Bad Guy 2balls is a thief

[roach_75]

This guy claiming to be Roger Burn responded to an ad i had for normals .
He ended up wanting to trade for other balls . We set up a time to ship
everything looked to be up to par until the night we were
suppose to ship , after i shipped i couldnt get ahold of the guy to see if he
shipped or not . Which he didnt , after trying to track him down for
three days i found out he give me a decoy address to ship to
finally after three days of text and threatening to get the police involved . sS
saturday mornikng comes around and a women claiming to be this guys mother
asked me if i had sent a package to them . I told her the address i sent the package to and it was her neighbor that was in fl for the winter . So we agreed that they would ship all of the animals back accept for one normal that they had already bred and 1.2 sentinels .
and in return they would send me the rest of my balls and the and part of the balls from the original trade . We both agreed . The original package i sent out was 2.3 sentinels , six breeder normals , pastel vanilla , and a desert enchi . I recieved everything of mine back
except for one normal breeder , 1.2 sentinels , and a desert enchi .
When i called back to let them know that they didnt send all of my stuff back
the dad said that all of the snakes i sent to them had been returned to me
which was not the case . I tried to explain this to them and they were positive the balls were not there . They also sent me a fmale pastel 2012 i guess trying to pass it off
as a tiger dont know ? So i figured that was that and i got screwed until
I saw the tiger on an add on fauna he has a really cool head pattern so it was easy to identify . so i contact the guy who had him posted he told me that he had done a trade with these people for this tiger and he thaught it was strange because they sent it through usps and it took 2 days to get to him so he hadnt shipped tp them yet
. Darren said that he was going to help me try to get my other snakes back as well
so finally i got tim which is the supposed father to text me gave him darrens number told him that his son was trading the snake that he had stole from me. His answer after talking to darrren was sounds like a personal prob the snakes we have are ours . This guys suppose to be a police officer . I contacted darren today and he said he was going to go ahead and do the trade . so maybe i am screwed .lol excuse my penmanship

 

[roach_75]

This guy claiming to be Roger Burn responded to an ad i had for normals .
He ended up wanting to trade for other balls . We set up a time to ship
everything looked to be up to par until the night we were
suppose to ship , after i shipped i couldnt get ahold of the guy to see if he
shipped or not . Which he didnt , after trying to track him down for
three days i found out he give me a decoy address to ship to
finally after three days of text and threatening to get the police involved . sS
saturday mornikng comes around and a women claiming to be this guys mother
asked me if i had sent a package to them . I told her the address i sent the package to and it was her neighbor that was in fl for the winter . So we agreed that they would ship all of the animals back accept for one normal that they had already bred and 1.2 sentinels .
and in return they would send me the rest of my balls and the and part of the balls from the original trade . We both agreed . The original package i sent out was 2.3 sentinels , six breeder normals , pastel vanilla , and a desert enchi . I recieved everything of mine back
except for one normal breeder , 1.2 sentinels , and a desert enchi .
When i called back to let them know that they didnt send all of my stuff back
the dad said that all of the snakes i sent to them had been returned to me
which was not the case . I tried to explain this to them and they were positive the balls were not there . They also sent me a fmale pastel 2012 i guess trying to pass it off
as a tiger dont know ? So i figured that was that and i got screwed until
I saw the tiger on an add on fauna he has a really cool head pattern so it was easy to identify . so i contact the guy who had him posted he told me that he had done a trade with these people for this tiger and he thaught it was strange because they sent it through usps and it took 2 days to get to him so he hadnt shipped tp them yet
. Darren said that he was going to help me try to get my other snakes back as well
so finally i got tim which is the supposed father to text me gave him darrens number told him that his son was trading the snake that he had stole from me. His answer after talking to darrren was sounds like a personal prob the snakes we have are ours . This guys suppose to be a police officer . I contacted darren today and he said he was going to go ahead and do the trade . so maybe i am screwed .lol excuse my penmanship

I also got the name Jacob burn who really knows just be aware of these guys

 

[Bci Joe]

I can attest to this. The Tiger in question originally came from me - I traded it to Richard a while back.
About two weeks ago I get an email from a 'Paxton Chang' asking if I wanted to trade some of my balls for a Tiger. I said sure. He sent me a pic and I sent him pics and we worked out a deal. I was to trade him a 2012 Russo male, Cinnamon male, and a breeder Het Red Axanthic male for this Tiger.
I mentioned how i'd never heard of him and directed him to my good guy list and he agreed to ship first. He was set to ship to me last Monday.

After not receiving snakes on Tuesday, I started texting him, 'What happened? why didn't you ship?' to which I received no response.
The next day I texted, 'Hello?' and he replied, 'Hello?' back. This tells me he deleted my text the day before and now didn't know who it was or what it was about.
I responded again, 'What happened? why didn't you ship?' to which I received no response.

I may have emailed him too, I will have to check my emails.

SO I just let it go, beause I have experienced alot of this lately.. people going back on their word, backing out of deals, no pays, etc.

Fast forward a couple days and I see Darren Cannao posted the same snake on FB reptile pages for sale. At this point, I still didn't put two and two together.

That same day I speak with Richard, because he is a friend and is local, and we currently have some deals going on. He explains what happened to him, and it all clicked and came together in an instant!!!

I had spoken to Darren before, so I contact him and he calls me. I tell him what happened. He AGREES that it did seem fishy with this deal. I think the name he got was Jacob Cheng. He said they worked out a trade and the kid shipped first to Darren, but that they really didn't know what they were doing and the Mom actually had to ship. She used USPS (violation of the Lacey Act) and shipped the snake which got lost and arrived 2 days later to Darren.

Darren seemed to be totally on board with helping us out and getting Richard his snakes back. He asked me what else did Richard send him. I told him about the Sentinels. Darren said he would ask Jacob if he wanted to trade more snakes, get him to send him the snakes and that was that. MY UNDERSTANDING was that he would then NOT send anything to 'Jacob' and that we would then come out with the story of what happened. I had this understanding because Darren told me, I haven't yet sent him back anything in trade. I connected Darren with Richard and left it in their hands.
Darren later told me that 'Jacob' said he didn't have anything else.

So then during this time, two other people that live in Ohio, where 'Jacob' is from, contacted me asking if I had a Tiger for sale. ?!?!

Another person contacts me and asks me if I ws the guy with the stolen snakes. He actually placed a post on FB about it. I replied by PM and said it is my friend and we are working to get them back so to please remove the posts. Here is what he replied.
10:15pm
Shawn Morrison

It's deleted. He sold me a 1500g male albino as a female. Won't respond to my texts or calls. I told other on my other page and a friend told me that he has someone's snakes and how it happened. She said she lost your number or she would contact you. Do you know who has them?
___
Shawn proceeds to tell me that one guy is names 'Briar Jones' and the older, red headed guy is names 'John Jones', gives me their phone number, WHICH MATCHES UP, and their city, truck make and model.

I asked Shawn if he was offered more snakes, to which he replied, "He was offering green burms, baby retics, and female bee, along with a few others to me, but Jessica Bigham told me about someone's pastel champagne and pastel sugar. Are those yours?"

To which I replied no, nor Richards.

I passed this info along to Richard AND Darren. I sat back and figured Darren and Richard would work it out.

I then speak to Richard today and asked him what happened, and he told me Darren decided to not get involved and go through with the trade with this guy. I was FLOORED.

I then contacted Darren through FB and here are my msgs to him.

---

Today
1:49pm
Joe Rollo

Bro.. what happened?!??!! I'm not here to jump on you, and Richard did not tell me to say anything, but I heard you are not returning the snake AND continuing to trade with those thiefs.. i'm schocked.. I thought you were all about helping out and doing the right thing..

You are obviously free to do what you want but this is a tight nit community and we help each other. Richard and I are posting about this to help and warn others and get these guys out of this business, and we have to post all the facts, and it is just not going to look good.

That's no threat or anything, I have NO problem with you, just letting you know what's happening.. it is what it is.. Hope everything works out for you.

3:15pm
Darren Cannao

Joe,

3:27pm
Darren Cannao

Joe...I understand the situation and I feel terrible for Richard. But how am I supposed work this? I executed a trade with Paxton and he completed his end of the deal now I have to complete my end...this is a moral dilemma...I honestly feel that the tiger is Richard's but I did the trade with no knowledge of their deal! How can I not hold up my end of the deal? I've put this off as long as I can...I told Richard if he gave Paxton my # then I wouldn't be able to postpone any longer if he told me to ship my snakes and he did tell me to ship my snakes! Joe, this is a fu(?ed situation to be in, I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't! I also told Richard to start a BOI on fauna on Friday so I would have a leg to stand on and be able to delay it longer but it wasn't done. And I had no idea of the deal gone wrong had I known I never would have done any business with him but now I'm stuck looking like a douche to one or the other...I have to hold up my end of the deal or I'm no better than any other scammer out there. I hope you understand this situation I'm in.

3:50pm
Joe Rollo

I totally understand, but for me, i've been doing this 19 years with a flawless reputation because I look at the big picture, what's right for the customer, including ALL future customers, and the community as a whole, all of this leading to my reputation. NOT one single deal. In my opinion, you are concerned with upsetting one person you said you admitted to knowing is a thief, meaning you believe Richard and I. But in turn, you are muddying up your name and reputation when people find out that you are basically helping a scammer. To me this is really simple. This is what i've done in the past and why i'm still around. Richard just had his building lost to a fire and MANY valuable ball pythons, plus he has I think 6 kids, a wife, and a full time job. He has to pay to be able to get back on Fauna and I don't blame him for not doing it so quickly. Plus he's totally new at this too, not like some of us that would've posted about it day 1. Again i'm not trying to judge you but this is a really simple decision, in my opinion and in my expreience. It is what it is man.

3:59pm
Darren Cannao

Then the only way for me to remove myself from this whole thing is to send Paxton the tiger back and let Richard pursue it further. Other than that Richard can be assured I still have the tiger.

4:00pm
Joe Rollo

let me put it this way, you cannot put any doubt in to the minds of your potential future customers and the reptile community at whole. going through with this will let them know that you helped him, and in their minds, you might as well be in on it, and without thousands of breeders/dealers out there, why take a chance? we are not always the most reasonable people! lol.. I know it was a tough spot to be in, but the bigger picture is what is by far more important here FOR YOU.

4:01pm
Joe Rollo

No dude because again you are feeding the problem.. you are giving it back to the thief! Dude I hope you really change your opinions about this because this is not good.. both your thoughts/actions were to help the bad guy and NOT the good guy or the reptile community..

see what i mean?

i'm out.. because again this has nothing to do with me

just that we spoke and I thought I would let you know how I feel.

----

and that's that. I feel bad to have Darren involved, and I don't want to hurt him or his business in anyway, but it is important that everything get out and these thiefs be exposed for who they are SO THEY CAN NOT CONTINUE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF PEOPLE LIKE THIS!

I will go and look through my emails for my exchanges with 'Paxton/Jacob'

 

[Bci Joe]

These are my email exchanges with Paxton Cheng, which he later gave me the name Jacob Cheng.

Re: Male tiger‏
1/07/13
R
Paxton Cheng

Add to contacts
To joe rollo
Looks good !

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 7, 2013, at 12:15 AM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

sorry for the delay. my camera screen broke so I can't focus well or see what i'm doing! these pics are dark but you can see him ok. much lighter and washed out in person


Subject: Re: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 21:36:21 -0500
To: [email protected]

Hey sorry I haven't gotten back with you , haven't checked my email in a couple of days. And did you get pics of the cinnamon?

Sent from my iPod
Paxton Cheng

Add to contacts
To joe rollo
Ok sorry , I was jw

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 6, 2013, at 9:47 PM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

no thanks. I sell pins for $100, and the het ghost part for me is nothing really..


Subject: Re: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 21:42:41 -0500
To: [email protected]

Hey would you concider in stead of trading my tiger for your cinny russo and het red , do my tiger and a 500 gram male pin 100%het ghost, for your male pied and cinny ? If not its cool just looking back at your ad and sawing had a pied. Really needing a pied for my het female. But it's cool if you don't wanna

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 4, 2013, at 11:49 PM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

and no nothing wrong withmine, all are perfect. russo and cinny are on live sm-med mice and het red was on f/t rats but now on live. he did breed earlier this year but i took him off because have alot better males to use.

Subject: Re: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 16:07:52 -0500
To: [email protected]

Ok , full address is 46 west jersey st Johnstown Ohio 43031 my name is jacob cheng my name on fauna is 2balls. I will ship on Monday , what is your address . Absolutely nothing wrong with him great feeder on live or f/t mice call me anytime 740 973 4792
Is their anything wrong with yours? All good feeders? Feeding on what? Thanks !

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 4, 2013, at 3:56 PM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

Ok, I would need you to ship first. You can find my good guy thread on fauna BOI, goes back 10 years. PLease provide your complete address and phone # and I will do that same. thanks

What was his weight? is he eating well, mice or rats, and is there ANYthing wrong with him at all?




Subject: Re: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 13:34:49 -0500
To: [email protected]

Ok , then it's a deal the russo het red and cinny

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 4, 2013, at 1:15 PM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

the russo, cinny, het red and pewter? $350 which is price for pewter.

i'm giving you more than I would pay for the tiger with the first three animals, but I would like to move them so i'm doing an even trade. pewter is reg price, but i'm actually paying alot more in shipping because of the weight of these guys.. box will be about 5 pounds instead of 1 pound like yours.

Subject: Re: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 13:01:51 -0500
To: [email protected]

Those are nice, how much extra would you want to throw in the pewter?

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 4, 2013, at 12:45 PM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

mocha

Subject: Re: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 12:44:13 -0500
To: [email protected]

Can I see pics of the mocha ?

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 4, 2013, at 11:32 AM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

I can give you the russo, cinny and het red for him.

Subject: Re: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 02:16:21 -0500
To: [email protected]

Sorry ment to include that in the pic , I'm located I Columbus oh , I got him on a trade with a guy in Colombus I have his number if needed to speek to him. And what were you thinking?

Sent from my iPod

On Jan 4, 2013, at 2:09 AM, joe rollo <[email protected]> wrote:

thanks. where are you located? who did he come from? and what did you want in trade?


Subject: Male tiger
From: [email protected]
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 02:07:51 -0500
To: [email protected]

 

[WebSlave]

Sorry, but I am confused here. I see the following names, which all seem to be implying they might be the same person:

• Paxton Cheng
• Jacob Cheng
• Roger Burn
• Jacob Burn

I ran a scan on the site for IP matches and came up with the following who all share one or more IP addresses:

• Paxton Cheng - ptcheng
• Jacob po cheng - 2balls
• timothy byrne - timothy123
• jermiah ali wheatly - wheatlyjermiah

All are listed as being in Johnstown, Ohio.

The member name "2balls" has been banned for using a false name in his profile, as all indications are that the real name he uses is actually "Paxton Cheng", and not "Jacob po cheng" as he has listed.

But where did the names "Roger Burn" and "Jacob Burn" come into play? If those names were used in association with the above mentioned accounts here, did anyone READ my warning about KNOWING who you are dealing with and reporting false registrations? -> http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=371710

 

[Bci Joe]

I can only speak for myself.

When I was contacted by this person, he did not reveal his fauna account name, nor did I ask, since he agreed to ship first. So I was unaware of these false name/registration issues, and the entire fiasco at the time.

Yes, upon my investigations after finding out what happened, it appears it is 2 young brothers using fake names AND it appears their mom and dad are helping them out.

Yes they are out of Johnstown Ohio.

 

[Bci Joe]

So I just checked out each of those 4 profiles and 2 out of 4 joined within the last week, 1 in december, and 1 in november, and each says they heard about the site through a friend or brother..

 

[WebSlave]

I see. I am going to ban all the above mentioned accounts EXCEPT for the "ptcheng" account as being likely used for the purpose of scamming others by using false names in their profiles.

My point of bringing this up is that I believe everyone should INSIST on some sort of identification from whoever it is that they are doing deals with. Look for inconsistencies if they have an account here. If the name and/or location they give does not match what is in their profile, then consider that as a BIG red flag on the field. That is why those fields are mandatory during registration. It gives you some sort of yardstick to compare what someone is telling you against. No matter what reason someone may give you for using a false name of false location, fact of the matter is that you have already caught them in a LIE. So what else are they lying about? Perhaps the REASON for their lie?

If you have ANY doubts, get them resolved to your satisfaction or just walk away from the deal. Never be rushed into a deal, and never let what you WANT to hear lead you into losing money or animals.

So just a word to the wise..... The registration requirements of this site are here to try to help YOU.

Sorry about the soapbox aspect of this post.

 

[dcannao]

How was I to respond? There were no warnings or BOI's about this guy prior to this one. We agreed on a trade, he shipped first. I postponed as long as I could AND even offered Joe and Richard my cancellation of the trade and I'd ship the tiger back to Ohio to which they said no! I was not involved in that deal, I delayed my shipping as long as possible giving them time to come up with a solution but didn't. I felt compelled to hold up my end of the trade, I'm not judge and jury. Had there been a BOI then I never would have traded to begin with! And after "Paxton Cheng" called me he said Richard didn't realize he had 2 tigers, one was Richard's that he shipped back and one was his that he shipped to me. How do I argue that when I know no one involved on either side?

 

[Durante]

How was I to respond? There were no warnings or BOI's about this guy prior to this one. We agreed on a trade, he shipped first. I postponed as long as I could AND even offered Joe and Richard my cancellation of the trade and I'd ship the tiger back to Ohio to which they said no! I was not involved in that deal, I delayed my shipping as long as possible giving them time to come up with a solution but didn't. I felt compelled to hold up my end of the trade, I'm not judge and jury. Had there been a BOI then I never would have traded to begin with! And after "Paxton Cheng" called me he said Richard didn't realize he had 2 tigers, one was Richard's that he shipped back and one was his that he shipped to me. How do I argue that when I know no one involved on either side?

Darren, I'm sure most would agree you some how ended up in a pretty crappy spot. Is the Tiger your selling the same snake in question here?

 

[Lucille]

How was I to respond? There were no warnings or BOI's about this guy prior to this one. We agreed on a trade, he shipped first. I postponed as long as I could AND even offered Joe and Richard my cancellation of the trade and I'd ship the tiger back to Ohio to which they said no! I was not involved in that deal, I delayed my shipping as long as possible giving them time to come up with a solution but didn't. I felt compelled to hold up my end of the trade, I'm not judge and jury. Had there been a BOI then I never would have traded to begin with! And after "Paxton Cheng" called me he said Richard didn't realize he had 2 tigers, one was Richard's that he shipped back and one was his that he shipped to me. How do I argue that when I know no one involved on either side?

Joe,

3:27pm
Darren Cannao

Joe...I understand the situation and I feel terrible for Richard. But how am I supposed work this? I executed a trade with Paxton and he completed his end of the deal now I have to complete my end...this is a moral dilemma...I honestly feel that the tiger is Richard's

I can understand your dilemma. But if you honestly suspect that the person shipping something to you has no rights to it, I'm just suggesting to you that it might be a solution in the future for you make known your apprehensions and simply stop the transaction until you know more, so you are not trafficking in what might be stolen property.

I understand you are in a tough spot, and that if someone has already shipped to you, it does not look good if you delay your side. But I also think that if you
honestly feel there are property questions, and say so, I do not think anyone would jump on you for holding off until you had some proof.

I'm not jumping on you whatsoever, I'm just offering some thoughts for the future for anyone finding themselves in a similar situation.

 

[dcannao]

Yes it is and I'm going to sell him so I'm not a part of this debacle any longer.

 

[dcannao]

I can understand your dilemma. But if you honestly suspect that the person shipping something to you has no rights to it, I'm just suggesting to you that it might be a solution in the future for you make known your apprehensions and simply stop the transaction until you know more, so you are not trafficking in what might be stolen property.

I understand you are in a tough spot, and that if someone has already shipped to you, it does not look good if you delay your side. But I also think that if you
honestly feel there are property questions, and say so, I do not think anyone would jump on you for holding off until you had some proof.

I'm not jumping on you whatsoever, I'm just offering some thoughts for the future for anyone finding themselves in a similar situation.

Lucille, I completely understand your idea and held off as long as possible, even told Joe and Richard that I would send the tiger back to Ohio and let them hash it out to which there was a resounding NO. Richard also gave "Paxton" my name and # after I told Richard that if Paxton told me to just complete the trade or send him his tiger back I would have to do it, and that's what Paxton did!
Yes, after reading the inquiries from the moderator, I would not have shipped but this is playing Monday Morning Quarterback, no one was privy to this until after the fact. It's a messed up situation and one that I do not wish on anyone.
And the same as Joe, I was not contacted through fauna from Paxton so I didn't even think to check him and he shipped first and even if I searched him on fauna there was nothing until this!

 

[Lucille]

Darren I am totally not criticizing you. You had a tough choice and you did the best you knew how. My post was for the future, and for those who find themselves in a similar unenviable position.

 

[Otter_23]

Wether you wanted to be involved or not you were. In the end you helped a thief launder stolen snakes. In my opinion you had a chance to make it right the only problem was it was too much effort on your end so you took the easy way out.

 

[Focal]

Yes it is and I'm going to sell him so I'm not a part of this debacle any longer.

Sorry if I misunderstood this fragmented thread, but you traded? You currently have the stolen snake in your possession? If that's the case, I would personally return it because if it is stolen property, you are now aware of this. I wouldn't be so quick to think your hands are washed because you can very well face legal action.

 

[dcannao]

And because nothing was done earlier and because I have to take one word over another after speaking to both parties I'm to blame? Be realistic, this could just open the door for other scams and stop the pet trade, he said she said. Maybe next time someone has a deal they regret they'll just say the animal was stolen! How simple is that? Maybe a BOI should've been posted from the start and I wouldn't be in this discussion!

 

[Lucille]

I'm to blame?

You had a difficult decision. However, you must look forward because it is your next step that may carry serious blame.

Sorry if I misunderstood this fragmented thread, but you traded? You currently have the stolen snake in your possession? If that's the case, I would personally return it because if it is stolen property, you are now aware of this. I wouldn't be so quick to think your hands are washed because you can very well face legal action.

I definitely would agree that selling that snake now might well be considered trafficking.
If one receives a stolen item, one must return it to the rightful owner, not receiving compensation, but one has a right against whoever sent the stolen item.
As long as he returns the snake to the rightful owner now I do not think he will face actions for trafficking.

 

[dcannao]

Lucille, you make a valid point so I will not sell the tiger I will keep him and feed and raise him. When legal action is taken against paxton and it is revealed by authorities, and I don't mean the "authorities" of fauna, I will send the snake to Richard! I have only Richard saying it was stolen and Paxton saying it wasn't.

 

[radera5]

What I know is if I knew I had someones snake, it would be getting returned to the rightful owner. Darren, you would be out nothing! Am I correct? You still have not shipped this person anything! Correct?
If you are well aware of who's snake this really is, I would be getting it back to them without question.

What are you worried about? Are you worried that you will look bad to a scammer? A thief? Who cares what this thief thinks of you! All eyes are on you at this point, and you can do the right thing...or you can sell the snake!...or KEEP the snake! OR give the snake back to the thief!

Return the snake to Richard and be done with it.