot dictate their own terms when they are unhappy. You wouldn't expect that from Walmart or Kohl's would you?

I asked him a few times what he would do to make it right. I would have been happy to send them back for a refund in the beginning. At this point, I absolutely think keeping them and a partial refund is 100% fair as they are so far from what they were advertised as. Now that I have been caring for them, I'd really rather not send them back to a bad home. I am a small hobbyist breeder so having 5 breeder females actually turn into 4 rescues and one breeder female is a big deal as far as time, space, and money go.

I realize that the claim almost definitely won't go my way. It's not even about the money at this point, it's just the principle of it. He screwed me over and has no interest in fixing that. I just hope he'll realize that what he is doing is completely unacceptable and won't continue to do it to other people. I also hope that this thread ensures that other people will not be screwed over by him if he doesn't change his ways.

I wasn't trying to dictate my own terms. I asked him repeatedly what he would do to make it right. When he refused to communicate and come up with terms, I expressed what I thought would be reasonable. I am not dealing with Walmart or Kohl's but I'm sure they would deal with it a little bit better than this. They would not completely ignore an unhappy customer, they would allow a return with a refund. He simply wants me to just shut up and go away.

That's why I asked if you offered to send the animals back. He absolutely should be trying to make this right. But I'm sorry asking for a refund and demanding to keep the geckos IS dictating your own terms. If you decide now that you can't send them back to a bad home, that is on you. You are responsible for the vet bills and whatever else comes with that decision. You're right a department store would not completely ignore a customer, but next time you take something back, if you don't like their terms for refund, try demanding your own. See how far you get with that. Yes he should give you a refund if you send the animals back. Almost no one will give you a refund and let you keep the animals or reimburse you for vet bills. That's just reality.

treeboa said:

That's why I asked if you offered to send the animals back. He absolutely should be trying to make this right. But I'm sorry asking for a refund and demanding to keep the geckos IS dictating your own terms. If you decide now that you can't send them back to a bad home, that is on you. You are responsible for the vet bills and whatever else comes with that decision. You're right a department store would not completely ignore a customer, but next time you take something back, if you don't like their terms for refund, try demanding your own. See how far you get with that. Yes he should give you a refund if you send the animals back. Almost no one will give you a refund and let you keep the animals or reimburse you for vet bills. That's just reality.

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She asked him repeatedly what he would do to correct the situation and he choose to ignore her. I don't see what's wrong with someone then continuing to state what they believe is a fair conclusion given the fact the seller's choice of handling this is to pretend it isn't happening (aside from denying the claims). If he had told her that he'd refund if she shipped back and then she tried to get a partial refund I can see the issue but what else could she do aside from file a claim if he won't answer her?

Hopefully he does offer something. Crested Geckos are so easy to care for and there is no reason these animals should be in these conditions especially if he was labeling them as RTB.

Thank you Lauren.
Jeff, if you were the seller? What would you do?

Oh, and I was just reading through the post and realized that I left out one of his responses to me, sorry for any confusion. I will repost the one of mine that came right before it and the one that came after it and I will make his bold to help with any confusion.

Mine:
"The claims are not based on opinion. Wavy tails, swollen limbs, and sunken eyes are not a matter of opinion. Those are facts and I have photos. The way that you shipped them was illegal and that's not a matter of opinion either, that is also fact. That shipment was not in compliance with the Lacey Act because there were no indications on the box stating that there were live animals inside, let alone what species.


The reason that I asked for $400 back is because 4 out of the 5 geckos are defective and not as described so it seemed reasonable to pay for only the one that is ok and for the shipping to receive her. I think that is more than reasonable on my part considering what a burden this is going to be to me, not to mention the money that I spent purchasing enclosures and supplies for them.

As for stating that you sent pictures so I knew what I was getting, that is false. I looked at the pictures and none of them show the issues that these geckos had. The angles of the photos do not show the wavy tails or floppy tail syndrome. There was no photo of the patternless girl so I could not see her deformed eye. There was one of the geckos (the "superdal") that I requested more photos of and even told you that I wanted more photos because she didn't look quite right in that photo. You did not send those additional photos and reassured me that it was "just the pose" and that she was perfectly healthy and normal. You also claim that you never had these problems with them but these are not issues the show up overnight so that is a lie on your part.

I would be happy to involve a vet for their sake but your terms are ridiculous. I think that if I pay for a vet out of my pocket and get something written from them that proves that these geckos are unhealthy, you owe me a full refund at the very least and ideally should also pay for some of the vet costs."

His:

"Well, I used Ship Your Reptiles/Fedex to ship the animals, so if anything the burden falls on these companies since they are in charge of inspecting packages and shipping them off , and not me. In fact, the person who always helps me mentions to me that she is aware that I am shipping reptiles every time (but that's hearsay and you do not have to believe me). If you would like to file a claim against them, that's your prerogative. The reason I use Ship Your Reptiles for all of my shipments is because I am able to use their account to ship reptiles without having to worry about specifics and have the peace of mind that they will already have acquired all of the licenses and certificates needed to ship any animal, with the exception of venomous/dangerous animals. Their whole company is built on the idea of convenience. Furthermore, the last time I got animals, it was from a very well-known breeder/herpetologist and I got them the exact same way, same amount of geckos, in the same package. I literally mimicked his package, which I assure you had living animals when I got mine. If it was not packaged to your liking, I can apologize, but I had gotten them exactly the same way. The only difference is that I paid more to use Ship Your Reptiles, instead of the USPS service I received my package from. I assure you I have gotten several packages in the same condition (or worse), and I have rarely had an issue……and now that you seem to have an issue it makes me feel as though I have been taken advantage of as well. Regardless, none of this merits a refund of any sort. Just so you know, the Lacey Act pertains to animals that are being imported from other countries, and has no merit on shipments taking place in the US. I would also like to state that this (again) falls on Fedex/Ship Your Reptiles and you are more than welcome to start a claim against either company, should you choose to. In addition it is not mandatory to list what species an animal is, nor put

From Seller - David Ferguson7/26/2013 23:03 EDT
Enter mesnor put a description of the package. That is an option to the sender (me, in this case) and is a precaution to have the shipper be extra careful.

As far as the "sunken eye gecko", I honestly am unaware of how you see a sunken eye, as that was not the gecko's condition to my knowledge. If that is what you are stating is true, then (contrary to what you think) that truly is not an opinion we share. Furthermore, that gecko was advertised as free with your purchase, so I do not understand why you would even complain about that particular gecko. Also, the geckos that you say have floppy tail syndrome have been observed many times on branches and on the glass of the enclosures I have here and I have never seen any sort of flopping of the tail at all. To cover the accusation of the one that supposedly has a swollen limb – again, I am unaware of such a gecko, and I assure you that swollen limbs have never been observed in any of my geckos. Last accusations have to do with the subject of MBD (Metabolic Bone Disease) which is something I will argue, since I would disagree. Since you are not a veterinary doctor, nor have you taken any to a vet…..then there is no way for you to rule out such a thing without the proper tests/exams. You may go ahead with the procedures and costs that come along with going to a vet in order to prove me wrong, but it will definitely come out of your pocket and I will have no part in the bills/costs that you may make for yourself. You will find that you are wrong in my opinion, but if you would like to do that I won't stop you. To finalize this paragraph, everything I have said is simply a matter of opinion as well, just like you have your opinions when diagnosing animals when you are not a doctor. They are opinions until proven otherwise.

sage

From Seller - David Ferguson7/26/2013 23:03 EDT
Enter messagePurchasing the supplies/enclosure was your prerogative and that does not reflect on my animals, so is irrelevant . To reiterate I would like to also add that when you say that the animals will cost you money in the long run, or that 4 out of the 5 animals were no good, that is a matter of opinion and would have to be proven by a doctor to be deemed true, or untrue. If everyone based trades/sales on opinion alone, it would be a crazy reptile world (more than what it's like now). On another note – I did send pictures of the ones you bought in their current condition (which I believe to be fine), and so you definitely saw dated pictures for that day (or perhaps the previous day) of the exact animals you had gotten. If it was a case of MBD, would you not have seen that in the pictures? You would have most definitely. You state that you had not gotten the texts with pictures of the gecko you were concerned about, but I actually have kept all texts and you stated that you changed your mind and the gecko was probably fine (and she was). I admit I sent pictures of the wrong gecko originally prior to this due to a misunderstanding on which gecko you wanted to see, but that's no biggie. Furthermore, no one forced you to buy these and so you could have asked for more pictures and you could have asked more questions. You talk about how it was the angles of the pictures, yet you requested to not get more photos in the end. Also you paid in full without asking additional questions or getting the pictures you needed, which I did not force you to do either. As far as there being no picture of the pattern less girl, you didn't ask….and she was free anyway.

To touch on the vet cost thing and you saying I should help, give a full refund, and/or do anything for you at all, and that my terms are "ridiculous"….well, that's your opinion and I do not share the same views. Thus, the reason I think that you are asking me to do things that I am not obligated to do. You wan

From Seller - David Ferguson7/26/2013 23:04 EDT
Enter message. You want to prove that they are unhappy? Then, you pay. Simple as that. Thanks for reading."

Mine:

"ShipYourReptiles does not inspect the packages and ship them off, the seller does. The Lacey Act absolutely does apply to you and everyone else that ships reptiles in this country. Here's a link to the info about it from the SYR site. The shipping part isn't really our issue here but it is important for you to know how to do it correctly.

http://www.shipyourreptiles.com/en/g.../#question-114

If you send me an email address to send the photos to, I would be happy to send them to you so you can see what I am talking about (the eye, swollen limb, floppy tail syndrome, etc. Without a vet diagnosis, I cannot say that they have MBD, I'm telling you that they have some of the obvious signs of it.

I did not receive the pictures you texted me, as I stated. I did at that time decide to trust you since you had at least attempted to send them and I figured you wouldn't if you were trying to hide something. I obviously realize that no one forced me to purchase these. I chose to purchase them and based on the information that I had from you, I thought that I was receiving 5 healthy, breedable females. The angles of the photos in the ad made the geckos look fine and none of the problems were visible there. Again, if you send me an email address to send photos too, I will show you photos of what I'm talking about.

After reading your last response on here, I no longer think you did this intentionally, I think it is complete lack of knowledge. It is still unacceptable and you still need to make it right somehow.

In the ad, you did mention that the patternless one was free with any purchase so I'll just drop that. Still, that leaves 3 of the 4 that I did pay for that have issues so a 3/4 refund would be fair. Even 1/2 would be acceptable to me at this point now that I realize you did all of this out of ignorance and not intentional malice. I think accepting a 50% refund is quite reasonable on my part, all things considered."



Sorry I forgot to include that part in the first post, hopefully this makes it less confusing.

Samantha12986 said:

The two with milder FTS may also be ok to breed in a year or two with special care if their wavy tails straighten out and they seem healthy. The one with the eye issue, the one with more significant FTS, and the one with more significant signs of MBD (wavy tail, swollen arm/hand, unable to climb well, strangely shaped spine) should never be bred.

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Samantha, are you going to have a vet check them out? From your descriptions, it sounds as if they might need some treatment.

Samantha12986 said:

He insists that SYR and Fedex are responsible for the way the boxes are packed and sent out, not the shipper..

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Samantha, I suggest you contact SYR and send them a link to this thread.

Not saying your wrong but a vet check sure would help your cause with pay pal. I hope all works out for you and the gecko's.

His replies are just ridiculous. He has no business selling or shipping reptiles. I hope they thrive in your care. And definitely contact syr.

I notified SYR, just got this email as a reply:

Hi Lucille,

Thank you for making us aware of this thread. We will be taking the proper steps to help ensure this does not happen again.

As far as labeling, it is up to the shipper to properly package and label their boxes as we never see the box, FedEx will not alter the box either. If proper standards and guidelines are not met then we do have consequences that include cancellation of an account.

Thanks again for letting us know about this.

Let us know if we can help with anything else.

Thanks,

Andy
ShipYourReptiles.com
303-730-2125
Ext. 1

We do make a lot of effort to provide proper packaging and labeling information for each and every shipper. Each shipper also agrees to meet our SYR Shipping Standards and Terms of Service (which meet or exceed the FedEx TOS) during the booking process for each shipment.

There is a legal requirement to properly label a live reptile shipment, and that falls on the shipper, in this case, David.

I will make sure that David is very clear on these issues, but in this instance, I think it is a case of willful ignorance and passing the buck.

From a quick read of the thread, the simplest and best solution for David would be to take the animals in question back and just refund the customer in full. I guarantee it is not going to be worth the hassle, headache, argument and reputational damage here, when you could address it quickly, simply and professionally.

From the customer standpoint, personally I wouldn't accept a partial refund for low quality animals. I would look to return the shipment for a full refund.

I believe I saw late arrival concerns for the package mentioned, and shipping refunds. FedEx does not offer any refunds for late arrival or DOAs. It is specifically prohibited in the FedEx Live Animal Certification contract.

ShipYourReptiles does offer On-Time and Live Arrival Insurance to cover those very issues (unique to the SYR service) but for the package in question, insurance was waived, so there is no refund available for any late delivery.

I sent him a pm. Here is the reply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kristi23
You should really address the thread about you there.


Address it how? I realize that Samantha is trying to make me look bad, but honestly she has manipulated the situation to make me look like the bad guy, and conveniently left out facts and messages. If she would want a refund and actually wanted to return them (shipping paid by her), then I would be happy to work with her (on that day or the next), however at this point it is literally over 3 weeks after she had gotten the geckos, and judging from those pictures- doesn't look like she is doing well. They looked great leaving my house, now they look poor. that should not fall on me. Furthermore, she is buying geckos as is when she buys online. I sent pictures of the animals sent and the pictures were dated for that day. I really do not care that she has her opinnions about me/my animals and they are all negative. I have great animals and this is literally the only hiccup I have ever come across. If response is needed, please be nice in the response since you clearly side with Samantha on this.

He never offered for me to return them, he completely cut off contact with me. I waited a couple of days before even doing a refund request on Paypal and that was after he ignored many texts and one message on here. I did not leave out any messages except possibly accidentally (like that ridiculous reply of his that I accidentally left out of the first post).

The timestamps on the photos that I posted show that some photos were taken the day they arrived and some the next day. They are receiving great care at my house, I am not the one that put them in this condition.

If you look at his current ad for the two crested males, you can see that the second one has a very slight tail wave even in his photo.

Also, I am not the only one that has had problems with him, I have asked the other person to come forward but I'm not sure if she will or not.

Kristi, thank you for contacting him and for sharing his response with us.
Lucille, thank you for notifying SYR, I hadn't thought of that and I'm really glad that they are going to do something about it.

It's pretty clear to me that the animal second from the bottom in the ad does not look right. The first one also looks skinny at the base of the tail.

I agree the best thing is to send them back...but the SELLER should pay shipping since he sold sickly animals. I don't see asking for a partial refund a bad solution either, but obviously both parties would have to agree on the amount.

Kristi, here is part of the reply you received:

"Furthermore, she is buying geckos as is when she buys online."


A search of his name here (hdavidf309) shows a number of ads. To me, the above response does not build confidence in the quality of any critters he might be selling.