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mitch behm aka behmfamily aka mitchell s. behm illegally selling snakes

W

Wilomn

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http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98135

The above link is to an ad placed by mitch here on this site to sell rubber boas in the state of Ca. This is illegal. Anyone with the intelligence mitch has claimed to have would have to know this.

He is not the type of person I would recommend doing business with. He has sold substandard Emerald Tree Boas, is constantly trying to lowball sellers, claims to have done all sorts of wonderful things with various species of snakes, espcially saharan sand boas (which he never could get eating and is most if not all of his specimens cheaply before they die) and just generally thinks that because he has money to throw around he can do as he pleases.

I am also curious as to the origins of these snakes since they cannot be sold or PURCHASED in the state of Ca. and he states that these two are C.B., which, depending on how hardcore you are can be interpreted as EITHER Captive Bred OR Captive Born. Generally cbb is used to cover Captive Bred and Born, but since he's not the brightest bulb in the pack, I'm not sure what he meant here.

At any rate, STAY AWAY from mitch behm. He's bad news through and through.
 
Wes,

Has mitchy been sent a link to this thread? I really do want to hear what he has to say about this. I'll bet he claims to be housing them out of state (cough...:censored:...cough).

Dennis, thanks for locking the thread with the ad. I imagine that California authorities might be interested in seeing it.
 
Wes, I've never done business in CA, could you cite the regulation/law specifically prohibiting the sale of rubber boas?

Also, could you be more specific about your allegations regarding the ETBs and Sand Boas? I'm curious about what you mean by lowballing, and making wonderous claims.

Thanks.
 
Wow Mitch, with all the nonsense you give me I guess the mighty Mitch isnt perfect as well. See Mitch, maybe I should play wisdom lord now and give you "mighty fine and irritating" advice you tend to throw out to me for making a learing mistake. But im not like that so will not play games. Just now that big Mitch made a mistake, who will guide the reptile community and everyone involved???

Anthony Allis
[email protected]
 
monkeywrench133 said:
Wes, I've never done business in CA, could you cite the regulation/law specifically prohibiting the sale of rubber boas?

Also, could you be more specific about your allegations regarding the ETBs and Sand Boas? I'm curious about what you mean by lowballing, and making wonderous claims.

Thanks.
Click to expand...
It’s a fact. There are no exceptions for the sale rubber boas like other California natives.
There are no allowances under the native captive propagation permit either.
 
The attached document highlights pertinent CA regulations.

Mitch:

Looks like you got some splanin' to do. :NoNo:
 

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From: "Behm Family" <[email protected]> Add to Address Book Add Mobile Alert
To: "wes pollock" <[email protected]>
Subject: Rubber Boas
Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2007 15:03:56 -0700
Wes,

Thank you for educating me. Unfortunately, I was unaware of the restriction. I'm sure that you will take great pleasure in crusifying me on the BOI. Enjoy!

Thanks,

Mitch

I had that sitting in my inbox this afternoon.

mitch, you're an idiot. I have no desire to do anything to you. I have you on ignore.

However, being as how you are so close to perfect, in your own eyes if no one elses, I can't say I don't enjoy it when you put your big ol foot in your big ol mouth.

I STILL wouldn't sell to you. I STILL wouldn't buy from you.

UNLIKE you though, for me, once you're out of site, you're out of mind.

I just don't like you and you know why. I'd say it's pretty well deserved and not likely to change.

Bye bye mitchy.
 
b) Non-commercial Propagation. The department may authorize
the possession and propagation of no more than three species
and no more than 30 individuals in the aggregate including
progeny under a native reptile and amphibian propagation permit.
Within the overall limit of 30 individuals, the department may authorize
no more than four of any one species to be taken from the
wild. Individuals may be taken only by the methods authorized by
sections 41.5 and 42.5. Native reptiles and amphibians possessed
pursuant to this subsection may not be purchased or sold.
(c) Propagation and Possession for Commercial Purposes.
Native reptiles may not be sold, possessed, transported, imported,
exported or propagated for commercial purposes, except as provided
in Section 40(e) and except as follows:
(1) Subspecies Authorized.Only the following subspecies may
be propagated, imported, exported, or possessed for commercial
purposes, or purchased or sold pursuant to the provisions of this
section:
(A) California common kingsnake (Lampropeltis getulus
californiae);
(B) California subspecies of the gopher snake (Pituophis
melanoleucus): Great Basin gopher snake (Pituophis melanoleucus
deserticola), Pacific gopher snake (Pituophis melanoleucus
catenifer), San Diego gopher snake (Pituophis melanoleucus
annectens), and Sonora gopher snake (Pituophis melanoleucus
affinis);
(C) California subspecies of the rosy boa (Lichanura trivirgata):
Coastal rosy boa (Lichanura trivirgata roseofusca) and Desert rosy
boa (Lichanura trivirgata gracia).
(2) Bill of Sale. All animals sold pursuant to these regulations
must be accompanied by a numbered bill of sale which shall contain
the name and permit number of the permittee, the complete
scientific name of each native reptile sold and the name and address
of the buyer. A copy of the bill of sale shall be retained by the
buyer.
(d) Limits. Except as otherwise authorized, no person shall
take or possess native reptiles and amphibians taken from the wild
in excess of the bag and possession limits specified in sections

________________________________________________________

Also Mitch, Just an FYI.

You are not allowed to have more than two. If you breed them you have 45 days to give away your babies. Can I have two? :)
 
To all,

I give no quarter and ask for none. My email to Wes says it all. I bought them from an established breeder and never considered that there were any restrictions.

Scott - Thanks for the Regs.
AJ - You still know what you did.
Dennis - Sorry to disappoint you.

I will not respond again to this thread. I will monitor it.

Mitch
 
Behmfamily said:
To all,

I give no quarter and ask for none. My email to Wes says it all. I bought them from an established breeder and never considered that there were any restrictions.

Scott - Thanks for the Regs.
AJ - You still know what you did.
Dennis - Sorry to disappoint you.

I will not respond again to this thread. I will monitor it.

Mitch
Click to expand...
Of course I was joking. On a serious note, you should really be familiar with the regulations. Technically, you can only "gift" them to someone else. You can't trade them either.
 
Behmfamily said:
To all,

I give no quarter and ask for none. My email to Wes says it all. I bought them from an established breeder and never considered that there were any restrictions.

Scott - Thanks for the Regs.
AJ - You still know what you did.
Dennis - Sorry to disappoint you.

I will not respond again to this thread. I will monitor it.

Mitch
Click to expand...
OK, so you're a criminal and you admit it. Ignorance is no excuse, as you know.

Next!
 
In this day and age, when you are talking about a law that is so entrenched that people all over the country and world have known about it for many years and somebody in that particular state does not, it is my instinct to think that it may be an attempt to entrap people into breaking the law. I do not have any idea who Mitch is but that kind of behavior is just very suspect in my book at this point in the game.

But Jim, he did not break the law if he did not sell them. They are not illegal to possess.
 
evansnakes said:
But Jim, he did not break the law if he did not sell them. They are not illegal to possess.
Click to expand...

40.General Provisions Relating To Native Reptiles and Amphibians

(a) General prohibition it is unlawfull to capture, collect, intentionally kill or injure, posses, purchase, propagate, sell, transport, import or export any native reptile or amphibian, or part thereof, except as provided in this chapter.

Technically he's already admitted to breaking the law.
 
I'll tell you I wish it were that easy to pull up reptile law here in CT. I have tried to find out the specific laws for years to no avail. I even had animal law look into it and they couldnt find anything worthwhile. The DEP here once had a list, but it is next to impossible to get ahold of it. I had a friend get a bunch of animals seized by the DEP that she took in as rescues, including a Sulcata. Their reasoning was that if that Sulcata got out it would harm the local plantlife and kill off our local species. I would love to know how a Sulcata could survive up here when it is near or below freezing for so many months out of the year!!! The problem here is that the people that make the laws know nothing about these animals. According to the list I did see years ago(which changes annually) even the Aussie water pythons I had were illegal here. I also heard every single reptile requires a permit, even an iguana or corn snake or ball python if it was purchased after 2003. I have also heard rumours that CT followed NY and we arent allowed to have anything worth keeping anymore. Of course the pet stores still sell all these animals(sulcatas included), yet they never get busted, instead they shake down a rescue running on its own money. Sad. I know this is a bit off topic, but point being perhaps he didnt know, but from what it seems you guys all dug up so much so fast, it couldnt be too hard. To continue my off topic post, if anyone knows anything about CT for sure, not speculation, please let me know where to find it!!!!!! Thanks, and have a great week, Dan M.
 
evansnakes said:
But Jim, he did not break the law if he did not sell them. They are not illegal to possess.
Click to expand...
The attempted sale is illegal. Attempting to commit an illegal act is illegal in itself.
 
I bought them from an established breeder and never considered that there were any restrictions.
Click to expand...

They are illegal to purchase, as well as illegal to sell. :shootfoot
 
I don't think anyone can argue the legality after seeing the regs, but does anyone think Mitch would risk getting busted so that he could sell rubber boas? I don't think the financial benefit of selling them would be enough to risk it? Now if he was trying to move ploughshare torts, tuataras, fiji iguanas, etc, I could see someone might risk it due to the almighty $$$ involved. But for these?

You may think of him as stupid for not knowing this was illegal, but stupid enough to risk a run in with law enforcement? Quite a leap.
 
I live in CA, and I did not know it was illegal to sell rubber boas. I can very easily see how maybe Mitch did not know it was illegal to buy or sell rubber boas. I could very easily see how it could have been me (or any of a number of other small time locals around here) could be dumb enough unwittingly make a stupid, illegal error such as this .

That's really hard for me to say. Not to admit that I may not know everything~ but to suggest maybe Mitch should not be crucified after the holier than thou, nasty, intolerant, mean spirited attitude Mitch so proudly displayed to many (including me). He might have made a legitimate mistake~ and I actually hope he does not get in trouble with Law Enforcement if it was a legitimate mistake~ BUT he surely will get a little "what comes around goes around" out of this.
 
Here's my take on it.

Had mitchy not been such an insufferable ass, I would have pm'd him, as I've done for others in the past, and let him know he was breaking a law.

This thread is due ENTIRELY to mitchy's attitude, the way he treated people I consider friends, like Cheryl, and, in no small part, the fact that he annoyed me personally.
 
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