Bad Guy Adam Wysocki - No response

[kerrek]

So because your friend was unqualified or unable to ship its ok to keep their money abbreviated sell their snakes that they'd paid for to somebody else? But he's still a good guy.

"Abbreviated" should be "and" phone spell corrector got me again.

 

[jglass38]

So because your friend was unqualified or unable to ship its ok to keep their money abbreviated sell their snakes that they'd paid for to somebody else? But he's still a good guy.

What I get from the story (and I don't know the inside details because I don't care and haven't asked) is that he received money for the snakes and for some reason wasn't able to ship for an extended period of time. The money was spent (whether you believe it to be right or wrong, that is what happens in business) on medical bills and trying to stay alive in a bad reptile market. When it was agreed that he would repay the debt rather than continue trying to ship the snakes, he tried to sell them locally. Due to the economic downturn they didn't have the value they had before thus payment has been delayed. None of this makes him a bad guy. Whether you want to believe him to be one or not is your prerogative.

 

[jglass38]

Ok, then the debts should have been reported when the business closed its doors.



Andrew & David, I would strongly suggest you get an attorney involved being that 8 Ball was in fact an LLC. This will be much more difficult to deal with then if it were a sole proprietorship. I got taken for $1,500 by a client who closed his LLC (and subsequently opened another shortly after with a new name, our government amazes me) and I simply wrote it off as it wasn't worth the aggravation. Being that what you two are owed is over four times that, I would get legal consultation and go from there. I would try to find a lawyer down in Maryland where he is, I imagine that would make it much easier.

Good luck with everything. This is going to be a real mess.

Reported to who? The IRS? You and I don't know his financial business. Maybe they were. It doesn't change the facts.

 

[TripleMoonsExotic]

Reported to who? The IRS? You and I don't know his financial business. Maybe they were. It doesn't change the facts.

From what I understood, for the company to file bankruptcy all debts must be reported to the court and they then decide how to divide liquidation of assets up between the creditors. You can't just close down an LLC and go about your day.

A lawyer familiar with LLC law would be better able to talk to these two about the specifics and what they need to do.

 

[jglass38]

From what I understood, for the company to file bankruptcy all debts must be reported to the court and they then decide how to divide liquidation of assets up between the creditors. You can't just close down an LLC and go about your day.

A lawyer familiar with LLC law would be better able to talk to these two about the specifics and what they need to do.

I agree this is an issue for lawyers, not reptile forums.

 

[david1]

David, I'm sorry that this happened to you, but I'm glad you finally came forward. Not all of us are defending Adam's behavior, so please have faith in dealing with the in the future US.

I'm not sure if this will apply to overseas, but IC3 is a good place to start when reporting internet fraud. http://www.ic3.gov

TripleMoonExotic
Thanks for your kind words and info that you have supplied . NB- Over the past few years I have built up good business relationships with a couple of business's from the states and I have not had any hassles ! I will not let one bad experience spoil these relationships !!!

 

[cobraman1]

I agree this is an issue for lawyers, not reptile forums.

I think its still an issue for this forum. The guy is a thief, plane and simple. People need to know this and that is what this forum is for. If he was just " down on his luck" he could still log on to his email and let the people he owes what's going on. Plus he is still selling at shows, correct? I would never buy from him or you to be honest, just because it doesn't seem to bother you that he owes so much and wasn't made it right.

 

[david1]

You probably should look up the definition of fraud. A business deal gone bad where a guy runs out of money and can't pay back a debt doesn't constitute fraud. Maybe everyone here can dial down the rhetoric.

I see this as a good guy (and I know this because I am one of his true friends, not someone who was his friend because he had some cool snakes) who had some issues and now does not have the means to pay back some people as fast as they would like him to. My advice would be, treat this as a company that has gone out of business and filed bankruptcy. If it is in your best interest, then use whatever legal means necessary to recoup your money. Otherwise, drop the bullshit and let these threads die. Adam doesn't need to come to some meaningless Internet forum to plead his case to a bunch of people whose opinions he (and most others) couldn't give less of a crap about.

With all due respect I think that your advice sucks !! The general public (International) need to know what he has done !! I would hate for anyone else to lose their hard earned cash !! I cannot believe that you would refer to what has happened here as "bullshit" , the world would be a very sad place if everyone reasoned like you !! What Adam has done here is not right man - How do you explain the fact that he can afford to go to all the Hamm show's ? (And others ) - If Adam had just communicated with us none of this would be happening right now - Even if he admitted that he did not have the cash and he could only pay me in a few months time - I would have understood and I would not have had any expectations !!

 

[jglass38]

I think its still an issue for this forum. The guy is a thief, plane and simple. People need to know this and that is what this forum is for. If he was just " down on his luck" he could still log on to his email and let the people he owes what's going on. Plus he is still selling at shows, correct? I would never buy from him or you to be honest, just because it doesn't seem to bother you that he owes so much and wasn't made it right.

I couldn't care less what you think or whether you would buy from me (not that I am selling anything).

 

[jglass38]

With all due respect I think that your advice sucks !! The general public (International) need to know what he has done !! I would hate for anyone else to lose their hard earned cash !! I cannot believe that you would refer to what has happened here as "bullshit" , the world would be a very sad place if everyone reasoned like you !! What Adam has done here is not right man - How do you explain the fact that he can afford to go to all the Hamm show's ? (And others ) - If Adam had just communicated with us none of this would be happening right now - Even if he admitted that he did not have the cash and he could only pay me in a few months time - I would have understood and I would not have had any expectations !!

I guess that is why they came up with that old saying about opinions and what they are like and who has them.

 

[JudyC]

I guess that is why they came up with that old saying about opinions and what they are like and who has them.

Way to go Jamie...just smack around a guy that Adam owes a thousand-plus dollars to and treat him like he's dirt under your shoe.

It wasn't all that long ago when you'd be all over a guy for not paying his debts like white on rice. You and Adam both held each other up on vaunted pedestals of integrity. But now that the tables have turned...now that neither of you is interested in continuing (apparently) your business of selling animals to the herping community...all of that means nothing? Suddenly it's no big deal and folks should just get over it???

Adam has been a beloved influence in my herp-related world for many years...and while you and I may not have always gotten along well, I did always respect your integrity and willingness to go the extra mile to do right by your customers. But this current attitude and behavior toward former customers is shameful. Shameful!

Is this Adam's attitude as well? I don't know. Because he won't come here to discuss it. All we have to go on is how YOU represent him, since you've chosen to do so here. And how he appears to behave himself at various herp shows that he is still attending.....and his utter lack of taking responsibility for his debts by at least communicating with those he owes money to. It seriously breaks my heart to see him fall this way. But there is simply no excuse for it.

If this were simply a temporary blip that lasted a month or two or three...maybe folks would understand. But this has been going on for YEARS....and the situation shows no sign of improving and there is no indication at all that Adam actually has any interest in making things right with these people.

So you go ahead and try to defend him or whatever it is you think you're doing here. But I'm telling you now....coming from someone that has long held both Adam and you in very high regard....you're not doing either yourself or him any favors.

It breaks my heart....seriously.

 

[jglass38]

Way to go Jamie...just smack around a guy that Adam owes a thousand-plus dollars to and treat him like he's dirt under your shoe.

It wasn't all that long ago when you'd be all over a guy for not paying his debts like white on rice. You and Adam both held each other up on vaunted pedestals of integrity. But now that the tables have turned...now that neither of you is interested in continuing (apparently) your business of selling animals to the herping community...all of that means nothing? Suddenly it's no big deal and folks should just get over it???

Adam has been a beloved influence in my herp-related world for many years...and while you and I may not have always gotten along well, I did always respect your integrity and willingness to go the extra mile to do right by your customers. But this current attitude and behavior toward former customers is shameful. Shameful!

Is this Adam's attitude as well? I don't know. Because he won't come here to discuss it. All we have to go on is how YOU represent him, since you've chosen to do so here. And how he appears to behave himself at various herp shows that he is still attending.....and his utter lack of taking responsibility for his debts by at least communicating with those he owes money to. It seriously breaks my heart to see him fall this way. But there is simply no excuse for it.

If this were simply a temporary blip that lasted a month or two or three...maybe folks would understand. But this has been going on for YEARS....and the situation shows no sign of improving and there is no indication at all that Adam actually has any interest in making things right with these people.

So you go ahead and try to defend him or whatever it is you think you're doing here. But I'm telling you now....coming from someone that has long held both Adam and you in very high regard....you're not doing either yourself or him any favors.

It breaks my heart....seriously.

Judy,

Let's drop the high and mighty act for a minute. Please. Adam has said that he is no longer in the business and at this point the need for it to be endlessly debated on a message board is through. Adam is no longer producing animals and has no intention of ever being part of this industry again from what I know. At this point, the wronged individuals can either take legal measures or not. I never once said I agree with Adam's handling of the situation. In fact, I completely disagree with how things have been handled from the start and have said that multiple times. There it is underlined and in bold. Hopefully everyone can read and comprehend it. Life happens and knowing him as I do, if he could do anything financially to repay the debt, he would.

I would like to address the vaunted pedestals of integrity. I don't have a clue what that means and hopefully you can explain it to me.

Jamie

 

[JudyC]

Judy,

Let's drop the high and mighty act for a minute. Please. Adam has said that he is no longer in the business and at this point the need for it to be endlessly debated on a message board is through. Adam is no longer producing animals and has no intention of ever being part of this industry again from what I know. At this point, the wronged individuals can either take legal measures or not. I never once said I agree with Adam's handling of the situation. In fact, I completely disagree with how things have been handled from the start and have said that multiple times. There it is underlined and in bold. Hopefully everyone can read and comprehend it. Life happens and knowing him as I do, if he could do anything financially to repay the debt, he would.

I would like to address the vaunted pedestals of integrity. I don't have a clue what that means and hopefully you can explain it to me.

Jamie

I see.....so in years past, when you were wolf-packing with the best of them to try and get the deadbeats to accept responsibility for their actions....it was ok back then to put on "a high and might act"....but now it's just dumb?

For years, Adam would talk about how his reputation and his character were the most important things to him...how he'd never...ever...cheat anyone or misrepresent an animal or undercut his customers...or spend money that wasn't his to spend yet. I could probably dig up countless threads where he lectures about how to properly run a business...to avoid these very issues he has found himself in now.

And in those same years, you're right there backing him up....and all "high and mighty" here on the BOI and even at my site...lashing out at anyone who didn't live up to your standards of integrity.

So to see you come here now and try to make it all go away by saying none of this matters is just....wrong. Sorry if forums like this are no longer relevant in YOUR life...but that doesn't make them irrelevant for everyone else. INCLUDING the people who are simply trying everything they can to get Adam to accept responsibility.

 

[jglass38]

I see.....so in years past, when you were wolf-packing with the best of them to try and get the deadbeats to accept responsibility for their actions....it was ok back then to put on "a high and might act"....but now it's just dumb?

For years, Adam would talk about how his reputation and his character were the most important things to him...how he'd never...ever...cheat anyone or misrepresent an animal or undercut his customers...or spend money that wasn't his to spend yet. I could probably dig up countless threads where he lectures about how to properly run a business...to avoid these very issues he has found himself in now.

And in those same years, you're right there backing him up....and all "high and mighty" here on the BOI and even at my site...lashing out at anyone who didn't live up to your standards of integrity.

So to see you come here now and try to make it all go away by saying none of this matters is just....wrong. Sorry if forums like this are no longer relevant in YOUR life...but that doesn't make them irrelevant for everyone else. INCLUDING the people who are simply trying everything they can to get Adam to accept responsibility.

Judy,

Let me clue you into something. You run an Internet message board. In the grand scheme of life, it means exactly zero. Please don't delude yourself into thinking that it is anything more than what it is. You aren't curing cancer over there.

Once again, life happens. You and some of your denizens seem to have their underpants all in a wad because Adam didn't confide in you or treat your relationship with him as anything more than what it was, the staff of an Internet message board that he frequented.

Apparently I wasn't clear enough when I said that from the start I have made it clear that I disagree with how Adam handled this and hope that when he has the means, he will make things right. But if you think I am going to lump him in with the filth that I have taken to task over the years, people who have sold sick animals, shipped empty boxes, etc, then you are out of your mind.

Hope this helps.

Jamie

 

[JudyC]

Judy,

Let me clue you into something. You run an Internet message board. In the grand scheme of life, it means exactly zero. Please don't delude yourself into thinking that it is anything more than what it is. You aren't curing cancer over there.

Once again, life happens. You and some of your denizens seem to have their underpants all in a wad because Adam didn't confide in you or treat your relationship with him as anything more than what it was, the staff of an Internet message board that he frequented.

Apparently I wasn't clear enough when I said that from the start I have made it clear that I disagree with how Adam handled this and hope that when he has the means, he will make things right. But if you think I am going to lump him in with the filth that I have taken to task over the years, people who have sold sick animals, shipped empty boxes, etc, then you are out of your mind.

Hope this helps.

Jamie

You're the one seriously deluded thinking you can read any of that drivel into what I've typed. But this isn't about you and it isn't about me, so I'm done arguing with you. I've made my point and stand by it. People will read whatever they wish out of the exchange.

 

[jglass38]

You're the one seriously deluded thinking you can read any of that drivel into what I've typed. But this isn't about you and it isn't about me, so I'm done arguing with you. I've made my point and stand by it. People will read whatever they wish out of the exchange.

Hit a little close to home? It's ok. I completely understand. Brings me right back to the point about opinions that got you all riled up.

 

[SERPENTS DEN]

Adam has the means to pay back his debts but instead would rather use the money he stolen for other means.

I wonder just how much money Adam will scam from people with his new venture in NatPet? I could imagine quite a bit since it involves not just reptiles but all animals; opening the doors to many good hearted but sometimes naive people donating money for the benefit of animals.

 

[jglass38]

Adam has the means to pay back his debts but instead would rather use the money he stolen for other means.

I wonder just how much money Adam will scam from people with his new venture in NatPet? I could imagine quite a bit since it involves not just reptiles but all animals; opening the doors to many good hearted but sometimes naive people donating money for the benefit of animals.

Those are some bold statements.

1. How do you know what his financial situation is?
2. As far as I am aware, Adam is no longer involved with NatPet. Do you have some proof he has stolen money from a charitable organization?
3. Is it your criminal past that makes you so knowledgeable?

 

[Amelanistic Orca]

Jamie; not sure if you're male or female, so; I'll keep this short and simple... Without name callin ya, as I'd love to do; go back reread the thread and come to a conclusion of what everybody may/must think of both ya'll at this point.. Cut, dry, simple... Think about your next post; you're sounding like a fool; appalled that you're user date is that long with an attitude like this; no wonder ya'll is out the door... C yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

 

[jglass38]

Jamie; not sure if you're male or female, so; I'll keep this short and simple... Without name callin ya, as I'd love to do; go back reread the thread and come to a conclusion of what everybody may/must think of both ya'll at this point.. Cut, dry, simple... Think about your next post; you're sounding like a fool; appalled that you're user date is that long with an attitude like this; no wonder ya'll is out the door... C yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

Unfortunately, I don't speak whatever language that was written in but please feel free to tell me what I have said that is untrue. By now you must realize that I don't care in the slightest what you or anyone else thinks about me. My true friends, the ones that exist outside of a message board are the ones I am concerned with.